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The Sonic the Hedgehog Headcanon Thread of Lore and Time Stones

Discussion in 'General Sonic Discussion' started by BlackHole, Aug 31, 2022.

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  1. Forte

    Forte

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    Ahh Headcanons, fun topic. Let's go:

    - Sonic 1 is a follow up to Sonic Manga, where Robotnik crashes the Sonic's Band concert. Then Sonic band just disbands, and he decides to dedicate his life to fight Eggman.

    - Knuckles story from Sonic 3 & Knuckles , runs concurrently to Sonic campaign. That's why Angel Island is unscathed in the first zone, and that's why Knux fights Eggrobo - because Eggman doesn't want to reveal his true intentions. Then, in the end he fights Mecha Sonic, while Sonic and Tails deal with the DeathEgg.

    - Gemerl actually has access to Emerl memories/databanks, but he's basically a different robot. Sonic doesn't interact with him much, because the memories of a friend, who he couldn't save are painfull.

    - The SMS games are canon, but it's *another time, another place* case.

    - Archie Comics, Fleetway, Boom, Sonic X are just another universes, but all happened and are canonical to itself. Sonic Chronicles too.

    - The "modern" chaotix remember Knuckles, Knuckles remembers them from Chaotix. They just don't reminiscent of the good old days.

    - Tikal still lives in the Master Emerald, but she doesn't show up, because Chaos is now at ease.
     
  2. Frostav

    Frostav

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    Okay I just had a serious brain blast about the nature of rings and chaos emeralds. For the record: I know the comics have their own lore about rings but I'm ignoring that because I haven't read them :V Also I'm not gonna try to explain rings in gameplay, I'm treating the Sonic world as if it's a world and not a set of video game levels.

    Rings are inherently linked to the chaos emeralds. You can use them to locate and find the Emeralds even if they're in another dimension (I know I said I wasn't focusing on gameplay elements but hey, there's special stages explained) They naturally spawn in spaces suffused in chaos energy, and can serve as a power source in and of themselves (hence why they have value to Mobians, though the "rings" they use as currency are pretty much fiat money at this point). Theoretically, you COULD become rich as hell just by searching Zones*, but it's so dangerous most don't really do it.

    I just realized that this headcanon also means that the main Sonic cast is insanely rich :V Also I guess you can explain their superhuman (superanimal?) abilities from all this chaos energy they're taken in.

    Chaos Drives are a special GUN invention made with the help of rings. By using multiple rings as a focus for chaos energy, it's possible to concentrate that energy into a crytalline form, which can then power GUN robots. We know GUN had several emeralds in their possession thanks to Security Hall, so in my eyes they were using these to manufacture GUN robots. This is also why Chao can take in the energy of drives--they ultimately derive from chaos emerald energy.

    *: New thing I came up with just as I wrote this: the word "Zone" has a specific meaning of "place that has enough natural chaos energy to spawn rings. Zones are bizarre, surreal, and vibrant because the immense chaos energy warps the landscape. If you're familiar with the tabletop RPG Exalted, then Zones are like the less extreme areas of the Wyld, then!

    One thing I've come to realize while thinking about this is that having only 7 emeralds is great for a game, but really really restricts what kinda worldbuilding you could do with them. There's just not...that many. Like, GUN having THREE of them in SA2 means they have nearly half of all of them.
     
  3. raphael_fc

    raphael_fc

    Overthinking Sonic timelines. Member
    - The One Canon Timeline that Sonic Team is pulling off is a result of different timelines/universes getting meshed together due to the Phantom Ruby at the end of Mania Encore. So before it, we had the modern timeline (1 - CD - 2 - 3K - 4 - Adventure - etcetera up to Forces), the classic timeline (SegaSonic - 1 - CD - 2 - 3K - Spinball - Chaotix - 3D Blast - R - Sonic the Fighters - Mania) and the Game Gear/Arcade timeline (GG 1 - GG 2 - Chaos - Triple Trouble - Blast - the Drift games - that popcorn game - that game in space - any other game I'm forgetting). At the end of Encore Mode, the Phantom Ruby made a mess with the timelines and now they merged to become one. So the events now all happened in the same timeline, with some differences from their original timelines due to they getting merged.

    - The events of Sonic Pocket Adventure and Sonic Chronicles happened originally, but after the merge of the timelines they do not anymore.

    - Spinball has 16 Emeralds but they are not the Chaos Emeralds we know - they are never said to be the Chaos Emeralds in-game anyway. Instead, they are a different set of Emeralds that exist in Mt. Mobius and they are able to transform thoughts into pinball.

    - The missing Chaos Emerald in Sonic 1 and in all the Game Gear games was trapped in West Side Island.

    - The Altar of the Emeralds in SA1's Angel Island is not seen in S3K's Angel Island because it was located after that bridge in which Knuckles pressed a switch to make Sonic and Tails fall into Hidrocity Zone.

    - The 8th Chaos Emerald in Sonic the Fighters was a copy created by Tails à la SA2. Tails intended to give the copy to Honey the Cat.

    - The Chaos Emeralds that was stolen by Fang in Sonic the Fighters is the copy, he stole it from Tails.
     
    Last edited: Sep 3, 2022
  4. BlackHole

    BlackHole

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    If he could create Chaos Emeralds on par with the actual Chaos Emeralds, why exactly did they need to go collect the set when he could just make more?
     
  5. raphael_fc

    raphael_fc

    Overthinking Sonic timelines. Member
    It is not a perfect copy, just like the SA2's version wasn't. And well, he never created any other fake Emerald after SA2.
     
  6. BlackHole

    BlackHole

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    Honestly, not sure why he doesn't. Even if they're not as powerful, they can serve as flares on any detection device Robotnik uses, like what happens in that game.

    Unless he has actually done that in the background and half of Robotnik's time is spent figuring out if he's found a Chaos Emerald or a Tails Emerald.
     
  7. raphael_fc

    raphael_fc

    Overthinking Sonic timelines. Member
    Maybe it's a technology Tails figured out and Eggman did not, so he thought maybe it's better stop doing it to prevent Eggman from learning how to do it.
     
  8. Xiao Hayes

    Xiao Hayes

    Classic Eggman art Member
    There are (or should be) more jewel sets linked to other forces of that universe. There will be a master timestone out there, and just like the 7th chaos emerald was alone in Westside Island until the rest came back to it thanks to the events of Sonic 1, there are other Illusion Rubies and their master out there as well. In Blaze's world, the jewel sets are elemental instead because it's an alternate reality, but there will be different sets too for water, earth, etc.
     
  9. BlackHole

    BlackHole

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    I agree with this. I've joked that I see what they're doing with the gemstones:

    Chaos Emeralds - Power
    Time Stones - Time
    Phantom Ruby - Mind
    Warp Topaz - Space
    ??? - Reality
    ??? - Soul
     
  10. raphael_fc

    raphael_fc

    Overthinking Sonic timelines. Member
    I thought about that as well but it doesn't work. The Chaos Emeralds have already space and time properties, and the Phantom Ruby too (if you don't count everything in Mania and Forces as illusions).
     
  11. BlackHole

    BlackHole

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    Remember bud, you're speaking to a master of total BS.

    The Chaos Emeralds are warping time and space, but only by virtue of overwhelming power: when performing Chaos Control, they pump so much energy into a singular point that they cause a singularity that causes the temporal and spacial warping. They're effectively creating mini-blackholes to perform the act, rather than directly manipulating the aspects of the universe.

    The Time Stones, meanwhile, are the true masters of time, performing the act much better and without needing to create a singularity. Similarly, the Warp Topaz, if it turns up in the games, would be able to open portals and otherwise move you in space without being dragged along like Chaos Control would do.

    The Phantom Ruby, I'm adamant Sonic Mania was entirely an illusion with the whole Knuckles cutscene, Metal Sonic, etc, and from my prior headcanon post I don't even think Sonic was sent to Sonic Forces from Sonic Mania:
    Anyway, basically the gems are able to 'mimic' the effects of their counterparts, but the true masters are able to do it much better.
     
  12. raphael_fc

    raphael_fc

    Overthinking Sonic timelines. Member
    Maybe it's easier if we don't copy Marvel. In Sonic each set of gems has a different property, while the Chaos Emeralds have all of them - including virtual realities.
     
  13. BlackHole

    BlackHole

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    Virtual Reality? I don't recall that one, do you mean the Special Stages? Sonic the Hedgehog (Mega Drive) confirms that's not the Chaos Emeralds, but distortions from South Island moving. I wonder if it's related to Subspace, since Flickies access Subspace from them in Sonic 3D: Flickies Island via giant rings, which is what we see, and both are seen on South Island...
     
  14. raphael_fc

    raphael_fc

    Overthinking Sonic timelines. Member
    I'm not saying we have already seen them doing virtual realities. What I'm saying is the Phantom Ruby does that, and if the Chaos Emeralds have all the properties of the other gems, they should have this too.
     
  15. BlackHole

    BlackHole

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    Oh, I said they can mimic them. All the gems can mimic the others:

    For instance, the Time Stones can make you 'invulnerable' because they'll simply stop the object in time before it can hurt you. They can let you move across space instantly by freezing time and letting you move over to said other point in space. They can let you make illusions by duplicating you in time where you need to be for the effect, or pulling from another timeline.

    All time-based manipulations to give you the same effects as the others, but they're not truly the same, just mimicry. The Chaos Emeralds mimic the Time Stones by creating singularities to get the time-based outcome, Sonic the Hedgehog (2006) has Mephiles use one to show Silver a vision of Sonic wreathed in flames, and the Master Emerald shows Knuckles the Egg Carrier during Sonic Adventure, so they can cause illusions like the Phantom Ruby as well...
     
  16. raphael_fc

    raphael_fc

    Overthinking Sonic timelines. Member
    - There was an adventure between Sonic 4 and Sonic Adventure. Eggman used Metal Sonic and that weird Mecha Sonic (mk 3?) from Sonic Adventure. Sonic saved Amy Rose from Metal Sonic in Windy Valley, as shown in Sonic Adventure. At the end of the battle, Eggman put Metal Sonic and Mecha Sonic in those tubes for recovering.
     
  17. Xiao Hayes

    Xiao Hayes

    Classic Eggman art Member
    I agree to the mimicry to some extent: I can see the Time Stones making Sonic "remember" that time he was Super Sonic and letting him transform thanks to that. That aside, I don't agree with Chaos Emeralds doing everything and more; they weren't mimicking anything in the classic era, they were just nuclear reactors of lifeforce. Phantom Ruby created the illusion of the whole modern era after Mania. :P
     
  18. BlackHole

    BlackHole

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    Nah, they're all more limited compared to their counterpart gemstones, so basically you can use them in a pinch, but you want the actual gemstones of the aspect you're after.

    For instance, Chaos Emeralds can freeze time and allow you to go back and forth in time via singularities. Pretty basic, but gets the job done. Time Stones, however, give you greater control, able to move back and forth along the time stream as and when you please, slow down time, speed up time, slow a specific section of time to a standstill, peak into an alternate timeline, draw something in from said timeline, etcetc.

    Chaos Emeralds can cause illusions... but only within the Chaos Emeralds themselves, which is pretty basic but got the job done for Sonic Adventure and Sonic the Hedgehog (2006). The Phantom Ruby, meanwhile, let's you completely overwrite someone's perspective with iliusions. The Phantom Ruby also gives someone telekinesis, seen with Infinite vs Silver, where as Chaos Emeralds would only be able to make you float by shooting power down to levitate you and otherwise push and pull with controlled power output.

    The Phantom Ruby can do 'time travel' by manipulating your and others minds to "remembering" yourself in the past, or casting a Phantom into the future to affect something you can foresee, and it can give you power and invulnerability via stopping anything coming at you with the telekinesis, but if you actually want invulnerability, you want the Chaos Emeralds for their massive power.

    You can use any gem for a very basic mimic of another gemstone, but if you want to have something more than very basic functionality, you want the gemstone of that particular aspect.

    Headcanons, what fun.
     
  19. Xiao Hayes

    Xiao Hayes

    Classic Eggman art Member
    But I said modern games are an illusion. :V
     
  20. BlackHole

    BlackHole

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    All reality is an illusion.
    [​IMG]