Charmy In Sonic 1

Discussion in 'Engineering & Reverse Engineering' started by E-122-Psi, Jan 31, 2011.

  1. Elektro-Omega

    Elektro-Omega

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    Just played this and except for the obvious LOLFLYOVERLEVELS this is really good and when playing it properly it plays very nicely*. It really adds a small challenge without the jumping but also feels very familiar and nice.

    Very fun to play through.

    * Properly meaning not flying over absolutely everything.

    Edit: Added my little asterisk there.
     
  2. minichapman

    minichapman

    I'd like to think I'll be imparting words of wisdo Member
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    Staying sane.
    in b4 Heavy & Bomb in Sonic 1
     
  3. Black Squirrel

    Black Squirrel

    staying alert on the beach Wiki Sysop
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    This is great, albeit a pointless because it's taken away any challenge the game had to offer. If you could ever port over the combi system that might make things more interesting.
     
  4. Shadow Hog

    Shadow Hog

    "I'm a superdog!" Member
    <!--quoteo(post=553628:date=Feb 1 2011, 11:15 AM:name=E-122-Psi)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (E-122-Psi @ Feb 1 2011, 11:15 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=553628"><img src="public/style_images/retro/snapback.png"></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=553505:date=Feb 1 2011, 12:06 AM:name=True Dude)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (True Dude @ Feb 1 2011, 12:06 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=553505"><img src="public/style_images/retro/snapback.png"></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Hoping for Espio next, and a possibility of all Chaotix in one ROM after that.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->As said, I'll try Espio if I ever figure out how to alter wall collision so I can code his wall step move. Maybe also look into pallette rotating as well. Until then all I could give you is what South Island Adventure already made.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->Y'know, I could've sworn that all his gimmick really was was that you hold the jump button and suddenly the whole "fall off the wall if your velocity falls below a certain threshold" aspect of the physics was negated until you let go. It's been a while since I played <I>Chaotix</I>, so I'm not 100% sure (heck, I thought he did it WITHOUT a button press, which the US manual disproved).
     
  5. Ritz

    Ritz

    Subhedgehog Member
    He can also walk on ceilings and damage enemies from the front when running at full speed. A proper Espio hack would be awesome, but there'd definitely need to be some level layout changes to take advantage of his abilities since Chaotix sure as shit let them go to waste.
     
  6. E-122-Psi

    E-122-Psi

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    <!--quoteo(post=553668:date=Feb 1 2011, 12:52 PM:name=Shadow Hog)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Shadow Hog @ Feb 1 2011, 12:52 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=553668"><img src="public/style_images/retro/snapback.png"></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=553628:date=Feb 1 2011, 11:15 AM:name=E-122-Psi)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (E-122-Psi @ Feb 1 2011, 11:15 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=553628"><img src="public/style_images/retro/snapback.png"></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=553505:date=Feb 1 2011, 12:06 AM:name=True Dude)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (True Dude @ Feb 1 2011, 12:06 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=553505"><img src="public/style_images/retro/snapback.png"></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Hoping for Espio next, and a possibility of all Chaotix in one ROM after that.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->As said, I'll try Espio if I ever figure out how to alter wall collision so I can code his wall step move. Maybe also look into pallette rotating as well. Until then all I could give you is what South Island Adventure already made.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->Y'know, I could've sworn that all his gimmick really was was that you hold the jump button and suddenly the whole "fall off the wall if your velocity falls below a certain threshold" aspect of the physics was negated until you let go. It's been a while since I played <I>Chaotix</I>, so I'm not 100% sure (heck, I thought he did it WITHOUT a button press, which the US manual disproved).
    <!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    Yes, you press and hold jump button when you run or jump into a wall or ceiling and the you can cling and walk up it, let go of the jump button to fall off. As said though I have no idea how to make the character interact with wall collision in such a manner. Finding out would likely also be helpful to Mighty and Vector's wall cling moves however.
     
  7. Mercury

    Mercury

    His Name Is Sonic Tech Member
    I bet you're really happy that Charmy didn't wreak havoc with the palette like new characters usually do!

    This is how you'd make Espio work:

    <ul><li>The jump routine already checks if the character is jumping ($FFFFD03C if I recall) in order to limit upward speed if the button is released. Add a check here for a new press of the button. If there is, clear the jumping flag and set a new flag (I think $FFFFD03A or $FFFFD02C are free).</li><li>Clear the flag if the button is up in all character states (easily done by putting a check before where it tests for debug mode use at the beginning of the character's code).</li><li>Again in the jump routine, go to the part that makes him collide with walls (it ought to be easy enough to find, just search for code that clears the x velocity). If the flag is true when there's a wall collision, force a landing and set the floor mode to appropriate angle (this is most work, but it should be pretty easy to figure out).</li><li>Do the same thing in the solid object and GHZ solid wall routines, because the character can bump into objects and solid tiles. I don't remember if Espio can run on objects or not. You know, come to think of it, probably not because they're only designed for standing on top of. Which means you could skip this step unless you wanted to do some major overhauling.</li><li>In the code that tests if the character should fall if their speed is too low, and in the code that adds the "slope factor", have them exit if the flag is set.</li></ul>

    And Mighty:
    <ul><li>Upon collision with walls (just like Espio above) check for the button being down. If so, set a timer (say $FFFFD02C). Also set to the wall jump sprite.</li><li>In the character's states, decrement the timer if it is positive.</li><li>While the timer is positive, check for a new press of the button to jump again.</li><li>Also while the timer is positive, when it adds gravity, subtract a bit from gravity so he only falls very slowly.</li></ul>

    I was just thinking about it, is all. They're rough ideas but they give you the picture.
     
  8. Clutchy

    Clutchy

    That One Insane Guy Member
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    <!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Yay, a vid endorsement already. Someone's doing a Let's Play as well:

    -video-

    If they're reading this though, having a game with wall climbing programming is a far step behind ASM coding it. Sorry, fellas. :v:<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    Ah ok, I understand now.

    I'm the maker of the LP, great hack! I went through it on one run. Also, Emerald Master did co-commentate with me, he wanted me to mention :P

    Since he can't post as he isn't a full member yet, he made a comment on the video hoping to respond to you. I might as well post it for him:

    "Well E-122-Psi, if you can read this-I did read´╗┐ your post about Espio and Mighty, I didn't think to mention the coding difficulty. I would post to you on the Sonic Retro Message Board...so would Yoga, we both have accounts there, but sadly we're both "Pending Membership" users, sorry if we inconvenienced you, but we love your Chaotix hacks, hope to see more...OH, and Good Luck too!"

    I can understand how the coding is difficult, I don't full understand coding but get a hunch on how it works. But out of curiosity, what's the MAIN issue with the coding to making climb walls? I understand in a few of your previous posts you have no idea how the collision works, but is there a problem that is stopping you from doing so? Or do you just not understand the coding language with the collision?

    Sorry if I'm sounding like an idiot, I sort of don't understand coding at all really.
     
  9. Thank god Clutchy, you told E-122-Psi that. Anyway, E-122-Psi you sir you so damn brilliant, as I said a few minutes ago; "Knowledge comes with responsibility" and you sir have GOT IT! Your hacking is so cleverly thought through. All I can say is, do your best E-122-Psi...do your best. Also, if you want an early video made, Clutchy and I will be more than happy to do it. Just choose who you want to make videos of your hacks, they'll surely do it. Good luck on your later hacks, we'll be DYING TO TRY THEM, haha I'm joking, but keep up the great work.
     
  10. Amethyst

    Amethyst

    Member
    Nice to see a new s1 character hack.
    Keep up the good work!
     
  11. E-122-Psi

    E-122-Psi

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    Oh, you guys are members now. Yay.

    Anyway thanx for picking my hack for a LP. Don't worry about the wall thing, it's an easy mistake, coding is a confusing matter, all I'm saying is that I'd like to put it in as much as you but wanting to is different from being able to. The collision with walls and the coding and such that should be edited is an anomoly to me, Mercury puts a few useful steps for use above, but I'm still completely stumped as to what and where to code in (not to take away from your tutoring Mercury, I'm just not the quickest learner in regards to ASM). I'll need to look into the game's ASM a bit more.

    Anyway I hope you guys make yourselves at home here. :)
     
  12. <!--quoteo(post=553790:date=Feb 1 2011, 05:54 PM:name=E-122-Psi)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (E-122-Psi @ Feb 1 2011, 05:54 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=553790"><img src="public/style_images/retro/snapback.png"></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Oh, you guys are members now. Yay.

    Anyway thanx for picking my hack for a LP. Don't worry about the wall thing, it's an easy mistake, coding is a confusing matter, all I'm saying is that I'd like to put it in as much as you but wanting to is different from being able to. The collision with walls and the coding and such that should be edited is an anomoly to me, Mercury puts a few useful steps for use above, but I'm still completely stumped as to what and where to code in. I'll need to look into the game's ASM a bit more.

    Anyway I hope you guys make yourselves at home here. :)<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    You're very welcome E-122-Psi, it was a surprise though seeing JaxTH reply to Clutchy's video. Also about coding, I may not know anything about ASM except it's one of the most confusing languages I've ever seen but...BOY...I still know what you mean, having to fixes issues in a game is irritating but, it'll always make our desserts taste much better when we've fixed and improved the problems. But, don't you just love desserts when they taste better, I know I do!

    Also, thanks for the welcoming, I think we might be here awhile thanks to the warm welcomes. :)
     
  13. Clutchy

    Clutchy

    That One Insane Guy Member
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    <!--quoteo(post=553790:date=Feb 1 2011, 11:54 PM:name=E-122-Psi)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (E-122-Psi @ Feb 1 2011, 11:54 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=553790"><img src="public/style_images/retro/snapback.png"></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Oh, you guys are members now. Yay.

    Anyway thanx for picking my hack for a LP. Don't worry about the wall thing, it's an easy mistake, coding is a confusing matter, all I'm saying is that I'd like to put it in as much as you but wanting to is different from being able to. The collision with walls and the coding and such that should be edited is an anomoly to me, Mercury puts a few useful steps for use above, but I'm still completely stumped as to what and where to code in (not to take away from your tutoring Mercury, I'm just not the quickest learner in regards to ASM). I'll need to look into the game's ASM a bit more.

    Anyway I hope you guys make yourselves at home here. :)<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    Why thanks for the warm welcoming!

    I picked your hack to LP because of the fact me and Emerald Master were talking and he mentioned that a new hack came out, in curiosity I asked and he told me it was "Charmy the Bee in Sonic 1". I was thinking "wat" but I downloaded it and decided "Hey, since I'm probably going to LP Sonic 1 in the future, why not do a hack of the game to kinda set that up for people later on?" So, I decided to LP it to find out I was the first to LP it, hehe.

    It's a really nice hack overall, just the charging straight into enemies makes you get hurt and the hit-box is all messed up, plus some minor palette glitches here and there (You'll see in later part of the LP if you watch it). Are they hopefully going to be fixed? o:
     
  14. E-122-Psi

    E-122-Psi

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    <!--quoteo(post=553801:date=Feb 1 2011, 07:15 PM:name=Emerald Master)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Emerald Master @ Feb 1 2011, 07:15 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=553801"><img src="public/style_images/retro/snapback.png"></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=553790:date=Feb 1 2011, 05:54 PM:name=E-122-Psi)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (E-122-Psi @ Feb 1 2011, 05:54 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=553790"><img src="public/style_images/retro/snapback.png"></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Oh, you guys are members now. Yay.

    Anyway thanx for picking my hack for a LP. Don't worry about the wall thing, it's an easy mistake, coding is a confusing matter, all I'm saying is that I'd like to put it in as much as you but wanting to is different from being able to. The collision with walls and the coding and such that should be edited is an anomoly to me, Mercury puts a few useful steps for use above, but I'm still completely stumped as to what and where to code in. I'll need to look into the game's ASM a bit more.

    Anyway I hope you guys make yourselves at home here. :)<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    You're very welcome E-122-Psi, it was a surprise though seeing JaxTH reply to Clutchy's video. Also about coding, I may not know anything about ASM except it's one of the most confusing languages I've ever seen but...BOY...I still know what you mean, having to fixes issues in a game is irritating but, it'll always make our desserts taste much better when we've fixed and improved the problems. But, don't you just love desserts when they taste better, I know I do!

    Also, thanks for the welcoming, I think we might be here awhile thanks to the warm welcomes. :)
    <!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    True, it's all hard work but it's worth it to have a refined finished project (though admitedly Amy in Sonic 1 is about the one project completely finished right now). I can hopefully take Mercury's notes and after a long look at the ASM I can make something out of them (thanx by the way Mercury). I hope you try out some projects yourself in the future would be interesting to see what you think up. :D

    Careful not to waste all your posts however, hopefully you'll get a full membership until then though you have only 20 posts.

    The wall jump coding could be useful to get working though. Out of curiosity do you guys think Sally suits having it in her hack? It's something I wanted to work in from the start but couldn't get in.

    <!--quoteo(post=553802:date=Feb 1 2011, 07:20 PM:name=Clutchy)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Clutchy @ Feb 1 2011, 07:20 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=553802"><img src="public/style_images/retro/snapback.png"></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=553790:date=Feb 1 2011, 11:54 PM:name=E-122-Psi)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (E-122-Psi @ Feb 1 2011, 11:54 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=553790"><img src="public/style_images/retro/snapback.png"></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Oh, you guys are members now. Yay.

    Anyway thanx for picking my hack for a LP. Don't worry about the wall thing, it's an easy mistake, coding is a confusing matter, all I'm saying is that I'd like to put it in as much as you but wanting to is different from being able to. The collision with walls and the coding and such that should be edited is an anomoly to me, Mercury puts a few useful steps for use above, but I'm still completely stumped as to what and where to code in (not to take away from your tutoring Mercury, I'm just not the quickest learner in regards to ASM). I'll need to look into the game's ASM a bit more.

    Anyway I hope you guys make yourselves at home here. :)<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    Why thanks for the warm welcoming!

    I picked your hack to LP because of the fact me and Emerald Master were talking and he mentioned that a new hack came out, in curiosity I asked and he told me it was "Charmy the Bee in Sonic 1". I was thinking "wat" but I downloaded it and decided "Hey, since I'm probably going to LP Sonic 1 in the future, why not do a hack of the game to kinda set that up for people later on?" So, I decided to LP it to find out I was the first to LP it, hehe.

    It's a really nice hack overall, just the charging straight into enemies makes you get hurt and the hit-box is all messed up, plus some minor palette glitches here and there (You'll see in later part of the LP if you watch it). Are they hopefully going to be fixed? o:
    <!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    Yeah I'm gonna try working on the hitbox and make it smaller (it's TouchResponse, right fellas?). As for the charging, your invulnerability only last as long as his charging animation is running. I could lengthen how long the animation runs but he seems a bit too much of a game breaker as it is.

    Pallette glitches? That's odd since the only thing I changed was the yellow (slightly darker to suit Charmy's sprites).
     
  15. Clutchy

    Clutchy

    That One Insane Guy Member
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    <!--quoteo(post=553806:date=Feb 2 2011, 12:27 AM:name=E-122-Psi)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (E-122-Psi @ Feb 2 2011, 12:27 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=553806"><img src="public/style_images/retro/snapback.png"></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Yeah I'm gonna try working on the hitbox and make it smaller (it's TouchResponse, right fellas?). As for the charging, your invulnerability only last as long as his charging animation is running. I could lengthen how long the animation runs but he seems a bit too much of a game breaker as it is.

    Pallette glitches? That's odd since the only thing I changed was the yellow (slightly darker to suit Charmy's sprites).<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->


    Yes, things started shifting colors then the textures itself started breaking. It is weird, isn't it?
     
  16. JaxTH

    JaxTH

    Pudding Deity Oldbie
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    Jack shit.
    <!--quoteo(post=553801:date=Feb 1 2011, 03:15 PM:name=Emerald Master)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Emerald Master @ Feb 1 2011, 03:15 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=553801"><img src="public/style_images/retro/snapback.png"></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->it was a surprise though seeing JaxTH reply to Clutchy's video.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    Interesting. How so?
     
  17. Ranger

    Ranger

    BBQ flickies Member
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    Sonic and the Rings of Order RPG
    Hahaha, this is amazing. Charmy is such a little spaz when you get him going.
    ARE YOU SERIOUSLY A BEE
    LOOK AT HOW SMALL YOU ARE

    ...now I demand big the cat in sonic 1
     
  18. BSonirachi

    BSonirachi

    Opa-Opa takes flight! Wiki Sysop
    Great hack just like the Vector one, though Charmy's dash definitely makes him a game breaker and lessens some of the challenge. But hey, with it you could try buzzing around some stages like GHZ2 and continuously fly into badniks without landing to get a monster combo.
     
  19. Azookara

    Azookara

    take it from me, little buddy Member
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    hoboagogo?
    <!--quoteo(post=554054:date=Feb 2 2011, 12:23 PM:name=Ranger)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Ranger @ Feb 2 2011, 12:23 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=554054"><img src="public/style_images/retro/snapback.png"></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->...now I demand big the cat in sonic 1<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    Bionic Commando plus Sonic. You use the fishing rod to grapple yourself across the stage. You run really slow on flat ground (slower on uphill inclines) but downhill movement equates to ultra speed.
     
  20. Shadow Hog

    Shadow Hog

    "I'm a superdog!" Member
    <!--quoteo(post=554132:date=Feb 2 2011, 05:04 PM:name=Azukara)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Azukara @ Feb 2 2011, 05:04 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=554132"><img src="public/style_images/retro/snapback.png"></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=554054:date=Feb 2 2011, 12:23 PM:name=Ranger)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Ranger @ Feb 2 2011, 12:23 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=554054"><img src="public/style_images/retro/snapback.png"></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->...now I demand big the cat in sonic 1<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->Bionic Commando plus Sonic. You use the fishing rod to grapple yourself across the stage. You run really slow on flat ground (slower on uphill inclines) but downhill movement equates to ultra speed.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->Not to mention you can confuse the heck out of Ganondorf.

    Still, I, personally, was thinking less fishing rod, and more of that latter part. You wouldn't even have to roll, your weight would handle everything.

    Unfortunately the game would come to a screeching halt as soon as you met your first loop.