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The Sonic the Hedgehog Continuity Thread of Love and Timelines

Discussion in 'General Sonic Discussion' started by dredd, Jul 6, 2020.

  1. BlackHole

    BlackHole

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    I do always note it's my interpretation, but thank you for understanding my point of view on this.

    I personally like to keep everything together, but it's more a fun mental exercise seeing how things might fit together with the information given than anything. I'd love it to be the actual canon, but I don't quite have that influence on SEGA :V
     
  2. Pengi

    Pengi

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    You can have your interpretation. You were just misusing the term canon. If the owner of the property says that something is canon, then it is canon. That's what canon is. Canon is the official lore as dictated by the owners of the work of fiction. Fans do not decide what is or isn't canon, just as fans can't draw a piece of fan art and say that it's official.

    We've been told that Sonic Origins Story Mode is canon. If it ends up contradicting your fan theory, then that means your fan theory does not mesh with the official canonical story. The official canon isn't wrong for contradicting your fan theory.

    It doesn't fit. Triple Trouble's story starts off with Eggman having gathered the 6 Chaos Emeralds, and losing 5 of them. At the end of the game Sonic and Tails fly away on the Tornado.
     
  3. BlackHole

    BlackHole

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    Canon
    /ˈkanən/
    noun
    1. a general law, rule, principle, or criterion by which something is judged.
    "the appointment violated the canons of fair play and equal opportunity"

    2. a collection or list of sacred books accepted as genuine.
    "the biblical canon"

    My use of the term 'personal canon' is valid, as it's a general rule I judge the work by whether I consider it part of my timeline interpretation. There is nothing specifying canon as exclusive to the right holder. Official canon, I've no say on, otherwise it would be a lot more consistent versus the sheer chaos of the current state of things.

    So no, I was not misusing the term: if I were saying it were official canon, then you'd have a point because I have no say. My personal canon is not an official canon in the slightest, but that's why I usually preface with "interpretation of".

    Please can we stop combating one another every time you come in here?
     
    Last edited: Jun 10, 2022
  4. Pengi

    Pengi

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    The term "canon" as used in regard to works of fiction, is derived from the second definition: 2. a collection or list of sacred books accepted as genuine.
    "the biblical canon"

    The church, the authority figure, decided which gospels were "true" (canon) and which were false. It's a word that came into fandoms as a tongue-in-cheek bit of terminology, a term used to distinguish the real deal from the apocryphal.

    When someone asks if a particular Star Wars novel is canon, they're asking if it's an official part of the "true" Star Wars story, as dictated by the current owners of the Star Wars series.
     
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  5. BlackHole

    BlackHole

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    Well that's just confusing, so I'm sticking to using canon for anything with a distinct criteria for a series of works. The Sonic Boom canon, the Star Wars Legends canon, my personal canon, headcanon, etc. If you see me refer to my personal canon regarding the series, just know I'm not talking about official canon.
     
  6. Xiao Hayes

    Xiao Hayes

    Classic Eggman art Member
    What leaves me puzzled is that it seems the dictionary is canon about the word canon and we're not allowed to convey the meaning we're giving to the word canon even with adjectives, the ones usually allowed to it by the language canon, and instead we have to be very precise or else the canon police will take us to the canon jail.

    Ok, I've gone too far being a smartass but, come on, Pengi, you understand what he's saying when he's saying it, you don't need to constantly nitpick about that.
     
  7. @BlackHole I do dig your insights, and I know your theories are your personal headcanon even if you don't explicitly state such in every single post. @Pengi is correct though, without prefacing the term "canon" with something like "head" or "personal theory regarding" then you may unintentionally lead some readers to believe that such theories are confirmed canon.

    Hopefully that's the last on that lol
     
  8. Levi Church

    Levi Church

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    I listened to the Japanese version of TailsTube and they said Ivo Robotnik. The visuals didn't change.

    I read a lot of the comments on the video too (with Google Translate) and some of the Japanese fans were very surprised they used the Ivo Robotnik name.[​IMG]
     
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  9. raphael_fc

    raphael_fc

    Overthinking Sonic timelines. Member
    1:27
    - We know that in Sonic "Everything" is Canon, but I want to know, in a more organized way, how does this work? We know there are materials that are chronologically canon and cosmologically canon - like, we have things that can be canon to the main games universe, but others that are not necessarily canon to the games story or universe

    - (...) For a more concrete answer, something more cohesive than that, I'm gonna have to say "Be patient". Tails' Tube is the tip of the iceberg. There is more cohesion to come (...).



    13:03
    - You have to give a name to Sonic's World. Earth and Mobius are not allowed, you need to come up with something new that fits with it somehow, waddya do?

    - Well, it is Earth, so... I don't know what else you would call it.

     
  10. raphael_fc

    raphael_fc

    Overthinking Sonic timelines. Member
    I believe it's the first time since the one-world confirmation that Ian outright says the planet is called Earth. There were some other recent times that he called it 'Earth', but it could interpreted as just using some whatever name to refer to the planet without having to say "Sonic's world". But this time was blatantly clear.
     
  11. Starduster

    Starduster

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    Honestly, that’s fine. I don’t think discussions over the name ever had many legs detached from the two worlds debate and I think it’s a safer move than coming up with some cheesy new name for it. Plenty of media already takes place on Earths which are radically different to what we know and the name itself really isn’t a point of importance. It’s all just nice and straightforward.
     
  12. Plorpus

    Plorpus

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    What I want to know is if Mobius is around as a separate planet or not, like the Japanese Spinball manual infers. The Japanese Sonic Channel page for Spinball still mentions it, after all. Of course there are a number of reasons I doubt Spinball is even anything resembling canon, but perhaps the location itself exists in the setting of Sonic’s universe. That would track with the mention of it in the early 2010s Sonic bible.

    Maybe I should just drop Ian an email and see if he answers it on the podcast.
     
  13. BlackHole

    BlackHole

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    Y'know, I get the feeling he's the one pushing for this. How much influence do the writers actually get on the canon, anyway?

    2010: New writers who do not particularly care for Sonic, read wikipedia.
    Two Worlds are brought back from the US Continuity, which I am convinced stems from the reading wikipedia part, and continuity becomes a mess.

    2022: Ian Flynn begins writing, who has mentioned he finds Two Worlds silly, but it is what it is.
    One World is brought back, canon is suddenly becoming more cohesive...

    I mean, he's the one saying they were talking about the name. But we're back to Earth, fantastic.

    i'll try and make sure I use 'personal interpretation of canon' whenever it comes up, sorry for the confusion.
     
    Last edited: Jun 11, 2022
  14. Pengi

    Pengi

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    In the past few episodes he's casually referred to the planet as Earth several times, which is something he didn't usually do. But this is the first time he's explicitly confirmed it.

    An interesting new wrinkle on this is that the Veg-O-Fortress appears alongside the islands in the Sonic Origins map menu.
     
  15. Starduster

    Starduster

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    I don't think the Origins map should be taken at face value. I'd wager it's simply meant to be loving homage, with particular placement of South and Westside Islands being done as such to match their names.
     
  16. raphael_fc

    raphael_fc

    Overthinking Sonic timelines. Member
    I'm kinda confused about the Solar system. The planets from Colors are in this Solar system, right? What about Little Planet, is it part of the system or not? Where is Mobius? And the "normal" planets (Venus, Mars, Saturn), do they exist?
     
  17. BlackHole

    BlackHole

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    The Wisp planets I think were pulled in via Robotnik, probably via the Starlight Carnival fleet if I had to guess. Little Planet is probably a rogue, time travelling planet. It appears in orbit, comes down for a month, then disappears back into time.

    Best guess, Mobius is no longer a thing, it's just Mercury, Venus, Mars, etc.

    This is just speculation on my part, best to ask Ian Flynn.
     
  18. Roller

    Roller

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    I believe Ian covered the nature of Little Planet in a previous episode; it and Lost Hex are both just within the planet's atmosphere and not something seperate, two of many weird uncategorisable things in this strange planet's sky.
     
  19. raphael_fc

    raphael_fc

    Overthinking Sonic timelines. Member
    But is Little Planet really like Lost Hex? I mean, Lost Hex looks like Angel Island, just floating around, while Little Planet is actually a planetoid in outer Space as seen in Sonic 4.
     
  20. Roller

    Roller

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    It's inconsistent from title to title. CD's cutscenes and Origins agree that it's in the atmosphere surrounded by clouds, Mania's Plus update is technically ambiguous on distance but directly evokes the design as seen in CD's cutscenes. 4E2 and EM's cutscenes are the outlier, cool as they are...