Who would you want to develop new Sonic games?

Discussion in 'General Sonic Discussion' started by Rockman Zero, Sep 10, 2010.

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  1. Chimpo

    Chimpo

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    Atomic Sonic Part II
    <!--quoteo(post=504144:date=Sep 10 2010, 07:38 PM:name=AerosolSP)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (AerosolSP @ Sep 10 2010, 07:38 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=504144">[​IMG]</a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->My name is AerosolSP and I'm fucking retarded.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    They should have an entirely new take on Sonic the Hedgehog for a 3D environment rather than just take 2D Sonic and put him in a 3D environment.

    How about this example since you're so fucking stupid.

    Mega Man went pew pew in 2D games and got 8 weapons from 8 bosses and then destroyed a castle.

    Mega Man went pew pew in 3D games and explored caves, scavenged parts to make new weapons in the ruins of a large island that pirates are blowing up.

    New take on an old character.
     
  2. MegaDash

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    <!--quoteo(post=504134:date=Sep 10 2010, 10:25 PM:name=Chimpo)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Chimpo @ Sep 10 2010, 10:25 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=504134">[​IMG]</a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->They're replacing the wheels when they should be replacing their old beat up car.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    Hmm, yeah. That too.

    Is the car Sonic?

    <!--quoteo(post=504134:date=Sep 10 2010, 10:25 PM:name=Chimpo)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Chimpo @ Sep 10 2010, 10:25 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=504134">[​IMG]</a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Mario has had some questionable games and two turds (although those two not directly linked to Nintendo). Regardless, the point is that Mario's jump to 3D didn't end up like a Crash Bandicoot game where you go through a linear level. He was not chained to what the 2D games had him doing. His entire world expanded and his games turned into more about exploring his surroundings rather than jumping on all those damn cannonballs in the airship while crouching and the screen is auto scrolling and fuckthisgamethrowitoutthewindow.

    Sonic should be loose of the same chains. Don't make a 3D game that feels like a 2D Sonic game. Make a 3D game that would be fun and take advantage of the character.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    Funny. That's what I felt Sonic Adventure mostly achieved, sans the extraneous characters and less-than-perfect camera. Could've used way more adventuring and less characters and fishing, but it had some really sweet levels, really nice hub worlds to run around in, Jun's best work to date, a good rail-shooting segment with Tail's airplane, and a pretty epic three-pronged assault on the Egg Carrier. It took beloved recognized elements like the sand and snowboarding tropes and made good levels out of them, for example, but I didn't really "feel like" I was playing Ice Cap or Sandopolis. I felt like I was playing Sonic in 3D, and it was fun. Nothing got in the way of that, not even the camera and certainly not the physics. I went fast in each level, ran around, jumped around, the pace wasn't always breakneck every second, and I liked it.
     
  3. Aerosol

    Aerosol

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    Sonic (?): Coming summer of 2055...?
    <!--quoteo(post=504145:date=Sep 10 2010, 10:42 PM:name=Chimpo)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Chimpo @ Sep 10 2010, 10:42 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=504145">[​IMG]</a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->My name is Chimpo and I think this is funny.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    Which is what I was talking about when I said that little bit about taking Sonic and putting him in an environment where he can utilize his character-specific skills to get from point A to point B, and where the path he should take is only implied, not overtly stated like it is in Unleashed and Colors. That's not say they aren't fun in their own right, but they're a little bit gimped.

    Though, perhaps they are on the right track. If the level design were changed with openness in mind, and if Sonic had better ways to turn around when moving at higher speeds, there could be a real winner.
     
  4. Chimpo

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    Adventure was a nice attempt, but the formula was never followed up and refined in future games. Adventure also had some problems of its own as you mentioned, questionable characters and focus on their odd play styles.

    I'd rather see something different rather than revisiting Adventure again. I want to see a game that just screams Sonic in just about every way possible. That's something I can only see coming from Platinum Games.

    <!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Which is what I was talking about when I said that little bit about taking Sonic and putting him in an environment where he can utilize his character-specific skills to get from point A to point B, and where the path he should take is only implied, not overtly stated like it is in Unleashed and Colors. That's not say they aren't fun in their own right, but they're a little bit gimped.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    Fuck off bro, that's not what I want. Make your own damn post rather than say I don't know what I mean.
     
  5. MegaDash

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    Sure, absolutely. While we're at it, we can just go the full mile all Mega Man Legends style and make it a different character. Somebody's who's more of a snarky lovable bastard, but with some endearing character flaws like a shortness complex or ADD (read: not the best examples). He's still fast, yeah, but you're not expected to constantly run like you're in some contrived race track with an overarching time limit. Maybe make it an open sandbox world and cut all ties with previous continuities. Make the game branch off into another continuity, another universe, another time. Something like what Sonic the Movie did for the franchise: something completely different and yet so right. The gameplay can be anything: a jack of all trades with the sense and power of speed to amplify and guide the experience. Sonic could build up speed and run up the steep side of a cliff, then jump off and land somewhere or bounce right off the ground with a spinning roll. Or he could build up speed and bring down a thin tall column of weathered desert rock with a well-placed spindash; same with giant falling rocks.
     
  6. Aerosol

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    Adventure was a nice attempt, but I've always felt that that was only because of the pacing of the levels. For all intents and purposes, there was still only one way to get through most areas of levels. Any straying from the path was extremely brief, and alternate paths didn't have anything defining in them.

    Take Emerald Hill. As soon as the path splits, you get that big ass hill that you can rocket like a hedgehog possessed down and it throws you way up at the end. Yes, it's brief, but it was a defining moment in that path. Besides, that path still continued on, in case you didn't make it to the path above. Adventure has very few moments like these.

    Sonic games only need to be as fast as Sonic Adventure was. Compared to other platform games, it was fast. Hell, it still IS fast compared to other platform games. I think part of the problem now is that Sega is trying to portray Sonic games as the pinnacle of speed in all forms. Sega is trying to make Sonic faster than not just platform games, but racing games too. Of course, that's just my opinion. There are probably other reasons for Sega making Sonic what he is now. But I've always been tempted to compare the speed in Unleashed, for instance, to the speed in F-Zero games or Burnout Paradise, and that's just not right.

    And Chimpo...I was asking if that's what you meant. See the question mark? If I was telling you what you meant, it wouldn't have been a question.
     
  7. Greg the Cat

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    <!--quoteo(post=504145:date=Sep 10 2010, 09:42 PM:name=Chimpo)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Chimpo @ Sep 10 2010, 09:42 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=504145">[​IMG]</a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=504144:date=Sep 10 2010, 07:38 PM:name=AerosolSP)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (AerosolSP @ Sep 10 2010, 07:38 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=504144">[​IMG]</a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->My name is AerosolSP and I'm fucking retarded.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->Mega Man went pew pew in 3D games and explored caves, scavenged parts to make new weapons in the ruins of a large island that pirates are blowing up.
    <!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    Is it alright of me to say that Megaman Legends is overrated as fuck?

    Anyways, I get the gist of take Sonic and do something new on the other hand. And SEGA has indeed failed at throwing away that A to B platforming that's been plaguing the 3D titles since Adventure. However, would I want this new direction to feel completely unlike the franchise's game style?

    This is where I'd love to pull in some ideas from various people and games that worked. Let's take Sonic. Let's build up an entire world that is continuously built together in a map realistically, but with landscape, natural formations, and items familiar to us that says Sonic. Then take the formula that builds the physics and collision system from the original Genesis titles into a cohesive game that plays with Sonic's full abilities. Then we make a game.

    Tada. Then there's that whole new spin on the franchise that I'll let you configure.
     
  8. Namo

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    Personally, I liked Megaman Legends more for the story-telling and dungeon crawling. It's controls and combat are pretty shitty by today's standards. Not horrible, but pretty bad nonetheless. Since then though, they've invented dual-joystick pads, so the possible Legends follow-up will be easier on the controls department.

    Adventure could have been a lot better than it was. In the classic games, each character controlled largely the same, albeit with each one having its own little gimmick - Sonic's faster accel and insta-shield, Tails' flight, Knuckles' climbing and ability to break certain obstacles. If Sega had stuck with this mechanic, gotten rid of all the unnecessary dialog and characters, all characters go to the same stages, perhaps make each level either linear or open ended with alternate paths appealing to each character's special ability, it wouldn't be too far-fetched to say that it would have totally blown Mario 64 right out of the water.

    Then again, I can't say I'm disappointed with Colors' current status - it actually looks fun as hell. And hopefully in Sonic 4's case, when Knuckles and Tails are eventually added in, they'll have the same levels as Sonic, but again with the pathways that only Knuckles and Tails can take.
     
  9. Aerosol

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    You know, I never ever really noticed any "Tails only" pathways. It seemed like he went where Sonic went, but could skip certain parts cause he could fly.
     
  10. Shade

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    I'm holding out for a Capcom produced Sonic.
     
  11. Phos

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    I haven't seen any games out of Capcom that make me think they could really make a Sonic game. Most Capcom games use instant acceleration to one speed rather than gradual acceleration for movement. It isn't just Megaman that works like this. Maybe I'm forgetting something, but I can't think of a single Capcom game that uses gradual acceleration.

    I'd say Treasure, because they seem good at handling rare and unusual gameplay styles, and are good at keeping control schemes simple even in games that have many different abilities. I'd say they could do a 2D game, maybe a 3D game.

    Also gonna throw in Namco, though that is just because Hirokazu Yasuhara works there. If he worked on it, they could probably pull of either a 2D or a 3D game.

    If Psygnosis still existed in their pre-Sony buyout form, they'd be pretty high on my list as well.
    <!--quoteo(post=503968:date=Sep 10 2010, 03:49 PM:name=Chimpo)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Chimpo @ Sep 10 2010, 03:49 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=503968">[​IMG]</a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Platinum Games.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    I'd be worried that they'd put in a bunch of really dumb cut scenes, but Sonic Team already does that, so it would probably be a net gain for Sonic in the end, but I still don't feel like a Sonic game is really the sort of game that they would be able to make well, it seems outside of their usual endeavors.

    I do think your analogy is interesting, it reminds me of the extremely long and poorly thought out development process that lead to the Bugatti Veyron. When they were designing the Veyron, they designed its appearance before they worked out its aerodynamics, and this lead to long delays and the fitting of hydraulic (movable) wings to the car. The resulting car wasn't really suited (too heavy) for doing anything but driving in a straight line, and there are extremely few places in the world where it's even possible to bring the car to its top speed.
     
  12. BlazeHedgehog

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    Platinum would probably be a pretty good fit. They seem fairly tapped in to that sort of... high-energy, sarcastic "attitude" that used to define Sega.

    Naughty Dog would probably do a pretty decent job, too. They've made some great platformers back in the day, and Crash Bandicoot's original codename was apparently "Sonic's Ass" (because of the behind-the-back camera angle).

    Maybe try and get the Jet Set Radio team back together; even if they made a Sonic-skinned version of JSRF, I would probably be fine with that at this point.
     
  13. Spanner

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    What SEGA needs to do is form a new team which solely focuses on the classic 2D side of Sonic games and have them based in the USA or Europe, since it's obvious that the Japanese can't do good any more (see: Dimps). There's enough talented people around which could do something great, I mean look at Taxman's Retro Engine, which performs way better than the Rush Engine. He was able to create a recreation of Sonic CD on the iPhone and performed better than Sonic 4 on the iPhone.

    Just my two cents on things.
     
  14. Brad

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    I would seriously find it sad to come to the point where SEGA has to sell their mascot - the one thing that defines their company. But they've proven countless times, again and again that they, nor Sonic Team have the know how to make a decent Sonic game anymore. Maybe it's because of Iizuka (which I do personally blame for all of Sonic 4's failures and Sonic games before it), or maybe it's because SEGA have lost their charm they once had - which can be seen from making <a href="http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_vBCSLbKJ7nI/SPd9Wu4MbuI/AAAAAAAAAl0/N9gjuQ-kCTU/s320/Sega+Memories_+NEW+Classic+Sonic+Plush+toys!+Whoo!.png" target="_blank">this</a> into <a href="http://sonicresearch.org/art/art.php?currDir=./Sonic/Wii_and_Nextgen&pageType=image&image=nextg_sonic.png" target="_blank">this</a>.

    Maybe the solution is giving Sonic Team and new perspective on things? <a href="http://www.segabits.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2010/08/nightsqa_iizuka.jpg" target="_blank">(By firing this stupid twat.)</a> Maybe giving Nintendo a window to develop a Sonic game (seriously, the model they made for Brawl was awesome) could be fruitful. SEGA need to get their act together on the direction they want to take Sonic in the future, or else the hedgehog isn't gonna be milking anymore cash in sooner than they think.
     
  15. Aerosol

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    No one is talking about selling Sonic. We're talking about outsourcing to people other than Dimps. Speaking of Dimps, I had no freaking idea that they were a Japanese studio. Hot damn.
     
  16. NiktheGreek

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    <!--quoteo(post=504452:date=Sep 11 2010, 08:37 PM:name=AerosolSP)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (AerosolSP @ Sep 11 2010, 08:37 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=504452">[​IMG]</a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->No one is talking about selling Sonic. We're talking about outsourcing to people other than Dimps. Speaking of Dimps, I had no freaking idea that they were a Japanese studio. Hot damn.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    Just to clarify, the topic originally was very much talking about selling Sonic. Check out the time difference between the original post and when it was edited, nearly two hours. There are also a number of posts in the trash forum's pinned trash topic, saying "no one" and such in response to the original version of the question. That's why some posts, including my own, refer to the idea.
     
  17. Aerosol

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    Oh? I didn't see anything about selling Sonic in the topic post. I saw "give Sonic to someone else". I took that to mean let someone else develop Sonic, not completely sell the character, rights and all. Even looking at it now I don't see anything about selling Sonic off. My mistake.
     
  18. Shade Vortex

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    Ah, who I think Sonic should be outsourced to? Now, this might spark some controversy, but to add a bit of fresh air to the series, I think that the most appropriate developer to handle a good quality third party Sonic game would be Naughty Dog. I enjoyed the Jak & Daxter series, and even though they don't focus on speed, I do believe that those developers are fully capable of such a feat.

    But hey, that's just like, my opinion man. Obviously, other good choices are as said, Capcom, Konami and Nintendo. Maybe Team Ninja (What, I liked Other M!) as long as they kept the story simple without changing Sonic's personality.
     
  19. Dude

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    Definitely Namco. There are some other winners in this topic but namco is definitely the best choice given Yasuhara would probably lead the project. He could make even the worst sonic gimmicks ever fun to play somehow.
     
  20. Rockman Zero

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    <!--quoteo(post=504274:date=Sep 11 2010, 04:54 AM:name=SOTI)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (SOTI @ Sep 11 2010, 04:54 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=504274">[​IMG]</a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->What SEGA needs to do is form a new team which solely focuses on the classic 2D side of Sonic games and have them based in the USA or Europe, since it's obvious that the Japanese can't do good any more (see: Dimps). There's enough talented people around which could do something great, I mean look at Taxman's Retro Engine, which performs way better than the Rush Engine. He was able to create a recreation of Sonic CD on the iPhone and performed better than Sonic 4 on the iPhone.

    Just my two cents on things.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    I actually wouldn't mind this, as long as the higher-ups (read: Iizuka) at Sega of Japan butt out of project direction and don't modify the engine into something crappy. It'd actually be a sad day for Sega if they have to rely on something a fan created, originally meant to increase the quality of fan games. I actually kind of wish that when Sega finally decides to stop making Sonic games, they make Sonic public domain, so the community here could release GOOD games.
     
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