I'm still not sure what to make of that either. Perhaps these tracks were been created at the pre-production stage? Could the US staff at STI have hoped that composition for Sonic 2 would take place in-house and put together some conceptual tracks, only to be ultimately overruled? I can't really think of any other circumstance that makes sense of these otherwise, if they are indeed genuinely tracks composed at some point in the Sonic 2 project.
It's used in a few things iirc hence me assuming that it's just demoing the GEMS driver. The real mystery is club scene from the name I can think of it potentially being a placeholder for Casino Night zone. Something to note is that the tails design doesn't look like the early sprites we recently found, although this might not mean much as the demo cart was probably made later right?
actually, if I recall correctly, this outright happened and we got a (very bad) demo track from that time. was like a couple years back or so, can't remember. let me search the forums. EDIT: Found it. Forum thread here from 2 years ago.
Ah thank you! that was the thread I was looking for Don't think it means much for the development of sonic 2 though, but it's interesting to think that it could have ended up like sonic CD. One thing where it could possibly help is that they might have names associated with them, the one on the demo cart is called "club scene" presumably for Casino Night as I stated earlier. This might give us a clue to early stage tropes and stuff, doubt they made a version of the whole OST though.
Crap, that's huge, IMHO. Still, not much surprised about reading that. We know there was this internal war between SoJ & SoA, but getting as far as hindering proper promotion of the games? Ouch! It now makes me wonder if Sonic2's development might've been discreetly undermined by SoA as well... Since S3K seems to have had a more stable dev progression, from the original concept to the final product.
They lost two months out of an eleven month schedule after they asked marketing if they wanted a Sonic 2 right after the smash success of Sonic 1, to which they replied "no it's much too soon" only for them to come back two months later as the team was working on another game and say "yeah actually we need it now." - source. Its probably that major reason why we all missed out on Hidden Palace and Cyber City because of all that time robbed by those assholes from SOA's marketing. Lol yeah, SOA undermined the dev team alright.
For those who aren't familiar, holding a hand up with 4 fingers shown is akin to a racial slur in Japan, kind of like using the middle finger, only targeted at a specific class of person. Specifically, 部落民, aka Burakumin, which are descendants of "outcasts" of people in japan who worked 穢れ (defilement) jobs such as executioners, undertakers, slaughterhouse butchers, etc. These people are traditionally the lowest caste in japan, and were for many periods of history forced to live in outcast villages or ghettos. Even after the caste system was abolished, descendants of burakumin were still ostracized and mocked with a 4-finger gesture, which mimicked the way they would tend to lose fingers in the menial jobs they worked in factories. As such, in modern Japan, there are many activist groups in japan that represent descendants of burakumin, such as the Buraku Liberation League, who fight against burakumin imagery. Four fingers is the most prominent example of such imagery, and nearly every company who does business in japan will give their characters five fingers to appease the burakumin descendant activists. Those who don't, like Disney, tend to make extremely large donations to burakumin foundations instead to get around the stigma. You can find tons, and tons of examples of western media which alter their characters or other properties to remove the four fingers: The Sonic 2 USA box art prominently features Robotnik with 4 fingers, which is what is being referred to here:
@Cooljerk there's also the thing with yakuza that when a member makes a mistake they may risk losing a finger as punishment. At least that was the reason I usually heard and read around, didn't know there was another social minority in Japan to account... Learning new stuff almost every day ^^" Maybe Greg Martin didn't like spaghetti legs and wanted Sonic to seem more anatomically acceptable to humans? Just a wild guess.
This is a western internet myth that has no baring in Japan. The four finger slur has nothing to do with yakuza, there is no movement in japan to hide four fingers due to yakuza. For one, yakuza with four fingers have no stigma about them in Japan. It is not a slur in any way in Japan to compare yourself to four fingered yakuza, nor are four fingered yakuza seen as lower class (the opposite, they have paid their debt and are in good standing again). The way yakuza operate in japan, it would make no sense for any imitation of their rituals to be considered a slur. The four finger slur is owed solely to burakumin. Ask any japanese person what the four finger slur refers to, and nobody will ever mention yakuza. The meaning behind holding up 4 fingers is to imply someone is very low class, to call them a dog or an animal, and Yakuza are the exact opposite of this. You would never insinuate in japan that the Yakuza are low class citizens, they are basically the exact opposite. Also note that 指詰め, the practice of cutting off one's finger in the Yakuza, is not a punishment, it's an atonement. As in, you are not ordered to have your pinky cut off, you willingly offer your finger to atone for a mistake. It's not seen as a bad thing among Yakuza or the public, but the opposite -- someone who is willing to make amends for their transgressions. It's a way to show your honor. I learned of the Buakumin directly from Valve artist Jeremy Bennett who attributed the change on the box art for left4dead to the burakumin and the Buraku Liberation League, without a single mention of yakuza.
How is that more anatomically acceptable? He's just bending his legs weirdly in a pose that doesn't even make sense
I think they just defied Sonic Team's requests because SoA thought they knew better than them. Why? Just because. There's more than enough information on the making of Sonic, the Sonic bible, the making of the Sonic shows, the existence of Sonic Xtreme, etc that back this up. Just another move out of many before it and many after.
SoA thinking they know better than the other branches isn't exactly news, nor is it something that's entirely gone away...
I mean, it’s kinda hard to argue that SoA didn’t make choices that were for the benefit of the series - look how popular Sonic was between 1991-1997. In the UK, he was crazy popular and I believe the same to be in the US. In Japan, Sonic was never that popular, was he?
