Music Let's write a POLITE letter to Sega about Origins' music

Discussion in 'General Sonic Discussion' started by nineko, Jun 22, 2022.

  1. nesboy43

    nesboy43

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    Maybe sign it something like

    Sincerely,
    A select group of Sonic Fans

    Or something that makes it known we aren't claiming to speak for the entire community.
     
  2. Starduster

    Starduster

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    I’d just sign it as Sonic Retro tbh. Also, probably best to withhold it until after release and we’ve given the tracks a fair shot in actual gameplay. Nothing’s going to happen in the next 48 hours and there could even be a patch that shows the music we’re hearing now wasn’t meant to be the final draft.
     
  3. nesboy43

    nesboy43

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    Would the site owners be OK with this? I guess I would be concerned about implying the letter came from the site owner(s).
     
  4. DefinitiveDubs

    DefinitiveDubs

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    Retro bore talents that Sega themselves have had in their employ, or at the very least used the tools and talents of, and I'm not just talking about Stealth or Taxman, but also Ruby, falk, and MainMemory. So I believe if handled correctly, this site's name should carry some clout (even if in reality, plenty of users like me are talentless hacks).
     
  5. _Sidle

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    I'd also scrap mentioning the idea of suggesting 1997 S&KC be what's looked at/included, focus should 100% be on showing them the 1103 prototype tracks as viable either for inclusion outright or as a basis to work from. The less guesswork they have for figuring out how to make things in the MD-style the better.
    Signing it should either be "Sonic Retro" outright, or perhaps "the community at Sonic Retro" to make it clear we're not the site owners and we're just a group that hangs out here.

    Minor tangent; but some of the S4:E1 levels got changed due to fan input, if I'm not mistaken. Would that be worth bringing up as something much more difficult they've been willing to do in the past for us, and how much more of a simple and straightforward task adding music options would be in comparison to that?
     
  6. RDNexus

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    The idea was to try to not mention any of the prototypes, since they were never meant for us to set eyes upon...
     
  7. Mastered Realm

    Mastered Realm

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    There's evidence pointing to the fact that Senoue hasn't rearranged the Origins Songs.

    The data in the proto tracks we got already suggested a slightly earlier build existed that featured the PC pitch (and probably tempo). The SMPS engine lets you transpose the song without the need of updating the note data and that's what happened in the Nov. proto. We also know he couldn't have used the original MIDI data from the keyboards since they were lost by the time SK collection was made. We know the two sets FM/GM were resequenced by ear by different people as they contain errors that are not consistent between the sets.

    There are also many 'hard-to-hear' notes missing from the PC version and they are here. Also, these are all Genesis recordings with the signature aliasing/ladder effect and all the DAC samples are correct, so there's no reason to believe they weren't rendered from inside the Sonic 3 sound driver.

    So we have:
    • Accurate SMPS data (not resequenced)

    • Accurate DAC samples

    • YM2612 rendering artifacts (ladder effect)
    Nothing explains this better than SOJ probably having a never-before-seen October prototype of Sonic 3&K sitting in their building. Jun was probably minding his life in Japan then he was told they were gonna have to use the proto tracks and he produced a recording of what he had. It's the one Sega Japan used as a reference when creating the PC version and it's the one we're getting now.

    And using common sense, we know those don’t have his arrangement style… which clearly appears on the Super Sonic Theme, complete with the Sonic 1 Drumset.
    The instruments on the super theme aren't FM either (or at least not the kind the YM2612 can produce). That was probably the only track Jun actually rearranged for origins (which is a remix of Howard Drossin's SK title theme)

    Just as extra proof, here's a perfect recreation of the Origins version Launch base, which can be produced by just changing instruments to the default bank and removing the PSG 1 and 2 channels entirely:



    Knowing that, I'd simplify the letter:

     
    Last edited: Jun 22, 2022
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  8. pkderbar

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    What the letter should talk about is the lack of transparency on this issue and the way that this topic was deliberated avoided until the last minute. It doesn't give the impression that these are even a focused attempt at resolving the issue and left the perception that if community members weren't insistent on asking about it, they might have even just released the game without telling anyone about the changes at all.
     
  9. Aerosol

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    I just want to be on record stating I think this is a pretty bad idea. If you all are dead set on doing this, I wish you the best.
     
  10. Overlord

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    What he said. This'll either be ignored, privately laughed at / "they've got some gall", or a generic "thank you for your interest" reply.

    Sorry, lads. Decision's long since been made on this subject and it's way over our heads.
     
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  11. FollOw

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    If we write a letter where we just scold sega they will immediately ignore us. Whats done is done and this is not constructive.
     
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  12. nesboy43

    nesboy43

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    IMO even though I have zero expectations I personally would feel better getting this off my chest. It is my favorite game of all time, and the parties responsible should have this feedback.
     
  13. So what you're saying is the worst that can happen is nothing. I don't really see the harm in trying.

    Besides, it's either this or sending Senoue a copy of Deflemask or the Genny VST for next time. :P
     
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  14. Pengi

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    Old-school letter writing campaigns would usually draft up an example form letter (like we're doing in this thread), then encourage individuals to send a copy of that letter (either verbatim, or with some personal touches) to the relevant company/politician/etc, in their own name.

    A single letter doesn't mean too much. To move the needle, they need to receive a significant enough volume of (polite) letters. If Katy (or whoever) tells their bosses that they've received 100 emails and 200 tweets about the Sonic 3 music issue this week, then that holds more weight than telling their bosses that they've received 1 email from "Sonic Retro".

    Generally speaking, personal correspondence carries more weight than a petition signature, an email carries more weight than a tweet, and a physical letter carries more weight than an email. (Or at least that's how things used to be.)

    Important things to remember:

    * Make sure you're sending your letter to the correct place (whether email or physical)
    * Don't spam with multiple letters. One per person. Or at least wait a couple of months before sending another.
    * Stay on point
    * Use your real name: "Kind regards, John Smith", not "Kind regards, Sonadow2005"
    * BE POLITE
     
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  15. Black Squirrel

    Black Squirrel

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    It does seem a bit fruitless. I figure you're better off tweeting your local Sega representitive, or your games journalist of choice.
     
  16. pkderbar

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    There is not a platform alive that will project this message in one letter. As @Pengi stated above, this should be community organized and promoted on social media if you want any attention on the matter.

    Nothing is inherently unconstructive about criticism if it's made in good faith. If you want to express the opinions of the community, then being honest and succinct is the way to do it instead of evasive or insinuative. This is not a matter of "they changed it, it sucks", it's about the way this was communicated and marketed, all the way back to the poor value proposition DLC.
     
  17. ELS

    ELS

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    I don't think you'll get the result you're after but there's no harm in it. You definitely won't get a result doing nothing so I say go for it. For that 1% chance, if you think it's worth a shot.
     
  18. Aerosol

    Aerosol

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    Indeed sending multiple letters would probably work better. But in the age of social media...sending physical letters feels more performative than indicative of the mood of people the game is marketed to (which is really not just us?). You could say "then we'd send an email" but then I'd say "a social media campaign is more effective".

    Like Roserio said the worst that can happen is nothing so I'm not going to try and stop any of you. I would hope that nobody would try to speak for Retro in such a letter but I'm sure that doesn't need saying.
     
  19. Snowbound

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    A lot of people are gonna disagree with me on this but I think this is an embarrassingly minor hill to die on. Especially since Frontiers is currently being rushed out the door in a supposedly janky as hell state. Guys do what you want but this is not gonna improve the public image of Sonic fans.
     
  20. ELS

    ELS

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    But no one's dying, no one here works for sega. This is like sending a letter to nabisco because you want a specialty oreo back, it's not that heavy just consumer feedback.
     
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