If anything, I could also point to Launch Base water jets failing to respawn when you move so they're offscreen and the thing I found where a certain Lava Reef checkpoint locks a nearby door without any means to open it when returning from a Bonus Stage
Or graphics corruption in Sandopolis Zone, or getting stuck in an endless death loop in the Lava Reef Zone boss because of the Hidden Palace Zone teleporting bug, or completely screwing up the background of HCZ2, or outright locking the game up in the Death Egg Zone boss etc.
I don't want to be annoying, but it has literally been years since the last release, and there have been no updates given to the public as far as I know. Is this project dead?
Sorry for the nitpick, but... Is it just me or the cutscene added to the beginning of Tails's story makes absolutely no sense, even by Sonic standards? I mean, why and how would Tails cross the whole sea by flying with this tails? Shouldn't he have gotten tired long before reaching Angel Island, and why wouldn't he just use the Tornado as always? I know the cutscene is skippable, but it has been bugging me for ages. Is there any way of disabling it altogether? I don't see an option for it in the customiser :v:
Perhaps I'm a little old fashioned, but I'm not into Twitter. Why not post updates in this thread? How was I even supposed to know to look there?
Tails only gets tired for gameplay purposes to prevent him from being completely broken. Remember how in Marble Garden's boss he can all of a sudden fly infinitely? It's gameplay and story segregation at its finest. And assuming he can fly forever, and since in his version of the game Sonic doesn't come to the island, why bring the Tornado just for himself?
Okay. But even if it's just a gameplay mechanic, it's the freaking sea, and he didn't even know how long the trip would be, given that he didn't know of Angel Island beforehand. All he knew was that Chaos energy signatures were detected in that direction. Not taking the Tornado is incredibly reckless, if not borderline suicidal And in the other games, he always uses the Tornado for air travel whenever he can. And if we're assuming that Tails has unlimited stamina, shouldn't the same hold true for Sonic, meaning that he should be able be able to cross the sea by simply running over it? So there would be no more need for the Tornado in the S&T story than in Tails' story.
The fact that it was on my own personal channels should've clued you that it was me just posting crap in a completely unofficial capacity. (While we're at it, have a YouTube playlist.) I am no longer working on S3C, but I'm obviously not in the position to call the project dead. I have my own projects now though, and eventually I would like to bring over some of the stuff I did that never got to see the light of day.
If you don't mind me asking, why is that? And what is Tiddles up to these days? Clearly there has been quite some development since the last release. I just want to know that we'll eventually get another build before 2020 or something.
I don't mind, but this isn't my thread. Essentially, Tiddles stopped having time and/or drive to work on the hack, but (understandably) still wanted to exercise creative control. That means I couldn't do some of the stuff I wanted to do, and since I wasn't in charge of the release plans, the stuff I'd worked on never got out, and I got tired of that.
I'd love to see your ideas come to life Tiddles. S3C is my favorite hack/game ever and anything to expand on it would be wonderful. For someone who is poor in tech but ok in art let me know if I can help make your vision come true.
Honestly, I think the S3C source should be open to the public (that goes for all hacks in general, too). It wouldn't harm anything, and would be useful for so many purposes. I never understood the whole closed-source nature of a lot of these Sonic hacking projects. The open-source nature of the Doom community has served it extremely well. People use each others code all the time (with credit ofc), improve upon it, and often these improvements make their way back into the mainline projects. As a specific example: GZDoom vs. ZDaemon, both forked engines of idTech1. The Doom source was originally released under the Doom Source License as opposed to the GPL later on. GZDoom, while open source, has only recently moved to GPL, but has always been open source. There was a fork called QZDoom that made some major improvements, and all of this was backported to GZDoom. It is literally the most advanced and useful Doom engine out there. ZDaemon, on the other hand, was based on ZDoom (basically an early version of GZDoom by a different author), but they chose to close their source after forking. Look where it is now: buggy as shit and horribly out of date, unable to run any mods newer than 2004 or so. Not to mention, isn't it a tad hypocritical to reverse engineer SEGA's work, only to turn around and be like "no you can't see my changes"? I was pretty disgusted with what happened with the whole Mode 1 MCD version of Sonic 1. I've talked to the guy in private about it and he's shown to be reasonable, but at first he was throwing a hissy fit that the project lead shared the source. Some kind of bizarre elitist thing like "I don't want amateur noobs to run around making bad hacks with my features in it". So?
I'd rather be in a 'hypocritical' community than one where everyone thinks they're entitled to each other's work. Just because we have no regard for Sega doesn't mean we shouldn't respect the choices of fellow hackers.
And I'd rather not be. I'd also rather see the situation change than to leave. I'm not going anywhere, but I absolutely loathe the status quo and will say as much. I bring the subject up from time to time, and will continue to do so until either made to stop by the staff, or the situation resolves itself. I never said anyone was entitled to anything. Just that it makes a lot more sense to do things in an open-source manner, and absolutely no sense for closed-source to be the status quo. What if nobody ever shared the disassemblies of the base games that we have now? The hacking scene would still be where it was in 2005, and it would suck hard. Does it, really? That smacks of sheer hypocrisy, no matter how you try to twist or justify it. Not to mention there are very practical benefits to modelling ourselves after the Doom community's ways. I don't respect what I think is a bullshit position to start with. If people could build off of the work of others freely, can you imagine how much further it would take the scene? There'd be a massive explosion in creativity and shared quality.
It is hypocritical, but I understand and agree with both sides. Sega makes their money from their content and from a legal standpoint, their name is on it no matter what. We don't profit on here (and shouldn't). It's just pride of one's work and not wanting others to just shit on it with disgraceful hack jobs or to flat out take credit for your (hacked) work. I mean these people here use their free time to do amazing work to not get paid and only receive some online recognition. It's for fun, they deserve some form of keepsake out of it as opposed to the rest of us. The only point you know something's been taken too far is when you pull a L0st... like the DRM stunt on Sonic 2 HD... hahaha that was funny and made him run for it from the community. But yeah.
FYI, none of the bitter ranting that follows is directed at you, Knux, or anyone else for that matter. It's generalized. I'm hardly diplomatic, but I want to state my piece nevertheless. I disagree that the other position has any validity whatsoever. Closed source hacks are hypocritical and stunt the scene in a major way. And we have the gall to disassemble their commercial work and distribute a slew of modified versions, illegally and without express permission. And then SEGA is kind enough to tolerate it, retaliating in no way, with full knowledge of what we're up to. The scene is standing on SEGA's shoulder. By extension, the scene also stands on the shoulders of the hard work of those who disassembled the games' code, cleaned it up, and released it for public consumption, precisely for the reasons that I am advocating for. I think the results of that speak for themselves. It's foolish to cling to one's modified source, given all that. It's not actually a problem when one writes their own engines from scratch (though open-source is still preferable), but this is derivative work I'm talking about here. You know what would be the ultimate hypocrisy, however? Hypothetically, if in the absence of source, a really good hack was disassembled in the same way the base games were, and the author became upset. I don't feel that people have much room to talk about 'their' code, given the nature of the foundation of all hacks. That is harmless and easily ignored. The cream always rises to the top. On the opposite end of this, what if someone used some cool features from an existing hack and made a far better hack of their own? If your content doesn't hold up when its corresponding code is used for better content, then perhaps it's more that you're a good coder than game designer and shouldn't be so insecure, possessive and protective about it. Sharing is caring, etc, a misplaced sense of property is not healthy for creative communities. There is a bigger picture here. Hacking/modding communities are built upon collaboration, cooperation and sharing. I'm sick of seeing this closed source mentality being so prevalent in this community. That's plagiarism and is intolerable. Should anything like that happen, it will be easy to spot, and they will be publicly lambasted for it. Not to mention, if the source is open, it makes confirmation even easier, and a lack of source would be cause for further suspicion in cases like these. "Somebody might do something wrong" is never a good reason not to do what's right. It's really not an issue, source should be shared regardless of what one worries others might do with it. Someone pulling some crap has no bearing on the value and authenticity of the original author's code. I highly doubt that people would side with a plagiarist if/when such issues are brought to attention. Besides, it'd take some serious balls to blatantly claim the work of others as their own: I think such a scenario is more than unlikely, and it can be dealt with swiftly and appropriately should it ever crop up. Recognition, praise and credit is quite enough. Anything more is selfish, shortsighted, and lacking in perspective and respect for what came before them. And before anyone tells me that I'm acting entitled, I'm not. I'm well aware that nobody owes each other anything. My opinion is very strong and I will call things as I see them, but I acknowledge that it's only opinion.
I am aware no one owes anyone anything, but I would be incredibly disappointed if the new version of S3C I've been waiting literally years for, that already has so much work done, never sees the light of day. And if it needs a bit more work that you can't do yourself, then I implore you to let someone - Neo or anyone else - do the work for you. We're such a dedicated and passionate and talented community - I'm sure we could band together to finish making the definitive edition of this definitive edition. Please, Tiddles. For the benefit of everyone who has ever loved Sonic 3, don't let your work go to waste. For the sake of YOUR GREAT WORK, let people enjoy it.
This is exactly what I'm getting at here. Regardless what your position may be on closed vs open source (which ought to be its own discussion in general, as it applies to more than just S3C), we're certainly on the same page when it comes to wanting the best for this project and its audience! I'd like to explain myself if anyone finds me to be too argumentative: I'm heavily opinionated and will speak my mind fearlessly (even to the point of sheer obnoxious arrogance), but I am also open-minded and will immediately change my position if presented with sound reasoning. The basis of this is prioritizing logic/reason and a desire to realize potential to its fullest. I don't take things personally unless other people make it personal, and I hope that others don't take my arguments personally, because it's not meant that way. I focus on the subject, I avoid focusing on people or their emotions. I just needed to rant about this to get it out of my system and get people thinking/talking about it. It's not directed at anyone in particular and I have nothing else to add.
