I just realised something. throughout the videos of the gameplay shown so far, I don't actually remember seeing a single grind rail. Do you think we've finally seen the end of grinding? Or do you think it'll be there but in more fitting levels, sorta like how SA2 had handrails and the like as opposed to Sonic heroes "let's just stick grind rails everywhere even if they don't make sense"? Even on the Desert Ruins zone that was shown, those candy strips looked really grindable yet Sonic always ran along them instead.
I'm picturing Sonic sliding down that grease slide after busting through a bag of flour, and when he comes out at the end he's fried to a golden-brown except for his legs, so you've got this fried blob with little blue legs running along as it gradually breaks apart. [quote RuRi]I just realised something. throughout the videos of the gameplay shown so far, I don't actually remember seeing a single grind rail. Do you think we've finally seen the end of grinding? Or do you think it'll be there but in more fitting levels, sorta like how SA2 had handrails and the like as opposed to Sonic heroes "let's just stick grind rails everywhere even if they don't make sense". [/quote] I was thinking the same thing. I kept expecting to see him grind in in the candy level, and was pleasantly surprised to see him running instead.
(Copy/Paste from a different Sonic forum I frequent): I rewatched the 3DS gameplay video of Windy Hill again this time with headphones to hear the music and well it's honestly the only disappointing thing about the game. The invincibility theme is probably the best track in the game currently and even though it's a remix of Sonic Heroes' theme, it isn't that impressive, WH's music is a tad bit too repetitive and Desert Ruins Zone 2's music is as bad as the music in Oil Desert Act 2 which is horrible IMO. (It does fit the theme of the level I will say, but it's rather annoying...) This honestly might be the first Sonic game I play on mute sadly...
So I just had a look at both the WiiU and 3DS gameplay, and I really like what I'm seeing! The only thing that sorta kinda concerns me is how Sonic will control, particularly the trigger-induced speed control; according to the video, Sonic will automatically parkour if he runs into a wall when both of the triggers are being held down, and I dunno...maybe it's just me, but some part of me feels like that'll be a bit off-putting while playing. I'd rather have it so Sonic gradually accelerates through the control stick/pad and the parkouring function is left to the triggers. But maybe I'm just weird. :v: I'll get used to it, I suppose. Again though, I'm seeing a lot that I like! One of my pet peeves with Unleashed, and even Colors Wii (to an extent) was that there weren't very many gimmicks to interact with that made each level feel unique (yes, the Wisps were in Colors, but they were in every level (inb4 "except Terminal Velocity Act 2! :specialed:" but anywho). Going from Windmill Isle to Savannah Citadel to Rooftop Run, etc etc--the only thing that really changed was the theme of the level (this is coming from someone who DOES like those games a great deal by the way). But it seems that they're changing that up with Lost World (esp. in Desert Ruins), which is great. I also like how expansive the levels seem to be; with the whole tube-ish design of Windy Hill, I was a tad afraid that it would become a bit linear but oh man did that gameplay footage prove me wrong. I just can't wait to try this out already!
What bothers me about the different "gears" for Sonic is it seems like the game could have worked without it entirely... with spherical/cylindrical planets, they could have a lot more control over how many death pits there are, but it doesn't look like they're using it that way. Why not just try to make it work like in the classic games? You typically don't move too fast unless you start gaining speed, making platforming easy, but then you can use the spindash to enter top speed quickly. The gears just seem unnecessary, and even though I'm optimistic about the game and really think I'll like it, I can't help but feel the opportunity to REALLY get classic sonic momentum mechanics to work in 3D has been missed out on.
Just going to throw this out there... You guys really do give us the best source material to work with. :specialed:
I think the biggest reason for at least having the right trigger 'gear' is that it also provides a context-based trigger for the parkour moves. The 'gears' can work fine with 'classic' mechanics, they just haven't bothered to do that this time around, which is a huge missed opportunity.
Just one last thing about the "desert/dessert" thing. I think it could depend on the dialect with how you pronounce those 2 words. If I could be bothered (and if I didn't like the sound of my own voice) I might've done a voice recording to describe how it could be plausible to make them sound like they could be similar. It is in certain parts of America that that pronounces dessert as "dee-sert"? Those people would probably not get the pun as well as some who would pronounce it as "des-urrt". To me, the problem is all about people's different accents/dialects and how they pronounce their words (remember the thread about "how do you pronounce "Hydrocity Zone"?")
Do note that the order of the zones can still be switched up before release. For example: in the Gamescom demo of Sonic Colours I played, the second act of Planet Wisp is the fourth act in the final version of the game. (though this could also have been done for demo purposes) Also, this whole Desert/Dessert talk is the dumbest discussion I've seen on here since Sonic's eyelids having the wrong colour. :v:
Well, yes, but I must admit the whole thing has me a little confused. I totally understood the Desert/Dessert pun (incredibly obvious), but the giant hexagonal trees don't seem very desert-y. (The eyelid color does bother me though, more than the eye color :v
Maybe they should do a Jurrasic Park/era-themed level, just to confuse people even more (what with this title being called 'Lost World' and all...)
Why not call it "Candle sniffing fuck fence go climb a wall of dicks" zone This argument over the name riles up the blood due to it's intense stupidity. But a real question is given the lack of theme similarities given the names of the levels, why didn't they go the Heroes route and give each level their own name (which made no sense in Heroes given those levels were clearly Act 1 and 2 of a zone), since clearly the honey comb level makes no sense with the name Desert Ruins (THAT is a level theme that no matter what way you look at it makes no sense. The other one with the candy is just butthurtness over not wanting to get a mediocre joke). EDIT: This comic was the reference
Did you just call me a candle sniffing fuck fence and tell me to climb a wall of dicks? Whatever. I don't care about discussions if it'll turn into a flame war because people cannot stay civil, and that's what annoys moderators and admins here.
Yeah I know that internet reference. It's immature and insane, but that belongs to that side of the internet aka 4chan. Meh, I'm going to stop nitpicking and commenting on things. It's a bad habit, and that'll piss off alot of moderators and the admin who want to see a civil discussion. I mean, why waste my time on this?
I love this game. Fuck the zone names. It's awesome. :D Honestly though, I'm so glad Nintendo have (obviously) had some input or provided inspiration. It's so much better.
The Sonic games nowadays are a pinch of excellence spread very thin. The holes that pop up are filled with mediocrity and the entire thing is inflated with a sarcastic response to one of the major complaints. THIS GAME IS ALL ABOUT SPEED. THIS GAME IS ALL ABOUT PLATFORMING. THIS GAME ONLY HAS SONIC IN IT. When these complaints addressed parts to the whole problem, which cannot be solved by polarizing and inflating them, even if you put them all in the same game. As Ben Yahtzee put it "They keep taking Sonic apart and trying to analyze all the little pieces looking for the problem." Their fall from grace is due to no one at Sega being capable of producing another functional Sonic engine. They can only keep repeating common platformer gimmicks in a flimsy game engine and diluting the whole mess with lovely environment art as much as possible. The game LOOKS great. It even SOUNDS great. Though it seems they've distorted the gameplay even further in hopes of distracting from the critical issues that continue to plague the series. SUCCESS!
I dunno, whilst I agree with what you're getting at, I think they've nailed this game from the looks of it. Look guys, the way the original games in 2D play just doesn't work properly in 3D. The general running about and collecting stuff was done well in the Sonic stages of Dreamcast era, as well as with Sonic Heroes and stuff, but then it started to get complex. In all honestly, I really don't know why they ditched the Adventure/Heroes gameplay style of full free camera movement, but I assume it was because people kept banging on about the platforming being too difficult (which it wasn't) and how the characters weren't easy to control (which I thought they were) and they were too lazy to implement a better camera. It was clear from those games that the way the camera was made to work was to only really go forward, hence it made exploring difficult as the camera would stick in awkward positions (most noticeable when searching for Chao or backtracking for keys etc). They then brought about the Sonic Unleashed style of play, where the levels were even more linear, Sonic had even less platforming sections, and it was all quick time event style dodging and boosting. This didn't bode well for variety, so Sonic Colours mixed it up even more with varying degrees of success. Whilst Generations was fantastic and they really refined 3D's gameplay, it was still awkward to move backward and explore, which was a huge point of the original games. Not only that, but there still wasn't 3D gameplay based on rolling and momentum etc etc. So they've gone to refine the gameplay again without trying to make a huge leap from the current 3D stages and leaving everyone baffled- they realise that they can't go back to the way Sonic was in the Dreamcast days, as it had flaws with some platforming sections and also camera, so they go back to the earlier concepts of 3D Sonic (the style of Sonic X-Treme and Jam World) and realise that Sonic controls well at certain speed intervals. Rather than having one direction for moving Sonic at any speed, they add the "shift" which allows greater control over the speed of Sonic overall (have any of you ever tried to maintain a walk in any 3D game? It ranges from annoying to extremely difficult for long periods) so that it makes the fast sections fun and the platforming sections meaningful. Not only that, but the boost somewhat lives on in the form of the spindash which never should have left the series in the bloody first place. This also seems like it could allow for momentum based gameplay again. At the end of the day, 3D Mario is only the same as 2D Mario in that Mario runs and jumps and has a vaguely similar goal. He still has needs for different moves and things like the spin (akin to the homing attack) which increase his range (as jumping on baddies on a 3D plane is hard for any platformer). Lost World feels like a natural progression from the original games to me with added extras to support the 3D gameplay changes, and if it had shittier graphics, I could easily imagine it being released on the Dreamcast all those years ago. Assuming they actually stick with a style of gameplay from now on, I can see this gameplay being the definitive style for Sonic.
