Sonic X Shadow Generations announced, releases Autumn 2024

This doesn't address the claim though, which is about whether there is precedent for SEGA charging a high price for a remaster with so little additions.

A better rebuttal would be that there's a difference between "Origins is overpriced" and "Shadow Generations cannot possibly be substantive". Origins probably didn't need to be $40, but being partially made of Thomley/Whitehead's previous work is not a strong argument as to why. If those ports had been released on consoles and PC for ten dollars each when they were actually made, I don't think most people would have complained that they were radically overpriced. Origins makes a lot of little changes and additions (new modes, graphics, music etc) and regardless of your feelings on those things, the idea that the game is only worth a theoretical sum of some of its parts is a flawed one.

Again, that's not to say it needed to be $40, just that I don't think it's a strong example of how SEGA could charge more money than the original Generations for what is, as far as we know, the unchanged original game with Episode Shadow added on, only to be made into a selling point worthy of existing in the game's title. The primary discussion around the original's presentation in the trailer has centered around how the aesthetic wasn't butchered the way Colors was. This is, in some part, probably intentional. But even then, it's not like Colors Ultimate named itself after Metal Sonic, or even the Ghost Wisp (which was a part of the marketing). But the audiovisual changes, however garish or unappealing you may find them, do at least distinguish it from the original version. I'm not saying it's unreasonable to be cynical about SEGA's financial decision-making with the games, but I think it's also fair to say it would be an escalation from what we've seen so far. Realistically I just don't think the game would be presented in the way it currently has been if it had so little to show for it.

 

I think it does. I thought Origins was coming in at a decent value when you compare it to what Nintendo looks to charge for a basic port with next to no added content or when you look at the asking price for Dark Forces at the mo

 

...Okay, well, it doesn't. I dunno what to tell you. The discussion is about whether SEGA would charge too much money without offering enough new or improved content (and if so, by how much). Saying "well Nintendo does the same thing" is not an answer to that question. If Nintendo's practices suck, that doesn't make SEGA's any more permissible.

Again, I'm not so cynical to think they would charge more money for the equivalent of the unchanged original with a free 15-minute DLC from the game everyone shits on. I think the way they're promoting the game suggests it's more substantial than just a tiny piece of the remaster, but that's only my guess, and I don't blame others for being less optimistic.

 

I think claiming that an S3&K remake from scratch is worth like $10 is kind of ridiculous, given that it wasn't as if Stealth and co had to do that shit for free. They also made engine changes too, and infrastructure work like that takes time and effort (and thus money).

 

I think £30 is the basic value most look for a compilation more so with added content. Nintendo on the other hand looked to ask for full price Skyward Sword ( a basic remaster with no extras) and then hide it behind an Aiibmo to unlock content.

 

Sonic generations was $30 on PC and $60 on consoles. Sega has been selling games at $60 recently (Frontiers and Superstars) so it's not out of the question for them to charge $60 for this. Also Generations was like a 6-hour game so there's no way there will be more than 3 hours of Shadow's story.

 

The thing is Generations WASN'T $60. It was $50.

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/boards/627223-sonic-generations/60847929

I fully expect this to be $60 but this is misinformation I've seen spread for years now because people forgot about this. Generations was $50 on release date.

 

You're right. I bought it on PC during a sale so I didn't remember the pricing correctly.

 

Nintendo definitely gets called out for this too (Have you ever visited a Nintendo community before? I specifically remember Tropical Freeze switch and Skyword Sword HD having a ton of controversy around pricing). But also they probably get cut a bit of slack because you can at least expect consistent quality and polish from Nintendo, unlike Sega who somehow managed to add new glitches into Origins compared to the mobile versions.

 

Yeah, people call Nintendo's shit out all the time. If someone wants to bring up Nintendo and remasters in order to deflect criticism away from Sega and Sonic Team, we can't pretend that there aren't also things like Metroid Prime Remastered, which had an insane quality of life improvement with the option to use modern controls, and charged only $40 for it. Also, I haven't played Skyward Sword (either the original or the Switch release), but pricing debacle aside I remember it being a major point in the advertising that they mapped the motion controls to non-motion inputs. Not what I'd call a "basic" port, but maybe that's just me.

Either way, this talk about the value of additions misses the point that Sega also launched Superstars at $60, which pretty much everyone agrees was way too much. The price tag is indicative of nothing.

 

I wasn't talking of a remake at all and sure Prime remake is good, but then so were the remakes of Yakuza 1 and 2. I'm on about what Nintendo looks to charge for the most basic of remasters. SEGA made a simple HD remaster of Valkyrie put in all the content and looks to charge a basic price in contrast to what Nintendo looks to ask for Pikmin or Zelda HD versions. Sonic Origins came in a basic price point one would expect to pay for a compilation and people need to drop this mobile phone tagline too; You can pick up a classic shooter on the mobile for cheap but when likes of Battle Garrega Ect come to consoles expect to pay more, or worst still what those rips off merchants at Limited Run games will look to ask and ship it years latter

I thought Sonic Origin's price was the basic one expected to pay for a collection of big-selling classic games

 

Nintendo Bad
SEGA Good

​

Anyways

I know the Shadow content is it's own self contained thing but I'm hoping for a skin option for base Generations. We already have a solution for Classic Sonic stages.

PC modders do not reply ​

 

Neither was I, I was talking about remasters. Not sure why the Yakuza remakes are getting brought up.

 

For many years, the only main Sonic game that retailed for $60 was Sonic 06:

Unleashed (HD) and Generations were both $50.
Colors was $50, although that was MSRP for Wii games.
Lost World was $50, when $60 was MSRP for Wii U games.
Mania was $20, Forces was $40.

Frontiers broke the streak. It and Superstars both launched at $60, full MSRP... albeit both were discounted to $30 by Black Friday, just a few weeks after release. I'd expect Sonic x Shadow to follow that trend, but I guess it might Colors Ultimate's lead and go for $40 instead. I wouldn't bet on it though.

 

They'd be pushing a Digital Deluxe either way.

Shadow the Hedgehog music pack for Generations + whatever else they could possibly implement...

 

We may have got wires crossed, sorry, but even on Remasters Yakuza Resmasted had 3 full games and came in cheaper or at much the same price as the Prime Remastered (just one game) and SEGA looked to add content for the Western version too. Also I didn't like how Nintendo handled the Mario 3D collection on the Switch either. I think SEGA do a better job and value. I just fail to see why Sonic is always called out.

Origin was a nice collection at the price I expected most corps to charge for a classic collection. Sure I get some unhappy at needing to pay £5 for deluxe content and I get that, I was unhappy at needing to pay extra for the classic music in Monkeyball, but it was only a few quid and all corps look to do that sort of stuff these days

Looking forward to the remaster of Sonic Gen and hopefully, the Shadow content will add 6 to hours of content (including cutscene etc) and some nice levels. The Shadow part of Sonic Adventure 2 was some of its better levels

 

The funny thing about Prime Remastered is that while it was still a solid release and priced pretty fairly for what it was, nothing will ever beat the generosity of Metroid Prime Trilogy on Wii, which gave you all three games for $50 including motion controls for 1 and 2.

Generations remaster I would peg as a $40 release, though maybe $50 justified by Shadow Generations.

 

at the risk of derailing:
- Primes 1 & 2 had Prime 3's motion controls backported to them without any real design or asset changes on the games themselves. I guess, aside from making Prime 2 easier for babies.
- Prime 3 ran on the same bespoke engine as Primes 1 and 2
- The Wii is so similar to the Gamecube architecturally that it's why Dolphin runs games for both

Prime 1 Remastered:
- Changed all of the game's visual assets including textures, models, and animations
- Added new control schemes, which were the proper dual-stick aiming ones if you're into that I guess
- Was using either a completely new or an updated version of their bespoke engine that had to be ported to a completely different console

the technical aspects of Prime 1 Remastered that had to be done is probably why we don't have remasters of Primes 2 & 3 out right now. It's not a matter of just looking at your E3 work and backporting that code (that you already technically did for one of those games), it was a lot more involved than that.

 

Well hey, you just gave yourself one example!