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Vector In Sonic 1

Discussion in 'Engineering & Reverse Engineering' started by E-122-Psi, Dec 24, 2010.

  1. MarkeyJester

    MarkeyJester

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    <!--quoteo(post=541771:date=Dec 27 2010, 11:31 PM:name=bolt7)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (bolt7 @ Dec 27 2010, 11:31 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=541771">[​IMG]</a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Maybe it'd make more sense to port the levels over from MD Sonic titles to Chaotix. Maybe these are silly ideas all together. :v:<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    Well it's been done before with <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n_Qs7qi-GeI" target="_blank">Sonic Crackers</a> which in a sense is a prototype of Chaotix, so why not? =P

    Anyways, I'd be more interested in seeing the older games physics being ported to Chaotix/Crackers rather than the other way around, though an acception to this hack would be cool...
     
  2. Black Squirrel

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    <!--quoteo(post=541032:date=Dec 24 2010, 09:38 AM:name=E-122-Psi)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (E-122-Psi @ Dec 24 2010, 09:38 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=541032">[​IMG]</a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->it's hard to quite calculate the stats of the players in Chaotix solo due to the ring co-op physics.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    [​IMG]
    The lobby has solo sections... though granted it doesn't have any loops or ramps. Also it's possible to lose your partner for a bit if you start running out of rings.

    In fact, I'm surprised nobody has made a hack of Knuckles' Chaotix without the co-op stuff. I mean we have Sonic 3D without flickies.
     
  3. The Game Collector

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    I think it's awesome how every once in a while a new character gets their chance at giving Sonic 1 a unique experience with their special moves. Now that Vector who was deemed probably the hardest good guy to fit into Sonic 1 has a hack, it gives me more hope that I'll see a hack of my favorite character playable in a classic Sonic game one day.

    One interesting thing I was thinking of questioning though is that maybe it would be easy to swap Nack and Knuckles with Sonic and Tails in Sonic Triple trouble so that most of the sprite artwork is already done. I would laugh if Sonic took Knuckles' place and Tails took Nack's place due to their similar shapes. The plot of Triple Trouble in reverse... I haven't seen much info on 8-bit hacking though. That would be a question for Doc Eggfan or someone like that with experience in hacking SMS & Game Gear.
     
  4. Thousand Pancake

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    <!--quoteo(post=541994:date=Dec 28 2010, 02:47 PM:name=Black Squirrel)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Black Squirrel @ Dec 28 2010, 02:47 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=541994">[​IMG]</a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=541032:date=Dec 24 2010, 09:38 AM:name=E-122-Psi)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (E-122-Psi @ Dec 24 2010, 09:38 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=541032">[​IMG]</a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->it's hard to quite calculate the stats of the players in Chaotix solo due to the ring co-op physics.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    [​IMG]
    The lobby has solo sections... though granted it doesn't have any loops or ramps. Also it's possible to lose your partner for a bit if you start running out of rings.

    In fact, I'm surprised nobody has made a hack of Knuckles' Chaotix without the co-op stuff. I mean we have Sonic 3D without flickies.
    <!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->I think that nobody who wants to is experienced enough with 32X programming to make it happen.
     
  5. bolt7

    bolt7

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    <!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Well it's been done before with Sonic Crackers which in a sense is a prototype of Chaotix, so why not? =P<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    Awesome! I'd never seen that before- I guess it makes more sense to use Crackers as already it has Sonic & Tails included and that it's a much smaller game (though still has most of the gameplay mechanics and such programmed in.)

    <!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->In fact, I'm surprised nobody has made a hack of Knuckles' Chaotix without the co-op stuff. I mean we have Sonic 3D without flickies.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    Would certainly be interesting! I can imagine a lot of the game would be quite difficult without a partner (as obviously it was designed with two characters in mind.) Maybe it's just the way I play Chaotix, but at some points if I couldn't use the 'Hold' thing with one character while spin-dashing with the other to gain speed, the stage would be impossible to complete. =X
     
  6. Ravenfreak

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    You don't need to much knowledge of how the 32X works, you just need knowledge of 68K asm and a Knux Chaotix disassembly. Awesome hack btw Psi, perhaps there'll be a Espio in Sonic 1 hack in the future? ^_^
     
  7. nineko

    nineko

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    <!--quoteo(post=542034:date=Dec 28 2010, 11:34 PM:name=Ravenfreak)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Ravenfreak @ Dec 28 2010, 11:34 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=542034">[​IMG]</a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->perhaps there'll be a Espio in Sonic 1 hack in the future? ^_^<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->You mean <a href="http://info.sonicretro.org/South_Island_Adventure" target="_blank">this</a>?
     
  8. E-122-Psi

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    Which, out of the existing 2D playable roster, leaves only Charmy, Heavy and Bomb remaining for the Sonic 1 treatment (I might try immitating Charmy's basic mechanics in Sonic 1 later on, I already have programming skills to have characters dash while on the ground thanks to Amy In Sonic 1). I also have a Cream sprite sheet planned which may be put into use for such a project.

    <!--quoteo(post=542011:date=Dec 28 2010, 03:48 PM:name=The Game Collector)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (The Game Collector @ Dec 28 2010, 03:48 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=542011">[​IMG]</a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I think it's awesome how every once in a while a new character gets their chance at giving Sonic 1 a unique experience with their special moves. Now that Vector who was deemed probably the hardest good guy to fit into Sonic 1 has a hack, it gives me more hope that I'll see a hack of my favorite character playable in a classic Sonic game one day.

    One interesting thing I was thinking of questioning though is that maybe it would be easy to swap Nack and Knuckles with Sonic and Tails in Sonic Triple trouble so that most of the sprite artwork is already done. I would laugh if Sonic took Knuckles' place and Tails took Nack's place due to their similar shapes. The plot of Triple Trouble in reverse... I haven't seen much info on 8-bit hacking though. That would be a question for Doc Eggfan or someone like that with experience in hacking SMS & Game Gear.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    The basic idea I'm going for with all these really, placing numerous characters into a classic game to practice with unique gameplay. Sorta like giving characters a chance to show their potential (still working on giving Sally an impressive gameplay mechanic). :D

    And which character may this be?

    It's a nice enough idea (along with maybe Tails playable in 8 bit Sonic 2, I'd love to see that) but right now like you said, resources and knowledge of 8 bit hacking is more limited, in comparison to Genesis hacking which is almost pick up and play with programs like SonED and MapED.

    About Chaotix porting, I have zero knowledge how to do so, I'm just trying to emulate the basic stats with Sonic 1's programming. I also felt that Chaotix was a much clunkier game in terms of physics so edits perhaps should be kept accordingly (how does Knuckles compare in this and the Genesis games for example?). What is competant in Chaotix is different to what is in another title like 1 or 2 after all.
     
  9. The Game Collector

    The Game Collector

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    <!--quoteo(post=542065:date=Dec 29 2010, 02:15 AM:name=E-122-Psi)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (E-122-Psi @ Dec 29 2010, 02:15 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=542065">[​IMG]</a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Which, out of the existing 2D playable roster, leaves only Charmy, Heavy and Bomb remaining for the Sonic 1 treatment (I might try immitating Charmy's basic mechanics in Sonic 1 later on, I already have programming skills to have characters dash while on the ground thanks to Amy In Sonic 1). I also have a Cream sprite sheet planned which may be put into use for such a project.

    <!--quoteo(post=542011:date=Dec 28 2010, 03:48 PM:name=The Game Collector)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (The Game Collector @ Dec 28 2010, 03:48 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=542011">[​IMG]</a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I think it's awesome how every once in a while a new character gets their chance at giving Sonic 1 a unique experience with their special moves. Now that Vector who was deemed probably the hardest good guy to fit into Sonic 1 has a hack, it gives me more hope that I'll see a hack of my favorite character playable in a classic Sonic game one day.

    One interesting thing I was thinking of questioning though is that maybe it would be easy to swap Nack and Knuckles with Sonic and Tails in Sonic Triple trouble so that most of the sprite artwork is already done. I would laugh if Sonic took Knuckles' place and Tails took Nack's place due to their similar shapes. The plot of Triple Trouble in reverse... I haven't seen much info on 8-bit hacking though. That would be a question for Doc Eggfan or someone like that with experience in hacking SMS & Game Gear.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->


    And which character may this be?

    <!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    I was going for Nack the Weasel aka Fang. I attempted to hack Sonic 1 and copy a custom sprite sheet pixel by pixel from a website I found after changing Sonic's palette to match his, but I failed after numerous attempts. Whenever I saved my work in Sonik Sprite I kept getting a gray box where the character's head is supposed to be and it wouldn't let me change it and would have to start over from scratch. I never could get it to work. I figured if I could at least get the basic sprites down first to match the basic actions, then I could worry about special moves and matching sprites for them later. He's not part of Robotnik's team and wants the emeralds for himself so it doesn't really contradict any storyline canon as long as he's not teaming up with anyone.
     
  10. shihe

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    This is probably my favorite Sonic 1 hack so far. E-122-Psi, you have outdone yourself once again. Your hacks are a bliss to play.


    Just today, I tried speedrunning some levels with several different character hacks, and Vector always comes in Top 3.
    He's A BEAST in Labyrinth Zone! Which is awesome because he's an alligator after all! Which I should mention... It's the first time I've defeated Robotnik in Labyrinth Zone 3 before he makes it to the top!


    I can't wait to see what you'll come up with next. I see you have an interest in Charmy. Perhaps to balance him out a bit, you could make him sloooow in water. (Bees hate water after all).

    I'll also eagerly await your Vector in Sonic 2 version if you ever decide to do it. (... and a Cream hack if you someday decide to make one...huge Cream supporter right here)


    Don't know what else to say. You've given so much life back to Sonic 1 with your character hacks, and Vector is my favorite. Amy comes 2nd.
    There's nothing like rolling off a platform, and immediately cancelling momentum by double jumping to the gound to start a new spindash. That's just sick! :D
     
  11. pyrotix

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  12. Ravenfreak

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    <!--quoteo(post=542057:date=Dec 28 2010, 06:14 PM:name=nineko)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (nineko @ Dec 28 2010, 06:14 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=542057">[​IMG]</a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=542034:date=Dec 28 2010, 11:34 PM:name=Ravenfreak)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Ravenfreak @ Dec 28 2010, 11:34 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=542034">[​IMG]</a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->perhaps there'll be a Espio in Sonic 1 hack in the future? ^_^<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->You mean <a href="http://info.sonicretro.org/South_Island_Adventure" target="_blank">this</a>?
    <!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->:v: Well in that case how about Charmy? Mighty's already been in Sonic 1 and of course so was Knux.
     
  13. Dark Sonic

    Dark Sonic

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    Lookin for characters to make a hack for? I'm betting you could make a legit Metal Sonic hack.

    Please make a legit Metal Sonic in Sonic 1 hack. Yes people have put him in, but he's never been complete as far as I know.
     
  14. This is an excellent hack! I love it when new characters get the Sonic 1 treatment.

    One little bug: Underwater, the air bubbles don't come from Vector's mouth! They come from where Sonic's head used to be.

    And another thing, if you plan on making another character hack, let me list all those that have been done already, and to what extent they were completed:

    <!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Tails in Sonic 1 - Flying 100% similar to Sonic 3, Sprites Sonic 2'ed.

    Knuckles in Sonic 1 - Gliding and Climbing present, Pallete issues fixed.

    Amy in Sonic 1 - New moves with hammer, new sprites in style of Sonic CD Amy.

    Eggman in Sonic 1 - Running animation and...thats it. Collision/gameplay were never finished.

    Mighty in Sonic 1 - Gameplay, Chaotix moves, and sprites all here.

    Vector in Sonic 1 - New moves, sprites, and even a few Chaotix moves!

    Espio in Sonic 1 - Spin Dash now his Twister move ala Chaotix, sprites all here.

    Motobug in Sonic 1 - Sprites, acceleration, and gameplay all altered.

    Metal Sonic in Sonic 1 - Sprites the only thing changed, and not all of them at that!

    Mecha Sonic in Sonic 1 - Sprites and Spindash present, Collision rewritten for larger character.

    Sally Acorn in Sonic 1 - New moves, altered gameplay, and sprites!

    Needlemouse in Sonic 1 - Sonic in his original form, with sprite changes!<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    And here are characters that were Genesized but weren't in a strictly Sonic 1 Hack:

    <!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Shadow in Sonic Megamix

    Chao in Project Shadow 2

    Manic in Sonic 1: Brother Trouble

    Sonia in The S Factor

    Silver in the S Factor<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    Thats all I can find. Any more?
     
  15. Arctides

    Arctides

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    Personally.. I'd like to see a decent Blaze hack. It surprises me that no one's attempted a half-way decent one by now.
     
  16. Vinchenz

    Vinchenz

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    I wanna see Super Mario in Sonic at some point. :P

    But this thread isn't the place for that, I don't think...
     
  17. shihe

    shihe

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    <!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Tails in Sonic 1 - Flying 100% similar to Sonic 3, Sprites Sonic 2'ed.

    Knuckles in Sonic 1 - Gliding and Climbing present, Pallete issues fixed.

    Amy in Sonic 1 - New moves with hammer, new sprites in style of Sonic CD Amy.

    Eggman in Sonic 1 - Running animation and...thats it. Collision/gameplay were never finished.

    Mighty in Sonic 1 - Gameplay, Chaotix moves, and sprites all here.

    Vector in Sonic 1 - New moves, sprites, and even a few Chaotix moves!

    Espio in Sonic 1 - Spin Dash now his Twister move ala Chaotix, sprites all here.

    Motobug in Sonic 1 - Sprites, acceleration, and gameplay all altered.

    Metal Sonic in Sonic 1 - Sprites the only thing changed, and not all of them at that!

    Mecha Sonic in Sonic 1 - Sprites and Spindash present, Collision rewritten for larger character.

    Sally Acorn in Sonic 1 - New moves, altered gameplay, and sprites!

    Needlemouse in Sonic 1 - Sonic in his original form, with sprite changes!<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->


    Did I miss something? I don't recall there being a Mighty hack that incorporates his Chaotix moves (aka, spindash and wall jumping). Would be awesome if there is. Megamix has him play like Sonic from Sonic 3. But I do love the shield-swapping ability. :D Leaves room for crazy stuff, like, infinite double jump.

    And Espio, from South Island Adventure, has a lot of incomplete sprites, I wish the creator would go back to finish it, because then it would be one of my favorite hacks as well. (Not to mention if he manages to make Espio walk and run up walls and ceiling)
     
  18. E-122-Psi

    E-122-Psi

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    <!--quoteo(post=542212:date=Dec 29 2010, 09:03 AM:name=shihe)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (shihe @ Dec 29 2010, 09:03 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=542212">[​IMG]</a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Did I miss something? I don't recall there being a Mighty hack that incorporates his Chaotix moves (aka, spindash and wall jumping). Would be awesome if there is. Megamix has him play like Sonic from Sonic 3. But I do love the shield-swapping ability. :D Leaves room for crazy stuff, like, infinite double jump.

    And Espio, from South Island Adventure, has a lot of incomplete sprites, I wish the creator would go back to finish it, because then it would be one of my favorite hacks as well. (Not to mention if he manages to make Espio walk and run up walls and ceiling)<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    Finding a way to code wall collision mechanics would be useful for many characters (I wanted to give Sally a wall jump as well). I guess I may have to look into Knuckles' climbing programming for that (especially for Vector, who basically uses a refined version of the move).

    As for all those entries, yeah if I remember correctly Mighty and Espio were more sprite edits or used alternative moves (not like I can talk right now since Sally and Vector are half finished), that said since they were kinda barebones characters outside wall moves it's not as evident. I already have plans for Cream (though that will likely just be a rehash of Tails' moveset, don't know to insert something like Cheese) and may work on Charmy later as well. I have very early ideas for Bunnie and maybe Julie Su as well though it depends on how their movesets would work out (Bunnie's Mars concept sounds rather complex).
     
  19. shihe

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    <!--quoteo(post=542224:date=Dec 29 2010, 09:30 AM:name=E-122-Psi)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (E-122-Psi @ Dec 29 2010, 09:30 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=542224">[​IMG]</a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I already have plans for Cream (though that will likely just be a rehash of Tails' moveset, don't know to insert something like Cheese) and may work on Charmy later as well. I have very early ideas for Bunnie and maybe Julie Su as well though it depends on how their movesets would work out (Bunnie's Mars concept sounds rather complex).<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->


    Idea: I know not too many people have hacked into Sonic 3 & Knuckles.. but how about copying a Super Flicky (Super Tails) to create Cheese?


    I also had this idea to use Cheese as a "yoyo" so that it wouldn't be too broken of a move. 8-Directional "yoyo" like attack with cheese, with limited range, and no homing in.
    And maybe you could give Cream some more horizontal momentum when flying (kinda like when you stop jamming JUMP button to fly as tails, and he starts descending slowly, but gains a lot of horizontal momentum in the process)

    Just ideas off the top of my head, I guess.
     
  20. JcFerggy

    JcFerggy

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    Why not just do a giant CHARACTER in Sonic 1 hack, where all characters are present via options menu. That will solve everything then :P