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The Sonic the Hedgehog Continuity Thread of Love and Timelines

Discussion in 'General Sonic Discussion' started by dredd, Jul 6, 2020.

  1. kazz

    kazz

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    The mural theory is like the only discernible connection I can make for why Shadow looks so much like Sonic. In SHTH during Lost Impact Maria discusses how the artificial chaos enemies were "based on the god of an ancient culture". How else would Gerald have known about this ancient culture? From research? Yeah, of the mystic ruins. Why is the mural theory dumb again?
     
  2. BlackHole

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    Because the mural in question is up on Angel Island, hidden away for the past 3000 years and the stuff of legends. We would need to assume Gerald somehow managed to get onto Angel Island 55 years ago, done research, then never mentioned "oh, and that floating island of ancient lore? That exists. Neat."
     
  3. kazz

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    Why does he have to and when would it be appropriate for Gerald to mention the floating island? I think that kind of thing is just kinda typical in this universe. IIRC the SA1 residents aren't baffled by its existence. In fact quite the opposite, they're surprised it fell! Now to be fair it is an unexplained mystery how exactly Gerald could have discovered Hidden Palace. But I mean, why does Shadow look like Sonic? Why would Gerald use Chaos as inspiration and then just stop there?
     
  4. Beamer the Meep

    Beamer the Meep

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    I think it's equally as foolish to consider that no one would notice an island floating through the sky in 3000 years. It's a significant landmass that travels all over the skies of the planet, it's not going to go unnoticed. We don't know what Angel Island was like 50 years ago. If he visited Angel Island, it's reasonable that he would have tried to take the Master Emerald with him and was stopped either by the surviving echidna guardians or after realizing it would cause the island to fall. In either case, being the man he was before his madness, it wouldn't surprise me if he decided to keep the Master Emerald a secret to protect the Island from forces that would abuse its power for destruction like the Ancient Echidnas did.
     
  5. BlackHole

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    Because they're already aware of it after the events of Sonic the Hedgehog 3 & Knuckles, as mentioned by that kid and probably clued in when the megatsunami hit without a corresponding earthquake.

    So, what, they knew Angel Island existed within the 3000 years, but when air travel and satellites were developed, especially with the technology to make a Bernal Space Colony in the form of the ARK, not one person ever decided to go have a look at the floating landmass and confirm Angel Island's existence before Sonic the Hedgehog 3?

    And I don't mean Gerald confirming it, I mean G.U.N., the ones who executed scientists for working on a project: I'm fairly certain they would've loved a floating landmass with an infinite power source.

    How would Gerald have even gotten to Angel Island without anyone else noticing for it to be his secret to keep in the first place?
     
  6. kazz

    kazz

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    It's impossible for a brilliant scientist to find Hidden Palace oh except for the time that other brilliant scientist found Hidden Palace at the same time as a hedgehog who found it just running around in a cave he found in a giant obvious pyramid.
     
  7. BlackHole

    BlackHole

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    Well, since people are adamant about Sonic Origins being the 'canon story', apparently that was a complete accident on Robotnik's part and Sonic was following him.
     
  8. Starduster

    Starduster

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    I mean. It is the canon story. There’s no two ways about it, it’s just a statement of fact, and these conversations would be less trying without the unnecessary snide digs at it.

    Anyway, while it’s not a theory I necessarily subscribe to, perhaps Gerald did visit Angel Island years ago with G.U.N. - we know it’s a military organisation with questionable methods and aims, even if it might broadly be described as acting in protection of humanity. With that in mind, I don’t think it’s unreasonable that the organisation would have intelligence on and an interest in a floating landmass said to be the refuge of the last survivors of a once powerful civilisation.

    I initially figured that, if Gerald’s did figure Angel Island, he wouldn’t have made it back in one piece, but perhaps G.U.N. had subdued the surviving traces of the Knuckles clan and possibly even played a part, inadvertently or otherwise, in the effective extinction of the echidnas. Genocide seems like something they’d want to cover up.

    Granted, that raises its own questions, such as why there’s no longer a G.U.N. presence on the island during Sonic 3 (maybe disassociation or just loss of interest), but I digress. I’m not about to back this theory to the hilt, I just don’t think it’s completely out of the realm of possibility that Gerald did see the mural somehow. Shadow’s resemblance to Super Sonic is most certainly a question for the ages.
     
  9. raphael_fc

    raphael_fc

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    I like the mural theory because I see no sense in Gerald creating the ULF as a weird giant lizard and then switching it to a small hedgehog for no fucking reason.
     
  10. Or there could be a second mural in the Mystic Ruins. Whatever the Echidnas believed to be depicted in Hidden Palace, they at least thought it significant enough to make a mural of it. If it’s that important, is it that absurd to think “Super Sonic” could be depicted elsewhere?
     
  11. BlackHole

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    And Sonic Origins would be less trying without the unnecessarily bad story, so it sucks for the both of us.

    I feel like G.U.N. would not leave the giant Master Emerald, an infinite source of power, abandoned on Angel Island.

    But we have an answer:
    [​IMG]

    Or there's a tablet, like the one Robotnik found while digging out the foundations of Final Egg pre-Sonic Adventure.

    It's always a tablet or a scroll...
     
  12. The KKM

    The KKM

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    Or maybe Shadow looks like Sonic because without it the story of SA2 doesn't work, and otherwise you're overthinking it and actively ruining the individual stories of each game by trying to connect them like that
    Why would Gerald decide to base him on a mural anyway? And why this one? If everything's interconnected, why does Shadow not just look like Emerl, surely that'd make more sense.
     
  13. raphael_fc

    raphael_fc

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    Because Emerl is not a life form in a biological sense.
     
  14. The KKM

    The KKM

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    sure, but why would he not just look like an organic emerl? same proportions, same body structure? then becoming black and red because of black arms blood? resulting in a creature about three heads tall, black and red, maybe with spikes since black arms also had spikes. with big eyes like emerl had, and a muzzle structure like emerl had. some biomechanical elements like the biolizard, like maybe some limiters on its limbs?
     
  15. kazz

    kazz

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    So the alternative explanation for why Shadow looks like Sonic is...jack? Shadow already looked the way he did in the flashback where Gerald and Black Doom discuss using his alien blood, and the same game confirms that Gerald knew about Chaos and the echidna tribe. You just not wanting SA2 to be connected to previous games doesn't make the mural theory dumb. Forcing Black Doom's involvement is where shit actually gets dumb.
     
  16. The KKM

    The KKM

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    Me not wanting SA2 to be connected to previous games is called me having eyes, staring at SA2, and seeing the only connections it makes is to SA1

    the "alternative explanation" is "sometimes things don't need to be explained"
    why does silver look like sonic
    why does tails fly without tangling his tails
    why did the echidnas have sonic statues
    why does sonic not collapse under the weight of his head
     
  17. Vertette

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    The Biolizard wasn't meant to be giant though, it just happened to grow exponentially. It's obscure but this factoid can be read in the report that Rouge digs up on the Ark's computer.
     
  18. BlackHole

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    [​IMG]
     
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  19. kazz

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    SA1 makes connections to SCD and 3&K.
    Well you did just force a fanon explanation involving the Black Arms (alien devil things) somehow being responsible for a hedgehog character having hedgehog quills
     
    Last edited: Oct 7, 2023
  20. I don’t view the headcanon as the resolution of a plot hole needing fixing (which is the worst way to view any media), but a fun unseen event that I think has evidential support. I understand why people wouldn’t share this feeling, though I disagree that doing so would ruin any of the games’ official stories.

    Why base creations on Chaos? Perhaps he was inspired directly by the Mystic Ruins mural, or perhaps it was an independent project that eventually took some visual cues from Chaos as an aesthetic in-joke. I see no reason why his second pass at the ULF couldn’t take even minor inspiration from another figure from Echidna myth when Gerald is pretty well established as an Echidnaphile. If he decided a hedgehog was somehow scientifically advantageous to a lizard, why not shape its quills to resemble the mural figure?