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Unpopular Sonic Opinions

Discussion in 'General Sonic Discussion' started by Londinium, Jun 17, 2022.

  1. Chimes

    Chimes

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    What we need is to build a time machine and to ask the real questions. Such as why Jaleel White wasn't set to voice Sonic in Generations! :eng99:
     
  2. Wraith

    Wraith

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    I can't think of a single thing they could do before that they couldn't do now aside from reintroducing Modern Sonic characters, which would not be "doing it's own thing" by any stretch. Superstars has new characters, mechanics and lore in it and that's what each new Sonic game, past or present, amounts to anyway as far as introducing new stuff.
     
  3. Superstars might be about as far as you can go and that's part of my point. If Classic can't go too far without "going as far as Advance or Rush." Doesn't that put a cap on what Classic can realistically do?

    What's the fine line between progression and stagnation here?

    Doesn't that make both branches kind-of redundant then if they're just doing the same thing besides the artstyle?

    And disclaimer, this isn't suggesting either branch should "die" or be removed, but I think it's pretty valid to ask what do these two branches offer from each other besides just the designs if they're going to continue.
     
  4. Wraith

    Wraith

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    Maybe if you look at it from an artistic perspective but that's not why the classic series exists.

    They exist because the classic designs are still popular for branding purposes IE: merch and that specific style of game can still pull in minor sales. There's not much more to it than that. It makes sense to section it off and grow it as a sub-brand from that perspective.
     
    Last edited: Feb 25, 2024
  5. See and I don't like that line of thinking, because it makes Classic feel like less of a valid alternative to Modern and more as just a means to sell merch. Being Classic didn't really help sell Superstars all that much if Sega are reporting that it underperformed (And yes, I know the launch price and the timing it came out are a factor here).
     
  6. Zephyr

    Zephyr

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    I dunno man, have you ever played one of the ten thousand romhacks and fangames that progress the gameplay in a variety of different ways? If we're talking about mechanics, I think you could "evolve" the Classic games in any number of directions that don't remotely resemble the Rush games. Keep the sloping level geometry, ball-based moveset, and rolling-physics (ie: the things that, as far as I'm concerned, meaningfully make up "Classic" Sonic's mechanical identity), and you could do all kinds of shit. Maybe implement proper online co-op? What about a Metroidvania? Maybe a "puzzle" game in the vein of the Sonic VR romhack. Maybe a level creator. Maybe even something in 3D! Those are just the things I'd specifically have them do if I had complete control. Any other person is likely to have a variety of ideas of their own.
     
  7. Wraith

    Wraith

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    If you don't like that line of thinking take it up with sega.

    It and Mania still sold over 1 million units which means it can do fine as long as they keep their expectations in check and go with release strategies that make sense. It might not be the best way to pilot the series but it's not an invalid one
     
  8. I guess I feel like you could do so much more with the brand besides just using it as a vehicle to sell merch, but then Sonic as a whole hasn't exactly lived up to my expectations whether its classic or modern. There's really not much else I can say if people are satisfied with how things are now.
     
  9. CharlaChale

    CharlaChale

    Little Dolly Member
    What the devil would a Sonic Metroidvania be like? Granted I don't have the best grasp of what Metroidvanias are like in general, but still I'd like to hear any ideas, if it's not too much of a bother.
     
  10. Wraith

    Wraith

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    Sonic as a whole exists to sell merch so I'm not sure what "more" you want from it exactly.

    If your problem is the games not being good enough that doesn't have a whole lot to do with things like the canon timeline.
     
  11. The timeline is admittedly less of a concern of mine, than the games being good. Especially with all of the lore changes as of late.
     
  12. Shaddy the guy

    Shaddy the guy

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    You're the one suggesting that Classic changing too much would make it something other than Classic Sonic. I'm saying that's not a problem, because we already have plenty of modern 2D Sonic outings and they're not exactly lacking in the elements I like about 2D Sonic, but clearly if you think there's a legitimate distinction there you must have some idea of what the limit is. I reiterate that I'm really not sure what you actually want.
     
  13. Zephyr

    Zephyr

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    Metroidvanias have a heavy emphasis on exploration. At the start, most areas are inaccessible to the player, but they eventually find an item that unlocks a new ability that allows them to access new areas. Some people describe this in terms of "locks and keys", where the obstacle that you need a certain ability to get past is a "lock", and the item that grants you the necessary ability is the "key". Sometimes the ability needed to overcome the obstacle is a double jump, other times it's a specific weapon, and so on.

    I've gone over how I'd do a Sonic Metroidvania before, but I'm sure others have different ideas.
     
  14. Kilo

    Kilo

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    Depending on your definition of a Metroidvania, there already has been a Sonic Metroidvania. The answer is just that you don't use Sonic.
     
  15. A said it before, but Knuckles' Chaotix being remade as metroidvania game (without ringstar gameplay) would be pretty awesome.
     
  16. Chimes

    Chimes

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    Sonic CD with a map.
     
  17. CharlaChale

    CharlaChale

    Little Dolly Member
    I don't agree but I'd be lying if I said I didn't think about CD for a bit there


    At the moment CD is probably my favorite Classic game, so maybe that's a sign I should give Metroidvanias a shot
     
  18. Jayextee

    Jayextee

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    I DONE MAKED GAMES.
    Sonic Adventure's not far away from being a MetroidVania; in Sonic's story there are literal lock-and-key moments (Windy Valley, Ice Cap access), and areas that are gated by ability usage (entrances to Casinopolis and Red Mountain; even if the latter's ability is literally right next to the entrance). A little obfuscation of these things, perhaps some expansion (SA2's moves, for example, could offer further lock/key scenarios to bar access to areas -- such as, for one example, metal crates barring access to an area until the fire somersault is acquired) and even the potential to do areas out-of-order (because what's a good MetroidVania without sequence breaks, huh?) and, boom, we're there.

    The pieces are already in the series, it's just a case of whether or not they'd ever be put together.
     
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  19. CharlaChale

    CharlaChale

    Little Dolly Member
    I feel like those lock-and-key moments would've been a better use for the Emerald Powers heehee
     
  20. Wildcat

    Wildcat

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    The thing is you are insisting that Classic/Original/Genesis era whatever you want call it is somehow a separate version now just because Sega decided to make more games in that particular style.

    They’re prequels. There’s nothing wrong with that. I get you and others do not like that but that’s what it is. I understand you don’t like it being 1 continuity but that’s Sega’s intent.

    It is kind of funny though because usually people like 1 solid continuity but you’re against it for art directions I guess and the guy in the video for tone reasons.

    Nothing is being held back from evolving. It’s all the same series. Sega is never going to abandon 2D gameplay.