Sonic Superstars: A New 2D Sonic Game (Fall 2023)

If we learned one thing from past instalments then it has to be that games don't have to be perfect to become fan favourites. It's nice to hear they seem to have nailed the physics, but will it be enough to get people hooked? Remains to be seen. I doubt their intention was to make a game that's on par with the classic trilogy. Main features are co-op multiplayer, 2,5D graphics and everything else that they've learned from past missteps. If they succeed in that, and the game is fun, then chances are good that future titles will get better and better until someday we'll get one that pleases everyone.

 

No Sonic game will ever please everyone, but that’s Segas fault for making Sonic 18 different things. It could be the best 2D Sonic ever and some idiot is going to say “it’s garbage I’m going to play 06 now.”

 

People like this exist, you better believe it. While everyone is having fun with TotK, @DefinitiveDubs beat Zelda II, and I'm playing Crusader of Centy right now. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

Ah, I get that. I don’t personally agree that camera changes are required to be consider a full 2.5D game though. I think games like Generation, Klonoa, etc., using those techniques is to elevate above a normal 2.5D game rather than a prerequisite to being one.

Anyway, I am still not totally onboard with the look of Superstars. I will always be partial to pixel art, but a nice cel-shaded 3D model would have been acceptable to me. I think what I’ve seen of the game is far too visually bland and generic for me to fully embrace.

 

You'll all come crawling back once they reveal how sick the multiplayer battle mode is.
+ - Please Crom, let it be sick  

 

The level aesthetics aren’t the most unique but in the gameplay they’ve shown off, the level design and gimmicks have been very creative. As someone who loved the sprawling level design of CD and the plasticity aesthetic/lighting in Sonic Heroes I’m pretty thrilled by what I’m seeing in Superstars. I also think folks are underestimating how big a deal Ohshima’s return is.

 

I actually just started this up again because it got added to NSO. I should probably just play it on the CRT with actual hardware but the Switch is just too convenient... Also tempted to play Landstalker again. I finally played through Link to the Past earlier this year and it disappointed me. I don't know if I'd call it better, but I honestly find Landstalker to be the more interesting game to play. However, that could just be because I had just played Ocarina, and the Zelda 'formula' is something with which people are so familiar, having played the games or not.

 

I'm honestly hoping that someday soon the designers will be able to create a few architectural elements for each zone, which are similar in composition to those from the Classics, and then an AI program will be able to just apply that to the level layouts which the human designers predetermine. I feel like this is the only way we are ever going to get the same look and feel of the Classics, because I can respect that this modular look was effective in the days of the Genesis, but less feasible when applied to 2.5D (essentially 3D) environments.

This may sound stupid, except I literally saw a video demonstration of this generative ability several years ago. The designers merely created some rules for the program, and then it would spit out all sorts of architecturally similar assets based on their layout... If they didn't like the look of this building or that, or preferred it taller or wider, etc., they would just toggle the parameters and the architecture would adjust accordingly. Given the current state of generative AI, I think an accessible platform for this all that remains (accessible to Sega designers).

 

I'm just glad we're not getting Green Hill and Chemical Plant as level again (despite maybe having some inspiration from old games in the newer original stages).

 

Honestly this is something that really should be highlighted. Could the level designs be more unique? Sure they could, but at least they’re new. And to be clear I’m not trying to silence criticism. People can have any view they want. But we are getting all new levels with unique designs and gimmicks. That’s a major step forward from… (takes deep breath) generations, forces, mania, frontiers and (arguably) Sonic 4 and Lost World.

Plus I do think the sky level looks visually distinctive.

Changing the subject, Game Informer posted an article about Trip today. There wasn’t much new info however there were two interesting bits:
"When you look at her, obviously she's covered in armor, and the reason why she's covered in armor in the game is the base of her character is a sungazer lizard in English," Iizuka says. "In Japanese, it's more direct – it's literally 'armored lizard' in Japanese. But the sungazer is that animal that was being referenced for the deign of Trip."

The team wanted to show that Trip is not that usual enemy, and we wanted to introduce her in a way that's not the obvious 'Oh, I'm super strong' way," Iizuka says. "When we presented Trip in the very beginning, I think she even falls on her face in the very first scene that you see her in. The first thing I think people will be thinking is, 'Who is she, and why is she a super strong enemy? What's going on?' We wanted to introduce the character in that way to make it different from how enemies have always been presented in Sonic games."
https://www.gameinformer.com/previe...character-created-by-naoto-ohshima-in-decades

 

Clumsy Powerhouses appear in anime quite frequently ^^"

 

At least it looks better than Sonic 4...

SEGA could have easily just pulled another S4, but thankfully it does look like they're putting some decent effort into Superstars making it an all-round better experience. I feel there's plenty to be positive about; Working with Ohshima a Sonic Team legend who knows classic Sonic through and through, creating a game which appears to have accurate momentum physics, all original zones & story, four playable characters (finally making Amy playable again), multi-player mode, a brand new character, 2.5D aesthetic which at least looks better than Sonic 4's shitty plastic grass, emerald powers & level design which seems promising and bringing back Tee Lopes who's music is always top-notch.

I always have ridiculously high expectations when it comes to classic Sonic, and yeah Superstars probably won't be my ideal classic Sonic game but I'm happy it's looking a lot more promising than that shit we got over 10 years.

 

Honestly, the moment I found out Ohshima would be working on this game, my hype meter jumped from 0 to 100 real fucking quick. I just hope the game turns out to be actually good.

 

Crusader of Centy might look like a ALttP clone aesthetically, but the Zelda essence is strangely absent. It's more of its own thing. Landstalker got me curious as well.

Anyway, we're off-topic now. A Lot of GBA games that need to come to NSO. Sonic Genesis, for example, would be a good addition.

 

Tbh when some people's idea of the "best 2d Sonic game" is Sonic Mania, yeah, I'm the "idiot" who's just gonna go play 06 now. Otherwise I actually like at least a few different 2d Sonic games. I'm not allergic to the entire concept, I just think some games didn't really "get" it. One of them even being Sonic 2, which people insist should be the blueprint of the entire series, despite its cheap hits and rushed level structure.
That's why I'm excited about Arzest, To me they've proven themselves in 3d structure, so I think they have the best shot out of anyone to make something that "gets" it.

That's pretty much just procedural generation (something that's existed for ages and is the foundation of stuff like Survival mode Minecraft and Terraria world generation) but pre-curated and modified. I don't really think that's a good fit for this specific brand of 2d Sonic level design outside of fan works, because it reduces the whole thing to a purely technical experience when it's meant to be more exploratory and at times theatrical. If it was some form of Sonic rougelike or sandbox game then yeah let's start trying to think of ways to generate the world but it's simply not.

 

Evening Star is actually doing something mildly similar to what's being described with Penny's Big Breakaway. Not the exact same thing but it was an interesting connection. From Nintendo Life:

 

Yeah, I only brought up Zelda to compare it to Landstalker, which is much closer to Zelda than Centy. I played like 3-4 hours of Centy a few years ago and it was definitely its own beast despite the visual similarities. I felt it was more like a top-down Wonder Boy than a Zelda. Back on topic...

I think he means having generative visuals, rather than level design. Though since we're on the topic, while generative level design would definitely be tougher to get to the point of a high-quality, human-designed stage, I think it will definitely reach that point in the future. I don't think I'd enjoy a game knowing it was made that way, but with the proper training data, it could likely produce better designs than we saw in 4 and Forces...

 

Ah. I missed like one key phrase out of all of them and entirely mistook the meaning of the post.
Still, graphics can be procedural as well, I think Sonic Forces and Frontiers' Cyberspace stages were actually built that way too.

 

https://twitter.com/sonic_hedgehog/status/1687131215856644096?s=46&t=S0_YkQ8TRA2Bk54XvKgWfw
I love this! The concept art looks like if 3K’s Carnival Night Zone was translated into Sonic CD’s aesthetic

 

Damn, that actually looks nice. The only shot we have of the zone looks quite bland in the background, so I'm hoping it's just a bad spot of the level.