U mad, Retro? Now things are getting fun. Is there an option to turn off the lack of creativity in using such a cheap tactic to win people over? To all of those saying "we've" complained 10 years about this, no I haven't. However, there are people who have been acting like Super Sonic's return as an overglorified power-up was going to save games like Sonic 2006 from being terrible. I really fail to believe that's the case. Are you honestly trying to tell me I should feel bad for wanting more than a shiny texture swap with a repetitive synth-rock loop playing in the background in my modern 2010 Sonic game? In terms of being a modern game, it just feels kind of outdated to me, and like so many other things in the game, it just seems like a waste of potential. There are so many other ways that Super Sonic could have made a more powerful impact, but instead it's just a "let's be retro!"-fest. It's almost like Sega wasn't confident that the game would be well-received so they tried to slip in as many references to the old games as possible. He doesn't contribute to the main game what so ever other than just being a trip down memory lane. In comparison, let's rewind back back to Sonic Unleashed again. Super Sonic is in the opening, so it's not like they're even pretending that he's supposed to be a "secret" anymore. The game acknowledges that you're already familiar with the character instead of making him seem mysterious like it's still 1992. Gameplay-wise, Sonic's natural abilities in the day levels replace Super Sonic in levels, giving the player an immense sense of power, albeit not invincible for obvious reasons. Instead of using him as a just game-breaking "reward" like in the Genesis games or a cheap plot device like in the other 3D titles, the game uses Super Sonic to create new challenges that are too big for regular Sonic to handle. It makes him seem that much more powerful, considering the abilities that made you feel like a master in the regular levels are no longer enough. Seeing Super Sonic in levels again feels like Sonic Team just tore apart all the groundwork that had been laid to make the character more interesting and more involved with the main game (I.e. not after collecting everything). It doesn't mean he has to be restricted for the final boss, but his purpose just seems minimized now. It works well in the Genesis games because it was something new. It works in Sonic 4 because it's supposed to be like the Genesis games. Here it just feels like Sega couldn't think of anything new so they decided to cash in on nostalgia instead. Not only that, but the levels don't really allow for his only abilities (infinite boost lol) to be utilized to the fullest.
So if I'm reading you right, either you want Super Sonic to be more involved in the plot, ala Unleashed, or you want the ability to use him cheapened, or both. Either way, I disagree. I think that the way they used him in Colors was great. While I wish that there was another final boss in addition to being able to play him in the stages, he was a cool addition, a reason to go for broke and get everything. Replay value is Colors' friend. Two things. One, it would take waaaaay more than an added playable Super Sonic to make '06 a good game. I have heard no one say anything remotely similar to that statement, however, its unrelated and I won't say anything more about it here Two, since when has Super Sonic NOT been an over-glorified power up? He had a little bit of plot backing in S3&K (the right amount, in my opinion) but other than that, specifically in Sonic 2, it was just that: an over-glorified power-up, and an amazingly fun one at that. Just another reason for replay value. I can't personally say that no Super Sonic would have made Colors a better game. The argument that they could have put the effort into something else is completely moot, because chances are Sonic Team wouldn't have added something else in its place. I respect your opinion, but I can't say I agree with it, or really understand what you're getting at.
I see what you're saying. Super Sonic is essentially useless and not very well implemented for the following reasons: 1. He's not much faster than regular Sonic with a full white-wisp gauge 2. He can't use the Wisps, and 3. The levels simply aren't built for him Sonic Colors was simply made for you to use the Wisps, play a few Unleashed-reminiscent 3D segments (snore), and then spend the rest of the time platforming in luscious 3D environments set to 2D perspectives. In a game with the kind of design Colors has, Super Sonic simply isn't built for it as he was for the Genesis games. He jumps a little higher, sure, but that's it. The game simply isn't bit well to accommodate the power and clout of Super Sonic, and he ends up feeling kinda eh. It's nice, but it's underwhelming. What you want from Super Sonic is what anyone would want to see from Super Sonic in 3D: Unbridled freedom and godlike power. As super sonic, you not only want to go insanely fast, but you also want the freedom to expend that unlimited mobility. You probably also want to fly around, destroy previous unbreakable obstacles with the force of a tank shell, and overall just be this massively destructive, unstoppable force that the environment can hardly contain. We want Super Sonic, and hell, even Hyper Sonic, to feel awesome, visceral, and powerful, but not without its limitations. Ring count should still be a factor, and any new powers he might have (Chaos Control, Hyper Sonic's double-jump flash bang, shield, etc.) should drain from his power appropriately. Balancing factors that pressure you to maintain that form by getting rings, but not so much that you feel you can't fly high and faster than ever. This is another reason why I'd like to see changes to the design and programming of stages like Unleashed. They look lovely, but they're too restricted to one given road or path, and Sonic's ability to explore is utterly consumed by his compulsion to move forward. Jumping has become nothing more than a reflex-based response to a raised road, obstacle, or a brief platforming section with, uh ... platforms over a pit ... and there's no momentum or traction to speak of. The levels are too horizontal and too restricted, and not vertical and free enough. That's where I think Sonic Adventure can come in and show some examples of how speedy sections like in Unleashed can be combined with more freedom to move around and explore in a 3D space. That's where Sonic games in 3D ought to grow: not in designing miles and miles of road for Sonic to blaze through, but in constructing large 3D worlds that don't deny the possibility of expending your speed to an exciting velocity or the room to explore and stretch out your sense of the world. As for involving Super Sonic in the plot itself? That can be done in any number of ways. We're just sick of always seeing it as restricted to some lame god-beast final boss encounter. It's not so much because they're god-beasts; most of them just suck, Dark Gaia included. Even if it was just Robotnik, it could still suck. The underlying problem here is a lack of challenge and ingenuity in final encounters, as well as exciting presentations. An excellent final climax to a game has no real bearing on whether or not Super Sonic or a godbeast are included, but the fact that they've been so overused while the challenges themselves end up lacking, it's just a tiresome reminder of seeing things we've already seen too many times.
You say that Super Sonic doesn't contribute to the main game in Sonic Colors. Did he contribute to the main game in Sonic Unleashed? Sonic Adventure? Sonic Heroes? Sonic 0Shit? Sure he did... as a plot device. But when I re-play Sonic Unleashed, Sonic Adventure, and Sonic Heroes, I can't play as Super Sonic... until the end of the game. While in Colors, I can play with him in Tropical Resort, Asteroid Coaster, etc. But this just might be semantics. I am confident in saying that contributing to the main game isn't the same as contributing to the plot. In Sonic 2, Super Sonic contributed to the game play. In Sonic Adventure, Super Sonic contributed to the plot. In Sonic 3 & Knuckles, Super/Hyper Sonic did both. If he can do both, great. If I have to choose one... let him contribute to the game play so that we have more replay value by blasting through the zones in godlike fashion. At least, that's just how I feel. Oh, you mean like when Super Sonic dealt with the Doomsday in S3K? Perfect Chaos in SA1? Final Hazard in SA2? Non-Aggression from Sonic Advance 3? Been there done that. Many many many many times. You say that playing as Super Sonic in regular levels is outdated, but interestingly enough, there are more games where Sonic is a plot device than a regular level bonus. And half the time, Robotnik has nothing to do with it, so who cares. in short, Having Super Sonic playable in the levels is actually refreshing, considering the trends. So, Super Sonic's purpose is huge when yo use him in just one level and minimized when you can use him in more than one level. Interesting philosophy. But like I said, I prefer "wreck the entire world bonus" Super Sonic than "true wanna be Goku vs. Frieza final level only" Super Sonic. At this point, it's nothing more than preference.
Super Sonic is nice and all, but he feels supremely underwhelming. He was a major disappointment because he plays so bland. I mean, you play through this entire game with wisp power ups opening up new pathways and such, and then you unlock Super Sonic, who tears all of that away from you and leaves you with permanent invincibility and speed shoes. Sure, you can turn him on and off, but as that image above states, that's missing the point. If regular Sonic is more fun to play than Super Sonic, and if Super Sonic has less abilities than regular Sonic, there's a problem. In every game where Super Sonic could be unlocked, he feels powerful and more fun to play. Once you get Super Sonic in Sonic 3 and Knuckles or Sonic 2, you're a fucking badass. EDIT: It appears MegaDash edited his post.
This being the case, it doesn't mean that playable Super Sonic shouldn't have been implemented, it means the implementation was flawed. Give him more speed, and the ability to use wisps (maybe even map a button to a debug-esque wisp selector) and he becomes tremendously overpowered and fun to play as.
Lol, before you edited your post I thought you were still waiting for me to explain. But I agree wholeheartedly with all of this. I feel like many of the levels just have backdrops for decoration's sake, not being able to venture out into them. I think the worst offender is Planet Wisp; it seems so vast, yet most of the time you're just jumping around on blocks and rectangles. As a result, Super Sonic in levels just doesn't seem quite as impressive. It feels minimized because despite being available in all the levels, he doesn't really do anything new or spectacular. You would think after 10 years of using him for the final boss, they would have found a new use for him. I can tell I probably upset a few people by my recent posts, but the whole reason I'm doing this is to provoke some insightful thought. I've been following this thread for a while and all I've seen is positive comments, almost as if people are afraid to say something else for fear of getting into a debate. But this is the whole reason we don't know how to debate things when hot topics like the "Sonic 4 Warz" come about and result in attacking each other over silly things. Needless to say, I'm pleased with the way this thread has been going so far and would like to see more of it in the future. I apologize if I came across as rude or pretentious in a few of my comments. I must have glossed over this. That's a really cool map, I love how it gives a detailed depiction of each route. It's cool that grinding now leads to split paths.
I am going to have to ask you to elaborate on this. You have rings in fancy formations, you have spawning enemies, you have obstacles, you have hidden areas, you have "hidden" areas that are ultimately dead ends and little else, and you have gimmicks used to speed you out of the water if you want (Rocket, levers, those tunnels, Drill itself). I do agree with your Super Sonic points, however.
The soundtrack is now available on iTunes in the US and soon in EU and Japan as well: http://blogs.sega.com/sonic/2011/01/26/coloursost/ $1.29 / £0.99 per track, or $9.99 / £7.99 per disc.
Well, this is a first. I'm pleasantly surprised to see a complete Sonic CD on iTunes. And moderately priced at that. Keep in mind the 3-Disc set is 4,800 yen in Japan. That comes out to 58 bucks American. Break that down to 10 bucks a disc on iTunes and I say we have a deal there. I'm glad I left the CD on the shelf back in Tokyo...
Wonder if they'll slowly begin to introduce the other soundtracks. There's certainly a market for them. But the question is, will people buy those older albums? The soundtracks aren't exactly hard to get a hold of online. Shadow of a Hedgehog practically has every single game's soundtrack uploaded.
It shouldnt be that hard for them to go about doing it. Though quality may be the same, I think the honest joe's would be more willing to pay 10 bucks for a CD than 30-40 bucks from an import shop.
This is probably a way to stop the rampant digital piracy of the OSTs. their fault though for keeping these OSTs out of american shores for soo long and making import the only option . What was the last OST we got here? Sonic Heroes? or was it SHTH?
Right thought so. I remember that when I got the album, it didn't have nearly half of all the songs that was on the japanese ost.
I still remember when Jun Senoue said he was working on an American version of the Sonic and the Black Knight soundtrack... Piracy of the albums is one problem, but not the biggest in my mind; the biggest problems are the Taiwanese bootleggers and the eBay sellers who peddle their crap with no retribution from eBay.
I just played through challenge mode again for the first time in a while, I forgot how fun this game was. Not quite up to par with the likes of Donkey Kong Country Returns, but it definitely has style with pretty great level design, an awesome soundtrack, and a fabulous art direction. Great game, let's hope SEGA can keep this going.
I need one more S rank on Tropical Resort and it's driving me fucking insane. I think it's Act 4 (the 2d one with the balloons and platforms everywhere). I get all the red rings and collect as many rings as possible but I always end up with an A rank.
