I think the real issue here is that wiki-related topics don't have their own sub-forum, but I think you said once you asked for that and didn't get it, so I understand your complaints. --- Another wall of text incoming. Back on topic, any complaint I can have about Mania would never put it below Advance in my list, both because I prefer Mania (Plus) over Advance in questions that leave room for opinion, and because it hardly has a chance against any classic game in my book. Examples I can remember: - Level art in Advance, while good, doesn't completely fits classic Sonic, feels a lot more Nintendo-ish, and not enough pseudo-3D. Character art is fully cartoony/flat, and its modern Sonic which I don't want in my 2D games. - About game sound, I think GBA killed any chance of it sounding good enough, so technically it's not the game's fault, but doesn't help either. - Level design was nice and fun, felt a lot more classic than playing 3D games, but, like with the other first modern games, having its share of generic quality doesn't mean it's on par with what I'd expect to be classic Sonic quality, plus the game isn't that long. - Overall, its like Sonic Adventure: a bridge game that still feels classic but it's also the start of modern games, so it's acceptable but not a quality reference except when comparing it to what came next. Besides that, there are pros and cons you've put up there that aren't really relevant in this comparison: - Rehashed levels in Mania, for example, were there because it was an anniversary title. - You're not being fair with the extra characters, since they depend on a lot more things, like considering how pointless character addition harmed the franchise to the point of returning to having only Sonic as a playable character in many games. I agree losing Amy is bad, and I agree Mighty is really disappointing, but those are separate questions, and, frankly, getting 2 characters, a bonus stage and a new mode with a totally new act for Mirage Saloon and a full set of special stages doesn't sound bad for the extra price: before it came out, I honestly thought vanilla Mania would cost a lot more than it ended up costing, so the extra money for the DLC wasn't an issue for me, and GBA could never have DLCs unless they released Sonic & Knuckles Advance. - Regardless of my opinion about dropped rings, having a preference over one style over the other makes those games different, not one better than the other. I prefer some control too, but it's true that scattering rings randomly is much more coherent, so I'd take it as it comes instead of whining. - Same for Super Sonic: I didn't have that on Sonic 1, CD, and the 8-bit games, and I enjoyed those games a lot. Being super is good in longer games to beat them in one strike, but never necessary (except in Death Egg from Sonic 2 where you can't have it without cheating). Sorry, it's great that you like Advance, it's great even that you prefer it over Mania for some reason, but you're evidently having a biased opinion that, if I had to guess, I'd say it has more to do with fond memories and nostalgia than with the actual games. For that matter, I still don't know why I really prefer S3&K over Mania, it has a lot to do with bosses but childhood bias is probably present too, as I don't enjoy videogames that much these days. You should have considered that before saying anything. EDIT: Almost forgot. Complaining about Knuckles gliding underwater can make sense if compared to Advance, but honestly, Knuckles being able to glide is weird enough to not ask questions about further details, Knuckles' glide could even make more sense under water than out of it, if you ask me.