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All Programming Discussion Graphics, Audio, Engine Design, etc.

#646 User is offline Synergy 

Posted 20 March 2010 - 09:29 AM

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QUOTE (LOst @ Mar 20 2010, 12:51 PM)
I still think we need to see texturing first.


Like so?





#647 User is offline zemulii 

Posted 20 March 2010 - 09:36 AM

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Oh wow. That looks really cool smile.png. Thank god you showed up wink.png.

#648 User is offline Vincent 

Posted 20 March 2010 - 09:37 AM

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Welcome to S2HD Synergy. ^^

#649 User is offline LOst 

Posted 20 March 2010 - 09:59 AM

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QUOTE (ICEknight @ Mar 20 2010, 04:25 PM)
Wait a second, regarding the boss arenas, why isn't this being considered for 16:9 mode?
QUOTE (T.Q. @ Feb 13 2010, 04:12 PM)


So this is a 16:10 monitor, but just adding a bit more of vertical scrolling does sound like the most feasable idea, as long as the hud stays in place when zooming in.

Sorry, not too keen on scaling the graphics (the quality decreases depending on how good your graphics card is, where the best result is blurry graphics, and the worse is TERRIBLE). The direction we will take will probably redesign the boss timings instead. Many things changed when we took the HD direction, as pixels are no longer pixels, timings will change no matter what we do really (it is not just bosses, but every slope Sonic runs in will change the gameplay, little by little). It is better to focus on making the game as close to Sonic 2, but in a HD way, instead of restricing on the old game (Sonic would run stairways if he only could touch the original pixels).

I will make sure the bosses are tested by you guys (as many times as needed), so that they are considered worthy. Only the very last resort will lead to scaling.


QUOTE (Synergy @ Mar 20 2010, 05:29 PM)
QUOTE (LOst @ Mar 20 2010, 12:51 PM)
I still think we need to see texturing first.


Like so?





I love how you made it possible to change colors of the halftube! I hope it will work on most 3D hardware. Then it's a win!
This post has been edited by LOst: 20 March 2010 - 10:03 AM

#650 User is offline ICEknight 

Posted 20 March 2010 - 10:18 AM

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QUOTE (LOst @ Mar 20 2010, 09:59 AM)
QUOTE (ICEknight @ Mar 20 2010, 04:25 PM)
Wait a second, regarding the boss arenas, why isn't this being considered for 16:9 mode?
QUOTE (T.Q. @ Feb 13 2010, 04:12 PM)


So this is a 16:10 monitor, but just adding a bit more of vertical scrolling does sound like the most feasable idea, as long as the hud stays in place when zooming in.

Sorry, not too keen on scaling the graphics (the quality decreases depending on how good your graphics card is, where the best result is blurry graphics, and the worse is TERRIBLE).
...But, by requirements of the S2HD staff, all the final art will be made in vectors. So if the sprites are saved at twice the size, everything would actually look better when zoomed in instead of blurrier.
This post has been edited by ICEknight: 20 March 2010 - 10:19 AM

#651 User is offline Canned Karma 

Posted 20 March 2010 - 10:52 AM

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Very nice proof of concept Synergy. How much flexibility is there around the shading? The is pretty flat in all the examples you've put up so far, not sure if this is the just a template you're working on or if that can be tweaked. The same goes for the geometry of the tube. There's visible jagged edges where the polygons connect. Can you up the subdivisions to smooth those out?

#652 User is offline Synergy 

Posted 20 March 2010 - 11:06 AM

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QUOTE (Canned Karma @ Mar 20 2010, 03:52 PM)
Very nice proof of concept Synergy. How much flexibility is there around the shading? The is pretty flat in all the examples you've put up so far, not sure if this is the just a template you're working on or if that can be tweaked. The same goes for the geometry of the tube. There's visible jagged edges where the polygons connect. Can you up the subdivisions to smooth those out?


You missed a word so I'm not sure what it is you were describing as flat wink.png If you mean rings and mines then yes, they're flat-shaded only because their temporary shader just outputs a straight colour, but they can be made to use any shader required. Again the tube can use any shader, it currently takes the procedurally-generated texture as a sampler parameter and then just fades it to a darker colour based on distance in the pixel shader. Because everything in the tube is also generated procedurally you can specify the number of subdivisions for both the semi-circle curve and the extrusion of the Bezier curves. Obviously the higher the subdivisions the higher the polygon count so perhaps this could be automatically scaled at runtime based on the player's hardware.

#653 User is offline Gambit 

Posted 20 March 2010 - 11:31 AM

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QUOTE (ICEknight @ Mar 20 2010, 10:18 AM)
QUOTE (LOst @ Mar 20 2010, 09:59 AM)
QUOTE (ICEknight @ Mar 20 2010, 04:25 PM)
Wait a second, regarding the boss arenas, why isn't this being considered for 16:9 mode?
QUOTE (T.Q. @ Feb 13 2010, 04:12 PM)
*image*


So this is a 16:10 monitor, but just adding a bit more of vertical scrolling does sound like the most feasable idea, as long as the hud stays in place when zooming in.

Sorry, not too keen on scaling the graphics (the quality decreases depending on how good your graphics card is, where the best result is blurry graphics, and the worse is TERRIBLE).
...But, by requirements of the S2HD staff, all the final art will be made in vectors. So if the sprites are saved at twice the size, everything would actually look better when zoomed in instead of blurrier.

While we could save things at twice the size required, that would pose a few problems.

1) Not everything is full vector, so the raster elements wouldn't scale up well at all.
2) Having to load even bigger files would be more taxing on the system.
3) When vector graphics are scaled up they don't become blurry, but you can start seeing each individual part of something, so they kinda break down in their own way. Here's a comparison of what vector art looks like when it's been zoomed in, and what the same thing looks like after it's been rasterized.



#654 User is offline steveswede 

Posted 20 March 2010 - 01:23 PM

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QUOTE (LOst @ Mar 20 2010, 02:59 PM)
Sorry, not too keen on scaling the graphics (the quality decreases depending on how good your graphics card is, where the best result is blurry graphics, and the worse is TERRIBLE). The direction we will take will probably redesign the boss timings instead. Many things changed when we took the HD direction, as pixels are no longer pixels, timings will change no matter what we do really (it is not just bosses, but every slope Sonic runs in will change the gameplay, little by little). It is better to focus on making the game as close to Sonic 2, but in a HD way, instead of restricing on the old game (Sonic would run stairways if he only could touch the original pixels).

I will make sure the bosses are tested by you guys (as many times as needed), so that they are considered worthy. Only the very last resort will lead to scaling.


I guess this may be the final nail in the coffin over the Aquatic Ruin Boss. I hope the final decision for the game is an extended boss area, as well for the other boss arenas. It's the most logical in my mind.

@Synergy

I'm liking what I'm seeing. Keep it up.

#655 User is offline Hamneggs 

Posted 20 March 2010 - 04:09 PM

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Ahem...

This is a fun little mockup:


Edit:

Here is a better one, with a revised backdrop.


And here is the backdrop itself. It's a modified version of one already submitted. Sorry I forgot your name, whosever it is.


And I HATE photobucket. Look at that crappy quality. And the backdrop was a much higher resolution before I uploaded it.

This post has been edited by Hamneggs: 20 March 2010 - 04:42 PM

#656 User is offline Drex 

Posted 21 March 2010 - 03:39 AM

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I'm going to have to strongly disagree. The 'better' one looks even worse. There is just way too much going on for such a simple layout.

#657 User is offline Hamneggs 

Posted 21 March 2010 - 07:03 AM

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QUOTE (Drex @ Mar 21 2010, 03:39 AM)
I'm going to have to strongly disagree. The 'better' one looks even worse. There is just way too much going on for such a simple layout.


Man, but what else is there? I'll make one with the normal background. It's bland as hell.

Here it is:



Now what I was thinking:

Synergy, is it possible to have the "pipe" reflect a skybox(something like the first one), and sonic and tails? Just wondering how that would look... And it still needs those ball and tube things, Just sayin'--I would have forgotten them if I were programming the SS.


#658 User is offline Master Emerald 

Posted 21 March 2010 - 08:20 AM

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That BG was made by me, and It's missing two squares =P.

#659 User is offline Synergy 

Posted 21 March 2010 - 09:50 AM

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I was wondering how a faint reflection might look - something to think about later on, and yep I know the ball and tube thingies are missing. Btw I took this screenshot of the full diamond background for reference, I think it pretty much wraps vertically and horizontally from there.



#660 User is offline LOst 

Posted 21 March 2010 - 10:59 AM

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QUOTE (Synergy @ Mar 21 2010, 05:50 PM)
I was wondering how a faint reflection might look - something to think about later on, and yep I know the ball and tube thingies are missing. Btw I took this screenshot of the full diamond background for reference, I think it pretty much wraps vertically and horizontally from there.


Don't forget the last Special Stage, when the emerald is about to be taken, the background flashes (using palette animation)


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