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Unpopular Sonic Opinions

Discussion in 'General Sonic Discussion' started by Londinium, Jun 17, 2022.

  1. Because Sonic was never meant to be an egotistical jerk to begin with, but that's kind of what he morphed into when he was reinterpreted by the localization team and since that's the version most people are aware of, that's the version we got.


    I've kind of grown tired of arguing about different Sonic interpretations to be honest. The writing for this series just does whatever it needs to get the story to happen, and doesn't have any problem contradicting itself to do that.
     
  2. Taylor

    Taylor

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    The devs said they were inspired by Hollywood movies when making Sonic 06. I think that's what people usually mean when they say Sonic 06 has the most ambition or whatever. It definitely does *feel* like something you'd see on the big screen while munching on popcorn.
    One thing that's odd about Tails is that he seems to be better at the tech stuff than Eggman, which both makes Eggman look kinda ineffectual and Tails' self-esteem problems forced.
    But yeah, when it comes to Tails I liked him best in Colors and SA1/2, and they both have opposite problems to me. In Colors the dialogue is cute even if he's playing second fiddle to Sonic, while in SA1/2 the dialogue is really wooden, but the plot lets him act far more independent than Sonic which is really nice change of pace. Under a better writer, that scene where Tails wants to avenge Eggman for "killing" Sonic probably would've been one of the most iconic Sonic scenes ever.
     
  3. BlueSkiesAM2

    BlueSkiesAM2

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    In the event of a remake, I was trying to envision how this scene could potentially play out in order to maximise its impact... and I just can't see it with the modern incarnation of Eggman lol. I can't imagine it being played as straight as it was back then with how they've treated Eggman since Unleashed/Colors (Colors mostly, but a tonal shift definitely began in Unleashed). Even with Frontiers trying to do a more serious narrative, it also had the whole mutual respect angle which makes it hard to believe the current Eggman would just yeet Sonic into space.

    Even with its flaws, I'd say it still is probably considered the most iconic scene of the series among a least a plurality of people. Iconic isn't really defined by inherent quality or our individual judgments, just memorability among the masses, and I think that scene stands out to most people when thinking of Sonic. What would you say it's competing with?

    IMO:
    Death Egg chase after Wing Fortress in 2
    Knuckles punching you out of Super Sonic
    Death Egg reactivating in Lava Reef
    Doomsday Zone
    Sonic CD OP/ED animations
    Metal Sonic race
    Egg Carrier confrontation (mostly due to watching it 6x - but it's also part of the attract screen/demo and was the climax of the first 3D game)
    Sonic busting out of the plane
    Shadow's introduction
    06 intro movie
    Mephiles appearing after breaking the sceptre
    Shadow taking off the inhibitor rings
    Sonic Unleashed's intro
    Sonic and Chip on the pier
    Probably Giganto and the other Titans now

    I can't really think of many scenes that I think would resonate widely past that.

    It's probably the fucking kiss though now that I think about it.
     
  4. Tails, imo, works best when playing off his insecurities. It makes him a perfect foil for Sonic, who is almost always self assured and confident. Just because he can do these amazing things doesn't mean he has the confidence or courage to back it up and that's what holds him back. It makes him a much more relatable character than Sonic to me.

    And they really do not leverage those parts of his character enough for it to be effective. Most of the time, Tails is either exposition dumping or playing the generic tech guy.

    And the Pontac and Graff interpretation of him isn't any better, because they just made him a dick.

    Its no wonder his story in Sonic Adventure is his most popular because its the only story to leverage those insecurities to tell a story.


    This is why Nine is the best version of him since forever. Flipping all of Tails' most well-known traits on their head and showing how exactly he would have became if not for Sonic.
     
  5. That One Guy Josh

    That One Guy Josh

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    LOL anything but the kiss.
     
  6. Taylor

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    Eh, I think even within SA2, anything involving Shadow is a lot more memorable. I think if the scene is remembered fondly its not really for Tails but because of how cunning Eggman was and Sonic being able to pull off chaos control, amping up his rivalry with Shadow.
    I do think if they remade SA2 they would just ignore modern characterization. The very idea of remaking SA2 requires them to break some taboos, like acknowledging Eggman has family :P
     
    Last edited: Jan 9, 2023
  7. Blue Blood

    Blue Blood

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    He calls Sage his daughter and one of his Memos says. "I get really knew my cousin, Maria".

    Even do, I hope that they don't remake SA1 or SA2 anytime soon because they'd be absolutely bloody awful with Sonic Teams current standards. Just see how they butchered Metal Harbour and the other SA2 stages in Frontiers.
     
  8. Battons

    Battons

    Shining Force Fan Member
    I would love an SA2 remake purely to hear mike pollocks version of Eggman talking about his grandfather in the credits scene.
     
  9. Taylor

    Taylor

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    Fair, but there's a difference between a one-off reference and a game heavily involving them. And while Sage is Eggman's daughter, she isn't his daughter by blood, which is what Sega has a hang-up with going off the comics, eg "Uncle Chuck" still being referred to as such but not being Sonic's uncle via blood
    To clarify, it seems like Sega is almost embarrassed by Shadow's backstory, since outside of that Frontiers reference, it never comes up anymore. I know he's moved on from his past but with how referential the series gets, it being almost entirely absent is strange. Does Sega think it might hurt their brand if one of their most popular characters was loosely associated with child murder? Of course we know that "Project Shadow" is going to be in the third movie so we'll see how much that changes things.
     
  10. Blue Blood

    Blue Blood

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    I dunno. SEGA have never seemed shy about referencing anything in the series long history. The only thing of note that's never come up again is "the kiss" from '06, but every other infamous plot has cropped up more than once.

    Shadow's past never comes up because he's barely been relevant for a long time. What else do you expect? Frontiers' reference to Maria was gratuitous (as we're most other references), but it was allowed. Shadow is also subject to some pretty harsh guidelines from SEGA, so he's difficult to use in things like comics and TV shows. That didn't stop SEGA themselves from publishing art of Shadow and Maria together on the Ark for the Channel however.

    I really think you're just confusing a change in focus for the series in the 2010s for being embarrassed.
     
  11. Dr Öl

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    Mad Space from SA2 is not a bad stage. It's hard to finish for beginners but when one learns what to do, at least I find the stage quite enjoyable.
     
  12. charcoal

    charcoal

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    I enjoyed it even on my first time through. Same with Security Hall, I thought they were both actually pretty great. I was actually shocked to find out that they're so hated on the internet.
     
  13. The KKM

    The KKM

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    IDW's Sonic the Hedgehog comic books
    No, the hangup is that introducing a family member is a big change and therefore one Sega gets to do, not comics. The problem with "Uncle Chuck" isn't that he's Sonic's uncle, is that he's Sonic's uncle made up by someone else other than Sega, and that's a big deal to randomly change a character's established relations like that.
     
  14. Dr Öl

    Dr Öl

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    Correct me if I'm wrong, but weren't the complaints about Sonics blue arms in the Boom cartoon?

    I'm personally indifferent to the color of Sonics arms or other small aestetical details. I think it's better to focus more important stuff like plot or characters (in case of cartoons) or gameplay (in case of games).
     
    Last edited: Jan 19, 2023
  15. Londinium

    Londinium

    People actually read these? Member
    https://knowyourmeme.com/memes/events/chris-chan-sonic-boom-protests
     
  16. BlueSkiesAM2

    BlueSkiesAM2

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    I don’t think I’d consider his arm color to be a “small detail.” It’s a pretty big part of his body proportionally and helps balance the design overall. There’s a reason Ōshima drew him that way. I wouldn’t lose my head over it but it bugs me throughout the Sonic movie and immediately put me off the Boom sub series upon its reveal (along with Knuckles *shudder*). I could have lived with the athletic tape and scarf, but the messy spikes and blue arms were too much. I always thought Amy and Tails looked decent enough though.

    Edit: Looking at the actual models, Tails and Amy don’t look good to me. Having never played the games or watched the show beyond a scene here or there, I didn’t know how they looked there. I was going off this concept art which is the nicest those designs will ever look.

    A5E71D75-A470-433A-9E93-471AE5BBB6FD.jpeg

    Still too much tape on Tails and Amy’s lower half is too busy.
     
    Last edited: Jan 24, 2023
  17. Crimson Neo

    Crimson Neo

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    Funny because to me, Tails and Amy's design there are literally better than the games' ones. I definely understand about Sonic and (I actually don't like it either, lol) especially Knuckles' case, tho'.

    Just to be cleat for Amy's case: when I say "better than the games' one" I'm mostly talking about her original Adventure outfit / style. I do think her Riders design ia fucking raw.

    I will say Vector without his headphones in Boom is pretty weird tho'.
     
  18. tearsofxx

    tearsofxx

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    Was never the biggest fan of 3 tbh..
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  19. Londinium

    Londinium

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    I didn't even recognise Boom Vector as Vector at first, I thought it was just some random character that used his model, or some cousin.

    Now that I think of it, it is kind of funny Vector kept his headphones in Forces. There's literal genocide happening and there he is with his fucking gold chain and headphones. What the fuck does he even listen to?
     
  20. charcoal

    charcoal

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    This, on loop 24/7