You said, quote: I'm pointing out a new ability that was introduced and went missing near immediately until Sonic Advance needed it. But please advise your stipulation for abilities so we don't see this confusion again. Meanwhile, I don't see the Hard Boiled Heavies turning up again even in another classic game. However, your comment has just made me think of them as the precursors to the E-100 line, where Robotnik was inspired to construct them once he advanced enough. So thank you for adding to my interest in a single timeline. "I was testing the new model. Looks like there was a malfunction in the power transmission system." "There's the Tornado I left in your care if you need a plane, you know." "Hehe, this time I'm thinking of something even more amazing!" I'm not sure where he notes he was working specifically to outpace the Tornado, if anything the "new model" and "this time" suggest this is hardly the first time he's built a new plane, but still differs back to the Tornado. And by all means, you do you. But that doesn't mean others don't see a point: I would like to see Mighty and Ray translated into modern 3D and used in a similar vein to the New 252 Archie comics, but that would require effort on part of the story, rather than Sonic and Tails do things, Knuckles hurhur. If anything, Sonic Forces would have been a good place to 'introduce them', what with the situation being a 'world wide' issue. But no, we needed Classic Sonic again. I'm sorry, I forgot that changing the entire outcome of a world to not be a ruined landscape would not affect Silver in any way. Silver comes from the future... relative to us and Sonic. But he's still going into the past, his past, to change an outcome. It'd be like Sonic going into the past to change the ARK: yeah, it doesn't directly affect him, but it'll cause changes that will reach him non-the-less. The Classic Sonic situation is only more direct.
I think they will appear in a Mania 2. Encore Mode ended with Heavy King still online and ready to go. Encore Mode's ending to me felt like it was setting up a sequel game.
Which is silly because the games toss abilities in and out all the time. They have never been treated as SUPER important elements of continuity as the characters can just be said to not feel like using the ability that game. A game can use it one time and not another. Sonic uses the Instashield in Advance games. Its not comparable to new mcguffins, new villains, new characters or new developments with characters and new lore as the latter cannot be rationalized away in a way that doesn't cause issues with continuity. ...don't be obtuse. Sonic suggesting he can just use the Tornado followed by that statement implies his project is designed to outperform the Tornado, something in context is significant as otherwise Sonic wouldn't even bring his own plane up. Tails' prototype is something he is still struggling with. This is new territory for him. It makes no sense to think he made an innumerable amount of planes in the interim before this if Sonic is bothering to even bring up his own plane. "This time" implies he has tried before and failed as we see on screen. Therefore he cannot have made superior planes in the past. The games aren't a comic. The things you like about Archie in the comics as it was done do not translate to the plot of a game...let alone the plot of the game series to be quite frank. The structure of the games is usually tied to a singular overaching conflict of the week that is resolved and moved on from. \ You aren't paying attention. The reason its a problem with generations isn't just that time travel is occurring. It is the nature of Sonic interacting with his past self. Silver is not interacting with a past version of himself. There is nothing being lost by him interacting with the past in this manner. His vague future gets saved and that's it. In Gens the problem is Sonic going back in time and somehow not remembering all of everything that happened in Generations before he got to Gens, let alone his entire history, doesn't make sense, and the idea that he would just forget renders what little consequence or payoff the game has moot for no good reason that a religious and compulsive insistence to adhere to a single timeline...just because the notion of not having one feels like a barrier to canned characters that weren't gonna get into Modern anyway getting into Modern? I hardly see this as worth it or sound.
Gems Collection was released late 2005. Prior to that, Fang was a more prominent character than Bark and Bean. The Archie comics started putting the three of them in the same stories together early 2007. The idea of Fang/Bark/Bean as a trio came from the Archie comics. The window period between Gems being released and Ian Flynn putting the three of them together is very narrow. If the wider fandom was treating them as a trio during that tight window, I never saw it.
Yeah I agree, I didn't really see them as a trio until later. The Triple Trouble was Eggman, Knuckles and Fang after all.
Why are you arguing against your own point here? Yes, and I'm so sure they'll introduce something other than the Tornado into the classic games on this alternate timeline. So, like, 90% of comic stories, with the odd story arc... like a game sometimes does as well, as seen with Sonic Mania and Sonic Forces? I'm failing to see your point on this, please elaborate so I may better understand it? Considering Sonic doesn't quite recognise Green Hill, his favourite running spot, and Tails responds to Chemical Plant with shivers about the water, but doesn't quite know why, there is an implication loss of memory of those events in time is indeed in play. Ah yes, like how Honey the Cat would never be playable, until she was. Or Mighty and Ray would never return, until they did. But at this point, it's clear neither of us will agree. Let's just agree to disagree and move on.
I don't see what they can't put the classic characters into the mobile games. Classic Sonic is already in all of them, but he's all alone.
Mobile games don't mean much to be honest. Putting aside the fact that they're pretty much all grubby cash grabs (looking at you in particular, Sonic Forces mobile), they don't really offer much in the way of meaningful content for the characters, who are just glorified skins in the mobile games with little of the actual character coming through. Meanwhile, each and every appearance of Mighty, Ray and the Hooligans leaves the uncertainty as to how long it'll be before we see them again. They don't seem to be in Origins, and, being classic only characters, were only able to show up in the 30th anniversary comic, which in of itself was a one-off. If SEGA were to just do away with the idea of "classic" and "modern" dimensions, these characters could show up again in these works, no strings attached, and would even be more likely to show up in those mobile games, for those who care, because I'd say it's a pretty reasonable assumption that the reason they haven't already shown up in the mobile games is due to their being classic. It's a completely moronic policy that only serves to limit the setting and reduce its possibilities.
I just wanna say that Sonic's abilities are not lore, he just can do whatever the game needs him to do. Except the homing attack and the spindash, I guess those are canon.
That's a big assumption. The Classic-exclusive characters were grandfathered into the "Modern Sonic" era Archie comics before Sonic Team started paying much attention to it. The IDW comic series was made under the supervision of Sonic Team from day 1, and they've been more hands on with it. When Sonic Team brought Vector, Charmy and Espio into Sonic Heroes, they redefined their designs, abilities, personalities and role in series. Under the current working relationship with IDW, I doubt Sonic Team would be comfortable with transposing Mighty and co. into the Modern Sonic series as-is, and I doubt they'd be comfortable with game characters being redefined and redesigned specifically for the comics.
In what capacity? Very niche online circles maybe. The general wider audience and fandom was not aware of Triple Trouble. Its a late release Game Gear game. As said I believe some are overstating Archie here. I have little doubt more people were initially introduced to them through Gems collection than Archie.
The comics. Sonic the Comic had him as a recurring character, as did Sonic the Hedgehog (Archie). Do remember, the franchise is bigger than the games, and they would often feed into one another.
Relative to Bark and Bean, like I said. Yes, Sonic Triple Trouble was niche. Sonic the Fighters was significantly more niche. Outside of the games, Nack was a recurring character in the US and UK comics for years, Bean and Bark didn't show up in the US comics until long after the fact. Nobody thought of them as a trio in those days. Nack/Fang was a stand-alone character.
Again. I don't know how to stress this enough. I think the comics are being vastly overstated in terms of reach and relevance to the wider initial perception of these characters to the masses. They are relatively niche especially at the time. I have very little qualms saying I doubt it was most people's introduction to these characters instead of Fighters via Gems collection or learning about the game second hand due to Smash Bros Brawl Sonic's moves drawing from it Yes but I am not saying people were introduced en masse to these characters thanks to Championship arcade cabinets. I am saying it was though Gems Collection, where both games were given mass public access together and thus an association is created. I don't see why this is controversial. Seems more than sensible to me.
Do we have any actual data to indicate something's reach, relevance, niche-ness, etc.? Or are we just going off assumptions?
