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Music Remastered

Discussion in 'Sonic 2 HD (Archive)' started by Athelstone, Apr 24, 2008.

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  1. ICEknight

    ICEknight

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    First try making a faithful version, please. Then, the remixes.
     
  2. SFtheWolf

    SFtheWolf

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    Remixing music from a number of Genesis Sonic games
    That's the thing, how do you define faithful? My Death Egg Zone has percussion that differs pretty drastically from the original and the end of the second verse is quite new, but I consider it faithful to the sound and atmosphere of the original. There's really no way to purely "remaster" this music in the literal sense and have it sound decent.

    Personally I think the "if Sonic 2 was made today" policy is a good one. I'm trying to follow the formula of the more traditional style tracks in recent Sonic games. Take Windy Hill for example: theme, variation, extension. The Sonic 3 stages all had variations on the original theme in the second act too. There's precedent for the bridge sections as well on the official Sonic and Knuckles remix album (terrible as it is). Return to the Toxic Caves is the best example of all I think. It's a downright remix, but I think it would be right at home in an updated version of Spinball.
     
  3. SFtheWolf

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  4. Sounds very nice, but shouldn't the melody stand out more from the electric guitar accompaniment? It is hard to hear it at times.
     
  5. SFtheWolf

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    It is, that was intentional however. I always found the melody to Death Egg kind of ear piercing and associated the bassy riff with the stage more. I'll keep that in mind and nudge the melody up if more people agree though, thank you!
     
  6. steveswede

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    Today I decided to give my Death Egg remastered version another go seeing as the other one was seen as too close to the original.

    Death Egg Zone v2

    I'm happy with it so far but I might look into changing the drums at some point for that extra polish.
     
  7. Drex

    Drex

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    Don't you dare. For the first time ever I considered the Death Egg music to be bearable and possibly passable as the bgm for a longer level.
     
  8. SFtheWolf

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    Remixing music from a number of Genesis Sonic games
    Haha, duly noted then.

    Your avatar is hell of ritzy.
     
  9. amphobius

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    Really, I can't put it into words.
     
  10. Chimpo

    Chimpo

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    It's hard to be faithful when your source material is beeps and boops.
     
  11. ICEknight

    ICEknight

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    What. :psyduck:
     
  12. RedStripedShoes

    RedStripedShoes

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    I second that statement.
    :psyduck: :psyduck:
     
  13. Tweaker

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    He's saying that "being faithful" when it comes to something like most old video game music is largely up to interpretation. To bring up most old music to some sort of modern standard, you have to add channels, modify the arrangement to use more elements, use patches that can act as one of several hundred potential—but nonetheless fitting—instrument choices... the list goes on.

    What's so interesting is that though the music can only be improved by being so open to interpretation, the art can not. How innnnnteresting...

    I'm totally not hinting anything. Really!
     
  14. ICEknight

    ICEknight

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    What does "interpretation" have to do with following an existant music composition without adding new parts inbetween? I wasn't talking about the instruments, or channels, or anything like that.
     
  15. Chimpo

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    :psyduck:
     
  16. ICEknight

    ICEknight

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    No, really.

    The instruments can be interpreted into something real, but changing the melody itself makes it fall into the "remix" cathegory. Is it that hard to understand?
     
  17. Mastered Realm

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    I like to see how people tend to control Sonic 2 HD, if someone submits an awesome piece of something (art/music) and it is at least a remix of the original, and people like it, it WILL be included. No one is being paid here, this is not an official remake, if some remixes make people happy, there is no problem about including it. Sonic 2 was not perfect, if we find things that can be improved, be sure, they will be.
     
  18. SFtheWolf

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    Remixing music from a number of Genesis Sonic games
    My Death Egg Zone adds new parts and changes the melody in subtle ways.

    It's important to understand that certain things work for certain media and not others. The very simplistic, one verse style of composition common in the older Sonic games works well (and was probably out of necessity) on the Genesis. When brought up to modern standards, it sounds flat and repetitive. There's a reason the instrument swap attempts sound so uninspired.

    Here's a perfect example. My favourite track from King of Fighters 2000 on the Neo Geo hardware: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dDjn6m9cfP4

    Now here's the same people in the same company doing an "arrange" for the versions with CD audio: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2fQyBgGf4og

    The CD audio version doesn't just change/add instruments and dynamics. It introduces completely original material, while remaining completely faithful to the musical "intentions" of the original. The composers don't think that these differ enough to be called remixes, and they probably would have done the original tune in this matter on the original hardware if it was possible.


    Here's a possibly more relevant example, the Toxic Caves theme: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pbEfadBoE70

    And the Return to the Toxic Caves remix: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H4YnlV2AlLk

    You can't tell me that even with all the original material in that, it doesn't still fit the level and the feel of the original music perfectly.
     
  19. Chimpo

    Chimpo

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    More examples:

    MMX: CENTRAL HIGHWAY
    MHX: CENTRAL HIGHWAY

    MMX: MAVERICK STAGE SELECT
    MHX: MAVERICK STAGE SELECT

    MMX: FORTRESS TOWER
    MHX: FORTRESS TOWER

    MMX: RECON BASE RUINS
    MHX: RECON BASE RUINS

    MMX: SUBTERRANEAN BASE
    MHX: SUBTERRANEAN BASE

    MMX: ABANDONED MISSLE BASE
    MHX: ABANDONED MISSLE BASE

    MMX: PROTOTYPE WEAPONS PLANT
    MHX: PROTOTYPE WEAPONS PLANT

    MMX: NEW-TYPE AIRPORT
    MHX: NEW-TYPE AIRPORT

    MMX: ENERGY MINE RUINS
    MHX: ENERGY MINE RUINS

    MMX: ELECTROMAGNETIC POWER PLANT
    MHX: ELECTROMAGNETIC POWER PLANT

    MMX: VS. BOSS
    MHX: VS. BOSS

    MMX: VS. FORTRESS BOSS
    MHX: VS. FORTRESS BOSS

    BIONIC COMMANDO: - AREA 1
    BIONIC COMMANDO: REARMED - AREA 1

    BATTLE NETWORK 1-6: VIRUS BATTLE
    BATTLE NETWORK 1-6: VIRUS BATTLE (DS ARRANGEMENTS)

    MEGA MAN 4: WILY STAGE 1
    ROCKMAN 4: COMPLETE WORKS: WILY STAGE 1

    Capcom isn't the only example here either:

    CASTLEVANIA: VAMPIRE KILLER
    CASTLEVANIA CHRONICLES: VAMPIRE KILLER

    DRACULA X: BLOODY TEARS
    CASTLEVANIA: THE DRACULA X CHRONICLES: BLOODY TEARS

    FINAL FANTASY: BATTLE
    FINAL FANTASY (PSP): BATTLE

    I could go on, but the point should be pretty clear by now.

    Not even the developers rearranging their own material stick 100% to the original compositions. When they come back to the source material, they try to add more to the original music to fit with the more modern standards. They don't restrict to themselves to the exact same number of instruments that the original games used, and we shouldn't either. There's nothing wrong with rearrangements of the original music as long as we don't go into OC Remix territory.
     
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