Sonic 4: Episode 2 Discussion

Yeah. Also, I think that the "choose the destiny of you" idea looks kinda... unoriginal.

 

Awwww yeaaaa, Sonic 3 & Knuckles level progression is finally back. The perfect visual aid to telling a story in a Sonic game, doesn't need anything else.

 

I don't think they should take away the level/act select at all! Depending on how things are arranged, would you really want to experience act one all over again when you really needed something from act 2? I guess it also depends on how the special stages are accessible. Having a specific act for each unique special stage was a bitches enough as it was. I don't know how many times I've played casino street act 3, lost lab act 2, mad gear act 2, but I think I'm on par with some of the latest speed runs I've seen. I still don't have those emeralds and all I wanted to do was to breeze by splash hill 1 before my patience ran out!

 

I don't think level select should go completely, I was on about how in episode 1 it was like "nice job finishing the first stage, now go where the hell you like". The feeling of progression should be there and you should be able to select an act once you reach it by beating the previous one, yknow, like how most normal games work

 

On first playthrough there shouldn't be a map select screen at all, that was just fucking stupid! Let the game progress like it should, THEN when you complete it the map select becomes available. E1 was essentially like the data select in Sonic 3 with all the levels permanently unlocked, and you have to go back to it after every act... after every single fucking act!

Exactly! Imagine back in '91 people playing through Green Hill act 1 and saying "fuck this, I'm going to the Final Zone".

 

I'm open to choosing which zone you would like to do next. As long as Act 2 & 3 aren't available from the start like Ep. 1 handled it. Usually I prefer going in order through progression but I'm open to choosing which zone you'd like to go instead. I don't see anything wrong with it, as long as the "WHOLE GAME" isn't unlocked, just the first act of every zone.

This game handled area selection very well.

 

I'm sorry, but with sonic, the only way it would work if it was like how colors handled it. Or maybe even how SA2(B) did it where it unlocked stages as you beat them

 

Colors is a good example. It takes somewhat of a Mario approach to level/world selection ala SML2 like I posted above.^

In SA2/Battle, its mostly like the other Sonic games. You "have" to beat the stages in order, in order to progress. The only difference is you can choose which story mode you want to do instead. There was no option to choose stages. Bad example.

Edit: Also I find irony with your signature.

 

Another issue I had with Episode 1's stage select being a free for all was as a result, there wasn't much of a difficulty slope. Splash hill was easy, everything else is normal then you get to the Death Egg Egg Station and have to deal with a pretty bloody difficult endboss. If Episode 2's stages have a fixed order they can sort out that whole difficulty problem too.

 

I don't see why they just didn't switch it around to where pressing Y at the end of a stage takes you to the level menu and not doing anything automatically takes you to the next stage.

Then from there, you can't go to any stage you want to. Instead you have to progress to unlock the next act and thus the next zone; so it still works like any normal Sonic game, but you can go back and play any level you want to after you've completed it (rather than having to resort to level select codes or replaying all the way to that point on a save).

Here's to hoping they do something like that in Episode 2, rather than doing it the way Episode 1 did it.

 

Admittedly, this game is awesome, and I am the master of it, but it's not a Sonic game. Specifically, it's not a 2D Sonic game- I don't want to have freedom to choose where I end up next- I want to be beaten, I want shit forced at me, I want to feel like there is some sort of skill and reward involved, and only get to choose the zones I want when I've beaten the game and earned the right to do so, rather than having a nursery kid's ideal game crammed down my throat whilst Yuji Naka's ghost sorrowfully looks at me like I've desecrated his grave.

Seriously, what's the friggin' point of this whole freedom thing? It wasn't used well int he first game, and it totally destroyed any feel of progression. If it was an open ended Mario game, then yeah, but it's not. In Sonic, you start at one side of the map and end up at the other. Nuff said.

 

Basically my position as well. Sonic games are all about progression and forward movement. A linear progression system follows its game design. A slower-paced game such as Mario, that already has slower-paced gameplay lends itself to an open-ended system, but Sonic does not.

What I would support, however, is multiple level endings, leading to a different level than another level ending. One of the few good things ShtH experimented with was objective-based level progression; the next level you played depended on which mission you completed in the previous level. Now replace objective-based progression with geographical (Hidden goal posts, or some such thing) in a zone, and not only do you have a more compelling level that puts emphasis on exploration and experimentation, but also instantaneous re-playability. All levels previously completed could be accessed from a map menu where you can then go back and find entrances to other zones if you so wish.

I would be fine if Sonic 4 were to ever try something like this, but since to our knowledge they're only going to be 4 zones per episode, it may be better to leave it out in favor of a game in the core series. But if each zone had different ending locations and each one lead to a different starting point in the next zone, I think that would also be super cool.

 

I would love something like that in a Sonic game. Shadow had the idea but some of those circumstances were pretty tedious. I picture huuuge levels that if you go a different route, you end up at a different area, like say taking the highest route would land you in a sky level. Sadly I doubt we'll see anything like that in Sonic very soon

 

Problem with that is, and I guess Shadow show this to a great degree, they have to cause a reset at the end. Shadow doesn't become evil (even if you do the bad side) and he doesn't become good (even if you do the good), he sort of just goes "neutral" during the final story.

As for multiple paths, it all seems too stupid, I didn't care whether I played Marble Zone before Spring Yard Zone. And for colours it ment I just had to spend more time in an interactive menu than actually playing the game.

 

It doesn't have to be plot based, just location based. No more or less than Sonic 1 or 2 was. But it won't happen anyway, so probably best to not worry about it I guess.

On the topic of the game, I really hope that since its been leaked they might end up showing a trailer on Friday.

 

I was being sarcastic when I stated I wanted immediate level select. That was one of the worst design choices I have ever seen in a Sonic game. If they have even a minor degree of sense this episode will progress like a normal game, or at the very least not let you skip the acts.

Also I do not think we need Megamix-style anything. You know where that ends up...

 

After you beat a level you should be able to play it at will. However, you shouldn't be given every level at once. The game is short as it is, it shouldn't take you long to beat the game, once you beat it all levels will be opened to you and you can play them at will.

 

I think one reason why SEGA did that stupid form of level progression in Sonic 4: Episode 1 is because of stupid reviewers. IGN bitched about the last boss in Sonic 4: Episode 1 being too hard and complained about the fact they couldn't skip levels in Sonic Colors because Mario and a lot of other hand-holding platformers lets you do it. Sonic games are typically short and makes you beat all of the levels to beat the game (save for maybe an extra stage if you get every chaos emerald). Other than maybe the length of some games, I don't see why some reviewers want to skip levels so badly unless they're flat out shitty levels.

 

Time given to work on deadlines, lack of care/effort, etc. Usually, they have a stack of games they have to review and they just want to get some out of the way as fast as possible.