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Wave, Storm, Blaze, wtf?

Discussion in 'General Sonic Discussion' started by Artis Oracle, Jan 16, 2006.

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  1. Blazer

    Blazer

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    Mecha Sonic appeared in three stories: Sonic 2, Sonic & Tails' story of S3&K and Knuckles' story in S3&K. Also he had a "Super" form. Not to mention that he was the last enemy in Knucles' story. What more do you want to consider him a character?

    Yes, I'm talking about that one. I simply didn't specified because it was too obvious.

    I don't see how that is a argument valid about why he isn't a character. They reused the Robotnik bosses with EggRobo's sprite because they didn't wanted Knuckles, gameplay to be too different from Sonic's, or because they hadn't enough time to create new bosses for all of Knux' levels, or because memory limitations. But they wanted Eggrobo to be the main enemy of Knux' story. Therefore, he became a character. They probably did that to make us believe that Robotnik was apparently dead at that point, or that he left Angel Island.
     
  2. Wemes

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    As a computer engineer I couldn't disagree with you more. Re-using code is a wonderful, wonderful thing. It just makes things easier.

    All jokes aside, the only reason those levels would look worse would be due to the low frame rate of the game. I don't know if the game was any better on the GC or the XBOX because I only played it on the PS2, but yes I admit the game had its faults.

    Sure, the story had a few... ok maybe a thousand plot holes. And yes, guns and cars are lame. And maybe it was a bit laggy at some points (fuck, I don't really know now why I liked the game so much).

    I loved most of the music. And I espacially loved the pick-your-story gameplay. I think it's one thing to play the good guy and another where you get to decide to play the good guy.

    The one thing I truly HATE about the game is the sub-hero ending (Shadow is NOT some whiny emo bitch).
     
  3. Mystical Ninja

    Mystical Ninja

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    Sorry, I might sound stupid for asking this, but exactly HOW is Shadow "emo"? I've never seen him talking about killing himself, slitting his wrists, or any of that other junk. The only thing he ever did that was even remotely CLOSE to being "emo" was mourning over Maria's death. And just why WOULDN'T he be sad if he saw his best friend get shot?
     
  4. Because it's the easiest way for people to justify hating him, along with "angstasaurus" and "loved by n00bs." I agree, though - "emo" and "dramatic" aren't the same thing.

    And Blazer, Mecha Sonic did not appear in Sonic 2 - that was Silver Sonic. Also, what would I want in order to consider Mecha Sonic and Egg Robo characters? Well, for a start, personalities, backgrounds, and histories. Metal Sonic differs from Mecha Sonic in that he has a clearly defined personality with his own wants and needs, rather than being just another mute robotic drone. Also, Metal Sonic has appeared in several games, and is even playable in some, whereas Mecha Sonic never re-appeared after S3&K. And Egg Robo is just one amongst many mass-produced robots with no real distinguishing features.
     
  5. Guess Who

    Guess Who

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    1. He's black and red.
    2. He has red stripes down his arm. BLOOD STAINS IN HIS FUR, perhaps?
    3. Is clearly depressed often, whines about having no memory (if only we could forget Heroes and ShTH :no:).
     
  6. I hate so sound sympathetic towards a fictional character, but if you had amnesia, I'm pretty sure you'd "whine" about it too. And anyway, that's not exactly "whining." It's more "frequently reminding the veiwer."
     
  7. Blazer

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    And Blazer, Mecha Sonic did not appear in Sonic 2 - that was Silver Sonic.
    He is is a older version of the S3&K Mecha Sonic, and he is called Mecha Sonic in the japanese story. Sega of America changed his name to Silver Sonic in Sonic 2, but didn't renamed the Mecha Sonic of S3&K because he isn't silver. So both are called Mecha Sonic in the japanese story. And the japanese story is considered the canon one (the fact Mecha Sonic has different names in Sonic 2 and S3&K is one of the many flaws of the american story and that are proof that it isn't the real Sonic story).

    Also, what would I want in order to consider Mecha Sonic and Egg Robo characters? Well, for a start, personalities, backgrounds, and histories.
    ...How the hell would you expect that from a game that hasn't dialogues?

    Also, Metal Sonic has appeared in several games, and is even playable in some, whereas Mecha Sonic never re-appeared after S3&K.
    Metal-Sonic was appeared ONLY in Sonic CD when S3&K was released, so Mecha-Sonic had more appearances that him.

    Metal Sonic differs from Mecha Sonic in that he has a clearly defined personality with his own wants and needs, rather than being just another mute robotic drone.
    He hadn't a defined personality when S3&K was released.

    And Egg Robo is just one amongst many mass-produced robots with no real distinguishing features.
    Then how the hell come that he is the main enemy in Knuckles' story? He showed that he has artificial intelligence. He repared Mecha Sonic, repared (or recreated) badniks and the Robotnik's gadgets, and stealed the Master Emerald.
     
  8. Wemes

    Wemes

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    Taken from gamefaqs-


    Tell me that isn't emo.
     
  9. Look at Silver Sonic. Now look at Mecha Sonic. Try telling me they're the same robot.

    Perhaps by counting the games that include dialogues? Or by looking at official character bios - when Knuckles was introduced, bam, we have something telling us what his motives are, what his personality is like, and even that his favorite food is grapes. Nothing like that for Mecha Sonic.

    These two arguments are retarded. I guess that means that Tails isn't a character because he hadn't appeared in as many games as Sonic when he was first introduced? And that his personality can be discounted because it wasn't told to us in-game in Sonic 2? Look at all the games. Oh look! That's Mecha Sonic there in one level of S3&K! Meanwhile, Metal Sonic is in Sonic CD, Sonic Triple Trouble, Knuckles' Chaotix, and Sonic Heroes, and is a playable character in Sonic R, Sonic Drift, Sonic: The Fighters, Sonic Adventure: DX, and Sonic Adventure 2: Battle!

    How is he the main enemy? I already explained it to you: SKIN. CHANGE. And at what point did he do all that other shit? Never, as far as I can tell. Oh, and "artificial intelligence?" WELL, WOWEE. I guess we better call Crabmeats characters now, too.

    Also, Wemes, I think you just won that argument. Although, to be fair, people were calling Shadow "emo" before that game was even announced.
     
  10. Shade

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    Ah, but that's the beauty of the Megadrive games. The telling of simple yet engaging and, sometimes, fairly complex storylines with just the use of sprites and music.

    At least, I prefer that to the X-files reject stories we get in our Sonic games nowadays.

    As for the Robot Sonics, I've debated with enough n00bs on Gamefaqs on the matter prior to Gems Collection's release to make me sick the issue. You two have fun with that. Just keep in mind that it is official that Mecha and Metal are two totally different robots (or models). Remember the stasis tubes in Eggman's HQ in the Mystic Ruins' Jungle Area? Badda bing badda boom. That oughta help (or intensify) this debate.
     
  11. jman2050

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    Actually, regarding Egg Robo, I had always gathered that Mecha Sonic was the main enemy behind Knuckles' storyline the whole time, with the Egg Robo being a pawn meant to mimic Robotnik.
     
  12. Gibbo

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    Remember if Egg Robo was just another badnik then why did they include it in Sonic R? Sure it isn't really tied to the story but it shows that he wasn't just another badnik. I think he had a appearance in SADX in one of the bonus games. And as for the skin change, I doubt that he was just like all the other badniks. If you look at the ones that sonic fights on sky sanctuary the only thing they want do is destroy sonic now if you look at the ones in Knuckles Story, It seems much more smarter than a normal badnik.
     
  13. Good point. Although I think that was just to follow that game's theme of "metal version of existing character" for unlockables.

    Yeah, because it's trying to do so much more than just trying to kill Knuckles, of course.
     
  14. Ultima

    Ultima

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    Even games for 10 year olds need sex appeal these days.
     
  15. FinalBeyond

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    Saying how Metal Sonic was playable is a load of rubbish, if you don't consider Egg Robo a character. Both were graphical changes, with no gameplay difference.
     
  16. Mystical Ninja

    Mystical Ninja

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    I dunno, I've always stuck to the theory that Silver Sonic was a prototype that Robotnik started on, but didn't get to finish it, due to the fact that Sonic and Tails followed him to the Death Egg. So, he just let Silver Sonic fight how he was, and of course, he lost. Then, in Sonic & Knuckles, he was rebuilt as "Mecha Sonic". But this is just me.
     
  17. Blazer

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    Look at Silver Sonic. Now look at Mecha Sonic. Try telling me they're the same robot.
    Read what I said. IS MECHA SONIC. And he is a OBSOLETE version of the S3&K Mecha Sonic. But the fact that both use the name Mecha-Sonic in the japanese story should be enough proof.

    Perhaps by counting the games that include dialogues?
    They didn't feel that Mecha-Sonic needed to reappear in a game with dialogues. Does that mean that Fang isn't a character neither?

    Or by looking at official character bios - when Knuckles was introduced, bam, we have something telling us what his motives are, what his personality is like, and even that his favorite food is grapes. Nothing like that for Mecha Sonic.
    Then neither Tikal, Gerald Robotnik, Maria or the Biolizard are characters?

    These two arguments are retarded. I guess that means that Tails isn't a character because he hadn't appeared in as many games as Sonic when he was first introduced?
    ?_? I said that to point that Mecha Sonic is more important that a normal badnik. Also, Mecha Sonic is the only boss in Sonic 2 and S3&K that is a robot, instead of Robotnik in one of his gadgets (the sub-bosses don't count).

    And that his personality can be discounted because it wasn't told to us in-game in Sonic 2? Look at all the games. Oh look! That's Mecha Sonic there in one level of S3&K!
    The same can be said about the Biolizard.

    Meanwhile, Metal Sonic is in Sonic CD, Sonic Triple Trouble, Knuckles' Chaotix, and Sonic Heroes, and is a playable character in Sonic R, Sonic Drift, Sonic: The Fighters, Sonic Adventure: DX, and Sonic Adventure 2: Battle!
    Read what I said: METAL-SONIC WAS APPEARED IN ONLY A GAME WHEN S3&K WAS RELEASED. And not even Metal-Sonic had a defined personality.

    How is he the main enemy? I already explained it to you: SKIN. CHANGE. And at what point did he do all that other shit? Never, as far as I can tell.
    Ok, now you are starting to sound ridiculous. You are using retarded arguments. Do you think that I didn't know that most of the bosses are Robotnik with the Eggrobo sprites? I KNOW IT. And I don't see how that makes him less character. I SAID THAT THEY DID THAT BECAUSE GAMEPLAY. Also some bosses were exclusives of him.
    Going by your logic, Knuckles' story never happened because he goes through nearly all of the Sonic's levels. But I will say it again: THEY DID IT FOR GAMEPLAY PURPOSES. I am judging the Eggrobo as a character basing my points in STORY, no in GAMEPLAY.

    Oh, and "artificial intelligence?" WELL, WOWEE. I guess we better call Crabmeats characters now, too
    I don't ever will even bother to answer that.

    Yeah, because it's trying to do so much more than just trying to kill Knuckles, of course.
    Do you see other badniks creating and rebuilding Robotnik's robots, using Robotnik's gadgets, stealing the Master Emerald or being the main enemy in a entire story?
     
  18. Mystical Ninja

    Mystical Ninja

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    To answer that last question, Mecha Sonic used Robotnik's Egg -O- Matic at the Sky Sanctuary Zone, while playing as Sonic or Tails.
     
  19. Rosiero

    Rosiero

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    So? That doesn't mean a thing.

    And the Biolizard wasn't actually on the list either.

    Egg-Robo didn't rebuild Mecha Sonic. He was up there in Sky Sanctuary all that time. And he is a normal Egg-Robo; one of the endings shows an Egg-Robo coming out of the rubble of the Death Egg, I believe.
     
  20. Can you please learn how to actually freaking quote people? It's very hard to understand your points when they're all jumbled and disconnected like that.

    Also, to this:

    I don't know where you're getting this idea (maybe you just haven't played S3&K in a while) but none of this ever occured. The Egg Robo never built or rebuilt any badniks, and certainly never stole the Master Emerald. Calling him the main enemy is silly for reasons already stated, and I'm pretty sure that any of Robotnik's humanoid minions are capable of operating the Eggpod.
     
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