Retro Channel & S1@SAGE2010

After a pair of runs through LZ Act 2, I noticed that some Badniks fail to spawn sometimes (happened with the two Jaws near a pair of Ring Monitors near the start of the stage. Two times one of them was nowhere to be found). I noticed this too with a Buzzbomber in Spring Yard (Act 1 iirc), but I'm not sure what causes it (or the Jaws) to not to trigger properly.

Here is an example:

The same place, both times with no Badniks destroyed (as proof I couldn't have destroyed it without noticing), in the first pic the Jaws on the left is missing, while both of them appear in the second pic.

Also, again in Labyrinth Zone Act 2, if you are on those "conveyor belt" platforms and the Drowning music starts, if one of those platforms takes Sonic above the water surface, the countdown stops, but the Drowning music keeps playing, and when it ends the music stops completely (but I guess this always happens with the Drowning music, since it doesn't loop). I can't remember if this happens in the original game too, however.


And I'm not sure the HUD is supposed to change palette underwater (look at the numbers). And I'm pretty sure the HUD doesn't change palette in the original.

 

This is part of Marc's ingenious plan of introducing random unnecessary changes to the game while simultaneously not fixing real flaws like the S tube in GHZ1. :v:

 

Buggy bugs are buggy.

There seems to be a collision (?) error in special stage 5. The the red lines mark where there's an "invisible wall" in the stage. Its fucked me over in the full run.

Not sure if this bug was in the original, but jumping on this badniks head in Starlight Zone Act 1 will bounce you into the top of the screen and kill you.

 

No. You're touching the white/red circular block, which holds you tight until you jump. There's no wall there.

That was in the original, but should be fixed all the same.

 

I'm pretty sure theres a wall. I know its hard to see from the screenshot. So I made a fusion avi of it:

http://www.mediafire.com/?9155ms75btn231b

 

Okay, I apologise. There's a wall.

 

Yeah, you should do that. This is amusing.

 

It's definitely not there in the original; I have no idea how that bug could even come about either.

 

Before I waste a bunch of time trying to steal back the throne, I wanna know if there are plans to remove this glitch and glitches like it in the bugfix. (and subsequently all times obtained via the glitches) Don't wanna have all the time spent mastering this gltich faggotry be all for not.

 

I'm not sure if it's a glitch, but I'm really not sure what else to call it. A time shorter than around 20 seconds cannot be obtained without abusing a shortcut that requires the player to get stuck in a wall. I updated my post with a link to what I'm referring to.

 

Spot-on accusation, too, because that's exactly what I did. I just did it very poorly, hence my third-place finish.

I love how you call it faggotry, though. :3 I mean, there are glitches I can't stand too, such as the glitch used on the leaderboards for All Stars Racing. I've come to accept it as a normal part of speedrunning, though, so I don't complain aloud. Hey, if I can learn how to pull one off, more power to me, and the same to everybody else.

I highly suggest that you check the link in my sig, as we've had Sonic 1/2/3&K competition for years, and we've found most of this stuff. Some of it won't work in S1SAGE, though, such as any thing that requires going off the screen's top in Spring Yard (both Remastered and S1SAGE prevent this unintentionally, so I think the glitch is actually the solid top and not our methods).

 

^ Oh, hey, there are achievements on glitches. Another achievement's pic pointed towards a certain wallzip (not stating which in case we're trying to avoid spoilers), but performing it didn't trigger it for me, so I assumed otherwise. Now I need to try again, with more awesome to try to make the achievement trigger.

 

Funny you should mention Spring Yard, because the removal of the off screen antics is what prompted me to ask the glitch question in the first place. I'm actually still a tad curious to know why one has precedence over the other.

As for why I referred to the glitch as faggotry. It was on account of me and my chum pal spending the vast majority of last night grinding our way down to the lowest possible times we could muster (I could only achieve 22"39) in an attempt to defeat you. Then we finally discovered the glitch via the tubes and realized that all of our perfect timing and nitpicky jumping routines were all for not.

 

@SalamiDragon: The issue with Spring Yard is that I think Cinossu didn't consciously remove going over the top of the screen. I noticed the same behavior in Remastered when I was designing levels for it, and I asked Puto, who couldn't figure out why the behavior changed. It's not "precedence" because the original behavior in Sonic 1 isn't a glitch... rather, the changed behavior is. Think about the speed shoe at the start of Spring Yard 1: if you couldn't go over the roof past that section of slow-moving blocks, wouldn't it be kind of purposeless? It would wear off before it really got any use.

The idea of a glitch being "too gamebreaking" is always a matter of opinion, and I do have one. I just don't express it because I know it's not fact. I'm humored that the Labyrinth 2 time records aren't faggotry, though. I'd assume that's because you haven't tried competing in it. I don't want to claim that glitches are the intended way to play; I actively block glitches and over-the-screen-top areas in my hack with invisible objects and chunks along the bottom that kill the over-the-screen-top action via screenwrap behavior.

Oftentimes, learning a glitch is like learning a new route. Remember back when you used to slave through the rising water in Chemical Plant 2? You probably found out one day that it was much faster to use the secret top route along the level. Did you know it's even faster than that to speed past the entrance to that route and jump off the steep slope after the next double loop up to a later point in the level? The developers didn't intend that to be an option, I'd bet. It just happened to work due to the game's physics and a little bit of layout knowledge.

Oh, hey, Cinossu confirmed my Spring Yard theory while I was typing this. I'm not going to say too much more because this is a sensitive subject for a lot of gamers, and because I don't want a total topic derail, but just to explain some Sonic quirks with relation to this game's leaderboards.

 

There needs to be a wall glitch abuser achievement. I for one don't use wall glitches because I've never known where they are. So I suppose it's a good mission for those that don't know where to look.

Also...

That aqua lung is a cunt to get. Getting through Act 2 is cutting it really fine. I've got to the boss twice and died both times. I'm gutted if I was only a few jumps away from getting it.