Synthesizer used in the Sonic CD JP OST

Discussion in 'General Sonic Discussion' started by Shoemanbundy, Apr 24, 2009.

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  1. Shoemanbundy

    Shoemanbundy

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    Anyone know which synthesizer was used on Sonic CD? I'm guessing that it's a Yamaha DX7 or some popular FM synth of the 80s. I'm also wondering if the PCM audio for the past levels were programmed on the same synth or not. The sound quality seems to differ, though that probably it just due to it being generated through PCM, am I right?

    I'm mostly curious as it'd be fun to mess around with the same "sound" so to speak and make more Sonic CD-ish music with one. I'm no musician though, but in any case ;)
     
  2. Tweaker

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    I've had the same kind of question for years! I definitely know that there has to be some kind of Yamaha hardware involved, as I've managed to obtain the exact piano sample used in several of the more electronic-centered tracks in the game. I'm absolutely in love with the bass synths used and I've been on a quest to replicate them in any possible way that I could muster. So far, I haven't had much luck, but MaliceX sure got close at one point!

    If anyone with more experience with older sound hardware—and a good ear to boot—can offer any kind of insight or idea as to what Hataya used in the Sonic CD JP scores, then information would be much appreciated. The soundscape is absolutely phenomenal, and to me absolutely defines the "Sonic" feel more than any other Sonic soundtrack to date; I'd love to be able to replicate that.
     
  3. Rockman Zero

    Rockman Zero

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    You are absolutely right. They used a Korg M1, one of the best known synths/workstations of the late 80s, for the famous "house piano." They also used a Roland D50 in the "You Can Do Anything" intro for the Japanese soundtrack.

    Korg put out a M1 vst themselves, and it's spectacular (and can be bought for a lesser price than an actual M1 keyboard). The D50 is a different story though, because Roland is gay won't put out any updated version of their synths (minus the D50, they made a D50 expansion card for their V-Synth. The card is unfortunately discontinued now...

    I'm not sure about the DX7 though, but anything is possible. (I have a DX7 and programming FM sound is a PAIN to learn...that's why I find sounds created by others. =P)

    The past music was composed first, and then generated through the Sega CD's internal PCM.

    I wouldn't be surprised if Hataya used other digital samplers from the 80's, seeing how the soundtrack and dance music at the time was moving towards digital samplers.

    The "old skool" late 80s early nineties house-dance drums were generated through a Roland TR 909 Drum Machine...you can hear this extensively throughout the soundtrack. Perhaps a Roland TR 808 too. (Some advice: Find samples of these, because the 909 and 808 are in high demand, and fetch a hefty price)

    I'm sure they used other drum machines too, but I'm not too sure...

    Synth Mania offers demos of synth presets to listen to in case you have any further interest.
     
  4. SlushBox

    SlushBox

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    Damn, I'm late to the party... Funny that I was thinking about the soundtrack earlier today too.

    Anyways, yes, the Korg M1. Is there anyone who didn't use one during this time period?
     
  5. saxman

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    I doubt it's a DX7. Nothing in the songs to me sounds like anything that you'd hear on a DX7. Plus that keyboard died out at the end of the '80s. Sonic CD is 1993. They would most likely have had something newer in the studio by that time. There's no proof of anything Yamaha being involved. That is purely speculation. There's sounds on one keyboard that you can find clones of on keyboards from other manufacturers. It's not unusual.

    I'm curious to know however, how do you guys know that the Korg and Roland were used in Sonic CD? I have never heard this before and am curious to know.
     
  6. Rockman Zero

    Rockman Zero

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    The Fantasia Preset is heard at the beginning and towards the end of You Can Do Anything.

    The Korg M1 Piano is easy to spot because sounds "plastic."
     
  7. saxman

    saxman

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    I can't comment on the Korg thing, but in my opinion, the Roland thing you mention is speculation. It doesn't sound quite the same to me. Also, like I said before, a lot of classic synth sounds have been replicated on other keyboards. You can go pick up a cheap $200 keyboard from a store like Costco or somewhere and get at least a dozen or so sounds that came from various popular retro synthesizers.

    I don't think you can say with certainty that this or that synthesizer was used just by listening to it. I can't even say that about a TinePiano which came from the DX7, because there's a million other keyboards that have that sound now, including some from the '80s that tried to copy Yamaha. I think there's a possible chance that you're right, but you could be wrong too.
     
  8. Shoemanbundy

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    After hearing the Korg Piano myself it is pretty obvious that is what was used in various songs I.e Quartz Quardrant past and Collision Chaos good future. Maybe they did use another synth that just had the replicated sound? Who knows, but I wouldn't rule out the Korg M1 only because it wasn't what was new at that time. Musicians use all types of synths on albums, and I don't think it's unheard of at all that it may not be what's current. After all, a lot of synths are known for their specific sounds that you just can't get from others.

    The one thing I think we can agree on though is that it was an FM synth. It just doesn't "feel" analog for some reason :P
     
  9. saxman

    saxman

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    I'm not ruling anything out. I'm saying that there's no way anyone can just narrow it down to one single synth for the sound. There are others that came after those that do the same stuff. There's tons of keyboards out there. Let's not jump to conclusions.
     
  10. Shadow Hog

    Shadow Hog

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    Honestly, I want to know what in God's name the weird male voice in Stardust Speedway's tracks is. Y'know, the "UAAHEEEH, UAAA- UAAA-UAAAHEEEEH" noise at the start of <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gXUOESoi9zo">Stardust Speedway Past</a> (for example). Is it just a default instrument for one of the aforementioned keyboards?
     
  11. saxman

    saxman

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    It could be a keyboard, but I'd say it's more likely that it's ripped from an existing record and mixed in. That's what a lot of black artists do to make music.
     
  12. Shadix

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    I hate to burst your bubble but having the sounds isn't going to do jackshit in helping you compose Sonic-CD esque music, especially if you aren't musically inclined. It's more of a stylistic effect created by the arrangement styles.

    That said, there are sounds out of that library that I want, lets hope we find some of them haha.

    Edit: Actually, out of curiosity which soundtrack are we talking here? I automatically assumed Hayata's, however if this is Spencer Nilsens soundtrack, then there is reason to be genuinely interested in getting the sounds.
     
  13. LOst

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    Many instruments such as the orchestra hit (located somewhere at PR-B on my JV-1010) used for the main melody in Metallic Madness and Bad Future of Stardust Speedway and various piano sounds are from the Roland JV-80. The JV and XP series of Roland are great! I bought my JV-1010 back in 2002 just so that I could do Sonic CD JP quality songs... But it isn't enough. Even if I had bought the XP-80 which I basically made love to a couple of times, I wouldn't be able to do a perfect Sonic CD music clone, because there are other mixes of sounds in there as well!

    Today I feel that having old FM synths such as DX7 would give me more pleasure in the sound I am looking for. Roland has great sound though! Love the ochestra strings the most!


    I know this is rough (it sounds like I am drunk when I play that ochestra hit), but I actually want to prove this:
    http://www.logotypes.se/sonic/8C-JV1010.mp3
     
  14. Shadix

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    lol I'm most fascinated in replicating those phat downsampled drums
     
  15. JoseTB

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    Beautiful, sounds actually pretty close to SCD style (to me at least). Definitively more stuff has to be produced with that synth.
     
  16. LOst

    LOst

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    If only I had more money, I would have bought the XP-80 instead (about 75% more expensive). JV-1010 is very buggy when connected to the PC, and I haven't been able to use it for much. Also volume levels and reverb, as well as the drum kits are aweful at times.

    All those Roland synthesizers have expansion boards, and the best sounds are on them. I would really want the bass sounds for Quartz Quadrant Good Future, Stardust Speedway Good Future, and Metallic Madness Good Future.
    I am not 100% sure but the sounds for Collision Chaos Good Future and Wacky Workbench Good Future might be FM sounds, Yamaha DX7 (and all the siblings I don't know about) stuff. You know those DTMF/MF telephone beep tones, I would love to make music with those sounds.
     
  17. Shadix

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    LOst does this board possibly have those fake brass sounds that were so distinct to the games sound? (They're used alot in Sonic Adventure as well, I really want that sound haha)
     
  18. LOst

    LOst

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    I don't know what brass sound, maybe you can make a wave file of it, maybe also from Sonic Adventure since I don't have.. or maybe I have a few of them as well.

    Anyway, if it is easy to recognize the sound, then I might be able to find it, but if it is just a normal brass or a brass section, it will be really hard! Also many brass sounds have reverb applied to it, so it can be really hard to find the original sound.
     
  19. Shadix

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    Chao Race theme\Garden theme. The brass lead in Palmtree Panic Present.
     
  20. LOst

    LOst

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    So I decided to play my Roland Expansion Demo CD I got with my JV-1010, just to see if I could locate any Sonic CD instruments. I managed to find out one, part of the Techno Collection (SR-JV80-11 expansion card) which I could buy for my JV-1010 if I could afford it (very expensive US $49.99 on ebay), which I think is called "Lo:BD Hi:HH" and you can hear it here:
    <a href="http://www.logotypes.se/sonic/roland_techno8D.mp3" target="_blank">http://www.logotypes.se/sonic/roland_techno8D.mp3</a>

    Still, I am looking for the DTMF/MF Tones instruments you can hear in most Good Future music and in the Special Stage music. And the orgasmic synth basses in Metallic Madness Good Future and Quartz Quadrant Good Future. The futuristic strings and leads in Collision Chaos Good Future and Sonic Mega Collection Plus demo music(http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fa9Dmpppm_E). And also the intro synth bells used in the SCD Title Screen and in Speed Up Sonic Adventure DX music (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VGh4LImIIgg).

    Brass instruments and piano instruments are too hard to identify.

    Tweaker, do you have any news on anything Sonic CD music?
     
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