Complimenting Sonic Adventure 1

Discussion in 'General Sonic Discussion' started by Mana, Oct 4, 2020.

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  1. Mana

    Mana

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    I replayed Sonic's route today and feel like I want to make this topic.

    - Every one of Sonic's stages feels like an action movie. Cool set pieces, cool moments of danger, exciting Indiana Jones inspired daring escapes. Every level has that feeling, well except for Casinopolois but whatever.

    - The world feels insanely connected. It's cool playing Sky Deck and wondering why the world is moving around so much then play Knuckles route and find out it was his doing while he was looking for the Master Emerald shard. There's other moments like this like Sonic looking for Amy in Twinkle Park and not finding her because he didn't know she went INSIDE the building and each is cooler than the last.

    - The Stories are compelling and well written.

    - The extra gameplay styles made be padding but they are a lot of fun. Well except for Bigs. Gamma's stages are really fun in particular and good way to get off some steam. I enjoy searching for Emeralds in Knuckles stages to be a lot of fun too.

    - Music is really catchy with the remixes from 3D Blast being really nice.

    - Felt like this truly was the return of Sonic and him entering the next level of games. Just a shame it's been so hit or miss since.

    Anyone else?
     
    Last edited: Oct 5, 2020
  2. Sonic Adventure remains one of my all-time favorites. It's still a blast to play. In fact, I'd say it's right up there with the Genesis games in terms of how much I enjoy it. I actually wrote about it in our Beaten in 2020 thread, so if you want my complete thoughts, I'd go there.

    Sonic Adventure 2: Electric Boogaloo, on the other hand...
     
  3. Xiao Hayes

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    This kind of topics were supposed to do the opposite of what we can usually see out in the internet. Had you say Sonic Adventure DX, that would be a different story. Still, there's something I keep on reading and I disagree with it:

    Sonic Adventure doesn't feel dated.
     
  4. Mana

    Mana

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    It's a 20 year old 3D game of course it feels dated. I just don't think the flaws it has due to age take away from all the good.
     
  5. The original DC version has aged far better than the DX version. If you must play SA1, play the DC version with a widescreen hack. (I don't have Windows so I can't judge the Steam version with the DC Conversion mod.)

    Also, to quote myself as regards to the game's age:
     
  6. Xiao Hayes

    Xiao Hayes

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    I mean, yes, but that's something you can't fight with a 3D game. So, it's true to some extent, but, as you say, it's not the game's fault, just tech (and I still love how Windy Valley looks at the very beginning).
     
  7. Dark Sonic

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    I like how there was at least an attempt to bring the classic style into 3d. Sonic's fun to play as, same with Tails and Knuckles. E-102 is also not without its charm, plus E-102 prob had the best most cohesive story in that game (and unlike Shadow he stayed dead, save for some replicas in Adventure 2 and Battle). And even though SA1 had a monster of the week plot, I liked the story enough, at least Sonic's. Just wish there was more to the game, it's so damn short as far as actual content and not padding.

    It's funny in many ways Crash 4 reminds me of Sonic Adventure. There's no hub, but the other characters you play as interact with Crash/Coco at various points in different levels and their actions affect Crash/Cocos route. Only I'd say Crash 4 evolves the concept a bit more. The other characters play in the same environment but have completely different levels where as in SA1 they often replay the same level almost exactly but with a different objective.
     
  8. kyasarintsu

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    While the level design and mechanics are really janky, it's nice that there was an attempt to give areas their own identifiable landmarks and setpieces. We have interesting locations like the big castle of Twinkle Park, the big descent of Final Egg, and the cool cavernous section of Emerald Coast that breaks out into a beachside loop that throws you onto an island.
    While there's often only one intended path through an area, that path can be winding, spiraling, and intersecting. It feels like the 3D space is put to satisfying use and it makes areas feel more cohesive.
    The act progression through stages is another thing I really liked. Different acts can look, sound, play, and feel very differently from other acts and it certainly adds to the moment-to-moment variety that the game has on display.
    Later games would opt for simpler level design that's increasingly more corridor-like in both geometry and arrangement, with fewer unique segments. While it was really easy to fly over and clip through everything in SA1, its environments always inspired a sense of wonder that other 3D entries don't really inspire in me.

    Oh, and Gamma had a cool story that takes an often-underlooked story element (imprisoned animals) and crafts a solid, low-key, and personal story.
     
  9. Sid Starkiller

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    It was great having a 3D game that still like it was in Sonic's surreal world, an AU Earth rather than our Earth that just happens to have Sonic in it.
    It actually tried to bring classic gameplay into 3D.
    It introduced the world to Chao.
    The story is decent.
    Much as I hate the character of Big and feel that a fishing game does not belong jammed in a Sonic game, the actual gameplay of Big is fine.
    Every other character is IMO legitimately fun to play as.
    And its absolute biggest advantage over its sequel: Every character having a separate campaign means that if I just want to play Sonic, I can do that. Mini rant on Adventure 2 in the spoiler tag, to keep it out of the main thread:
    When Adventure 2 first came out, I fucking LOVED the Sonic/Shadow stages. The Knuckles/Rouge stages were tolerable at best, and the Tails/Eggman stages were godawful, but I loved Sonic/Shadow/the Chao so much I was willing to overlook those flaws and call it my favorite in the series. I 100%'d both the DC and GC versions, and played the story many times. But the more times I played the story, the more the stages I hated came to wear on me. And my only way around it was to cherry pick the Sonic/Shadow levels in the menu, which I found rather inconvenient, at least compared to the Sonic games before it. Eventually, by the time the Steam version came out, I couldn't overlook it anymore. Every time those shitty levels got thrown in my face, it reminded me that the good was buried under a whole lot of awful. That's the story of how SA2 went from "my favorite game" to "pretty good but flawed" to "crappy but with some good in it". Adventure 1 doesn't have that issue. I can completely ignore every other character to just get to the parts I like.

    I gotta hook up my DC sometime to replay the original version. Hope it still works.
     
  10. Beltway

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    It's the one and only 3D Sonic game where you could see Sega/Sonic Team actually trying to make a 3D Sonic game that focused on delivering a solid platforming experience and passing with decent results. Each level is uniquely crafted --from their level geometry and pacing to their stage gimmicks and setpieces-- and a lot of the automated/scripted level design tropes and templates that run rampant in later 3D Sonic games are significantly downplayed here in comparison, so the platforming remains the chief priority of the gameplay. And as others have said, it's also the only 3D Sonic game that retained a okay incorporation of momentum/rolling physics mechanics from the Genesis games, even if they were more of a background element of the gameplay.

    Sonic Adventure stands as the sole point in time where Sega/ST had for Sonic a working (if still rushed-to-release) base for a 3D platforming playstyle that was respectful to both the conventions of the genre and the preceding 2D source material, and I think it's really sad that it became the exception instead of the norm for 3D Sonic games. Everything that kept Sonic from being a generic platformer that had speed as its only claim to fame got streamlined and/or phased out with the immediate next 3D Sonic game, and that title ended up being the codifier for what 3D Sonic gameplay stood for instead. It's no wonder the quality for 3D Sonic gameplay quickly dropped afterwards and why people outside the series feel the series can't and will never work in 3D. (People who enjoy the Boost gameplay aside--but I continue to rebut that the entertainment with those games lies more in the speed/racing properties of those games instead of the actual platforming properties.)
     
    Last edited: Oct 5, 2020
  11. OrtengeSoda

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    It has the best soundtrack in the series, completely varied and fantastic. Not one track I do not like on it. The best track is Windy and Ripply.. that guitar screech is out of this world. I also really enjoy the level design, its always a lot of fun going as fast as I can through Emerald Coast or Speed Highway... I even really enjoy Knuckles' stages as it really made me look around and admire the clear effort that went into each stage.

    Not exactly having to do with the final game, but Sonic Adventure does have one of the most interesting development cycles in the entire series, and one of the most interesting in all of gaming. It's one of the few games I get giddy for when a new small piece of development info is released so I'd say that is pretty special.
     
  12. I've been mulling over whether to say anything for awhile now, but I've been looking down on these topics for this exact reason. It feels like the topic creators are deciding for themselves which games are considered good or bad and trying to make posts to the contrary. The issue is that not all games are clearly widely-recognized as good/bad, especially as you enter into the 2000s. I don't like the idea of saying "this game is arbitrarily [good/bad], but I disagree because..."
     
  13. Mana

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    The reason this topic is called "Complimenting Sonic Adventure" is because I'm used to seeing the game spoken about in negative terms. This is despite the game having a LOT of good things about it I feel get overlooked because what has aged badly.

    We ALL know what makes it bad. The deadpan voice acting with the weird mouths. The glitchy and floaty physics. The Big levels not being fun AT ALL. I made this topic so we could celebrate what made Adventure 1 good. Because there is a LOT of good in the game that is often forgotten.

    That is the point of all these threads. We often forget or ignore the good or bad of things we like or dislike and these topics are to bring light to those elements. Not to tell people how to feel about these games.
     
  14. Cynical Toast

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    One thing think SA did right that other games failed at was the hub world. The hubs in the game were just the right size- having minimal wasted space and a bunch of landmarks. They were small but not tiny to the point of irrelevance(@SONIC Unleashed), and they were distinct enough that you couldn't really get lost (@SONIC 06). They all had great music tracks and really gave the game the feeling of adventure it's title would make you expect.

    Now, as for if there should even be hubs in Sonic games... that's another topic entirely. But it's hard to deny that as far as hubs in Sonic go, and especially for a first try, the ones in Adventure were pretty good. If nothing else, I love just mindlessly spindashing around the Mystic Ruins as Sonic.
     
  15. SuperSnoopy

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    Having started with Adventure 2, I always had troubles going back to Adventure 1: everything felt so much... dated, y'now?

    I recently replayed it (Steam version with the Dreamcast conversion mod), and while I still think it got nothing on Adventure 2, I enjoyed it a lot more than I did originally. If you keep in mind it's the first 3d Sonic game, it's still a damn good first attempt.
    Also, the soundtrack is incredible. It so varied and funky, I honestly don't know why Jun went with bland butt rock for most of Adventure 2's soundtrack. You'd be surprised the two soundtracks were made by the same guy.
    The Sonic stages are still the highlight of the game for me, but I grew to enjoy the other gameplay styles a little bit more.

    And just to get weeb for a second, my recent playthrough of the game was made with the Japanese version, and...wow. The English translation and voice acting for this game are so, SO bad. I never realized it until now.
    It's honestly unbelievable how both these elements bring the game down so much.
    The Japanese version still has the awkward pauses between lines, but otherwise the plot is totally acceptable. It goes from barely understandable ramble between two muppets to a pretty decent plot with cool lore.
    I think there's a retranslated mod out there for the pc version. Get it, please. Get it and never look back. Oh, and play with the Japanese dub; obviously :V
     
  16. I played SA2 for the first time a month ago, and this was one of the most surprising things about it. The SA1 soundtrack is incredible, so colorful and full of surprises, whereas SA2 is kind of forgettable except for a couple of songs that have attained meme status.

    I played through the Steam version of SA1 right before that, for only the third time (after the original Dreamcast game in 1999 and the original PC release around 2006), and it still holds up very well. They definitely tried hard to make every stage special and give them all unique mechanics and memorable set pieces. I think the level design is excellent too and does a great job blending traditional platforming with the fun speed elements. (Actually, having replayed a lot of Sonic games recently, I've come to find that all of the best ones tend to be the slower ones, like 8-bit Sonic 1, S3&K, SA1, and now Mania.)

    I like all of the characters' games. Of course, they're all too short, especially Amy's game, but all of their playstyles are a lot of fun. (Obviously Big is the worst. I think his game would be better if they hid all of his lures inside the levels to incentivize you to explore them, like they did with Ice Cap, his only interesting level. Emerald Coast even has that hidden area that's pointless except for...fishing. But I kind of admire how bizarre he is; it shows how inspired the team was at this time that they would do something as bold as adding a big cat who fishes to a Sonic game.)

    In general, the whole game feels like they tried really hard and went all-out on everything, from the Chao system to the individual character themes, which makes a lot of its shortcomings and flaws feel forgivable.

    I also really like the design of Chaos and the water imagery in general (which is why I also don't mind Big so much, since he complements that in a weird way) and especially like that the game managed an exciting and iconic finale without going to space again.
     
  17. I played the DX port about a year after SA2B, and despite being somewhat dated compared to it, I actually enjoyed SA1 a lot.

    It has one of the best OST's of the series, and arguably in all of gaming. This is where the series reputation for great soundtracks really took off and where Jun Senoue established himself.

    Its the only time the series really did try to incorporate classic elements into 3D, for better or worse. After this game, the series pretty much moves away from that design philosophy for something else entirely and I respect the attempt here.

    Sonic controls AMAZINGLY here, and probably the best he's controlled in a 3D space. He's fluid, quick and responsive. I really want this type of control over Sonic back someday.

    While the game has six campaigns, they're at least divided much better, and don't break the pacing like the sequels do. You pick one character and you can only switch if you choose to do so.

    This game does a significantly better job at fleshing out the supporting cast than most attempts later on, that more or less just reduce them to cameos at best.
     
  18. Chaos Rush

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    You can play as Tails and Knuckles in a 3D environment and they have all of their classic moves. And you can play as non-boost Sonic in 3D as well.
     
  19. Ayu Tsukimiya

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    Sonic plays better in this game than in any other 3D title to me. If you fixed the camera and glitches, I doubt anyone would complain about him. He feels a bit too floaty at times, but that's it. Same goes for Tails and Knuckles.

    The hub worlds were a nice concept and they're mostly designed well, albeit a bit too empty.

    Amy and Gamma could have been faster, but they're still fun to play as.

    Also, I feel like Big works just fine as a character. At the time, he certainly felt more natural in Sonic's world than Shadow or Rouge.
     
    Last edited: Oct 5, 2020
  20. Dark Sonic

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    Hey Big was forward thinking. So many games have fishing mini games now (Animal Crossing, Paper Mario: the origami king, Mario Odyssey, and Final Fantasy XV come to mind, with the latter being the closest to how Big's fishing worked but with more options and things to catch). Plus Big is just kinda innocent and pure. I can hate his gameplay but I can't hate him, like I loved in Secret Rings and Adventure 2 when they gave Big silly in level cameos, like what they did with Fake Crash in Crash 3, the N.Sane trilogy, and one point in Crash 4. Wish they would put hidden Bigs around again.
     
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