don't click here

As far as mechanics to attain momentum, I’ve long felt rolling was one of the weaker ones.

Discussion in 'General Sonic Discussion' started by Technically Inept, Jun 3, 2022.

  1. Xiao Hayes

    Xiao Hayes

    Classic Eggman art Member
    No, you aren't, but Sonic isn't supposed to be that kind of challenge. I mean, we could put spikes all along a ramp so you have to roll-jump-roll-jump to get the most of it, but it would be a bit tiring if that was a rule and not a single instance at most. My suggestion about terrain affecting how you move on each type of movement, for example, is complicated when a Sonic game has very different levels where conveying what each tile does to which movement option is nearly impossible, but it could work (and it did) in a game like Sonic R, as terrain is the usual thing of racing games, or in a game like Sonic Advance 2, where it would be an option over putting downward ramps constantly for levels that aren't much less focused on exploration than the ones in classic games.

    I mean, it's evident you like these games for at least slightly different reasons most people here do, and it's quite unusual to find a person who wants the tricks of the game to be some hidden puzzle or play like a rhythm game in ultra hard mode, so I'm not surprised most people can't understand your point of view or need serious explanation for it, that's why I'm grateful I got it easily and can help with it. I also think your request is totally legit and could have Sonic games designed around it, it's just that regular classic gameplay is about simplicity, which sometimes may be giving too much power to Sonic, but think it was replaced with the boost in newer games and now rolling doesn't seem that overpowered, does it?

    What you think about rolling is what most people feel about automation. When do I play if booster pads and springs are sending me from one side to another all the time? Where's my input there? In the case of rolling, there's input, but it's more about when you stop rolling than when you start doing so. Think about those tall e-shaped loops that ask you to roll on each and every of them: they usually end on a spring that bounces you back to a swapped path, but you can jump before the layer swaps and go over said spring to take the upper path instead. Of course, you could go down just running to control your speed, but you'll get a better result if you master when to jump at high speed. Not saying you have to be a pro player to achieve this, but there's a punishment for not knowing when to stop, and timing actions gets harder the faster you go, so it's still a way to test your skills.
     
  2. Palas

    Palas

    Don't lose your temper so quickly. Member
    1,081
    738
    93
    You know, I went ahead and looked for it in the act maps and couldn't find it either. I just have the most vivid memory of it. I must have gone crazy.

    The one comparable section that I'm sure exists is the one in Green Hill Act 1 in Sonic 1 SMS. I only know one way to finish the act in under 30 seconds and more than 50 rings, and that is to roll down the ramp with just enough speed to be able to control Sonic and have him bounce off the speed shoes monitor. Then you can run and collect rings a lot faster while still invincible from the monitor you got earlier. So I mean, that's a run-defining example, but tricks like that exist elsewhere too... I suppose. If I haven't actually gone crazy.
     
  3. Aerosol

    Aerosol

    Not here. Moderator
    11,163
    573
    93
    Not where I want to be.
    Sonic (?): Coming summer of 2055...?
    Well I better understand what you mean Tech, but I don't agree. I play other games for technical platforming challenges. When I play Sonic I do just want to send my blue boy careening down hills and through the air and stuff. It's simple on purpose, and I wouldn't have it any other way.

    I wouldn't mind what you're suggesting as an alternate character's play style though. Like an "Amy in Sonic Advance" situation.
     
  4. DigitalDuck

    DigitalDuck

    Arriving four years late. Member
    5,352
    438
    63
    Lincs, UK
    TurBoa, S1RL
    Even more than that - just hit the speed shoes monitor first, run back up the hill, hit the invincibility and roll down the hill. You fly off the ramp faster than the screen can scroll and you can hold right to be at the end of the level by the time the camera catches up.

    You can also do the same in Act 2 and softlock the game. Wouldn't recommend that.

    I added the uncurl to Random Levels Project and nobody used it - but I thought it was a good idea at least (you need as much control as possible when you can't learn the level layouts).

    It's one of the complaints I have about Mania - a lot of the game plays itself, I spend about half the time just holding down. It's definitely a level design issue than a mechanical issue. I guess the same is true of HCZ and FBZ in S3K (interestingly, two levels that also appeared in Mania) but at least in HCZ it serves to contrast the above-water sections with the underwater sections.
     
  5. Palas

    Palas

    Don't lose your temper so quickly. Member
    1,081
    738
    93
    Oh, I'm aware of that -- and you can fly off the screen even without the speed shoes. But, that way, you won't get 50 rings. So controlling the speed and the roll is crucial to avoid that.

    (I loved doing that in Act 2 as a child. It felt mysterious, like you'd reached a different dimension or seomthing).
     
  6. Brainulator

    Brainulator

    Regular garden-variety member Member