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SRB2 Feb 2000 Prototype

Discussion in 'Fangaming Discussion' started by saxman, Jan 13, 2024.

  1. saxman


    Oldbie Tech Member
    I was planning to do all this in the "Sonic Fam Games (the older ones)" thread, but it dawned on me that this perhaps deserves its own thread considering there will be an actual release behind it. So a little copy/paste here, along with new content...

    Some months back, I shared an old in-progress build of SRB2 with SSNTails that I had laying around for *years* on my old IBM Aptiva computer. It's from February 2000, when the game was only just beginning to break away from its DOOM II shell. Now, him and Sonic Team Jr. founder Sonikku go over this relic from the past

    He is working on making sure any copyrighted DOOM II assets are removed before making this available. From the notes, it also looks like this was around the time Stealth was doing some programming for it.

    February 2000 source code and binaries: (Added here on Mar 9)

    September 1999 source code: (Added here on Mar 3)

    November 1999 screenshots: (Added here on Mar 3)


    Part 1:

    Part 2:

    Part 3: (Added here on Jan 20)

    Bonus A: (Added here on Jan 26)

    Part 4: (Added here on Feb 4)

    Bonus B: (Added here on Feb 10)

    Part 5: (Added here on Feb 24)

    Bonus C: (Added here on Mar 6)

    Part 6: (Added here on Mar 9)
    Last edited: Mar 9, 2024
  2. sayonararobocop


    Much appreciated!
  3. Billy


    RIP Oderus Urungus Member
    Colorado, USA
    Indie games
    TIL Sonikku is British, thought I might've known that and forgot. Super cool stuff, neat to see such an early version of SRB2. It was definitely interesting to see which parts of Doom still remained.

    I'm guessing they've already thought about this, but they could probably swap them out for FreeDoom stuff, might reduce the amount of effort involved.
  4. saxman


    Oldbie Tech Member
    From what I remember of it, and from what you see in the videos, it was pretty much DOOM Legacy with Sonic skinned graphics. I remember they had only just recently gotten code in to make Sonic spin and such.

    At this stage, it still uses the DOOM2.WAD file, so my guess is if there are any problematic graphics and things stored in the PWAD file, they could simply remove those things from it since the IWAD is still required regardless. But I say this without knowing specifics about what's in the PWAD.

    Note: For anyone not familiar with old-fashioned DOOM terms, IWAD is "internal" (e.g. DOOM.WAD), whereas PWAD is "patch" (i.e. new content you create for the game that overrides what's in the IWAD).
  5. saxman


    Oldbie Tech Member
    Part 3 added in the top post.
  6. Blastfrog


    See ya starside. Member
    FWIW, one could use freedoom2.wad as a drop-in replacement for doom2.wad.
  7. saxman


    Oldbie Tech Member
    Added a bonus video to the top post. It's not the true part 4, but is instead an addendum to the playthrough SSNTails did with Sonikku. It features Deep Sea 1 and 2. The layouts were ultimately scrapped.
  8. biggestsonicfan


    Model2wannaB Tech Member
    ALWAYS Sonic the Fighters
    I find this slightly amusing as it most certainly includes copyrighted Sonic assets?
  9. saxman


    Oldbie Tech Member
    You'd have to ask him about his reasoning, but I'm certain it's not without forethought. I will say this: When's the last time Sega went after anyone using their character in a not-for-profit game? There's no guarantee id Software would be quite as laid back about it, especially given how popular SRB2 is.
  10. Blue Spikeball

    Blue Spikeball

    Why would id complain about the assets? There have been plenty of fan remakes and recreations of Doom 1 and 2.

    They even open sourced the Doom engine to encourage fan projects.
  11. saxman


    Oldbie Tech Member
    There would be no point in FreeDoom if id Software didn't care.

    DOOM *source code* was made freely available. The game assets themselves are not free, not even in 2024.

    To be honest, I don't want to have to continue this over the next 10+ posts, which I could easily see this growing to. Again, it's not me who is making that call. It's SSNTails. Take it to him, please.
  12. saxman


    Oldbie Tech Member
    Part 4 added in the original post.
  13. saxman


    Oldbie Tech Member
    Another bonus video posted in the top post. This one is for the Hidden Palace Zone and Speed Highway maps (using HPZ textures), which I somehow remember.

    I also remember SSNTails had created an HPZ map for Sonic Boom 2. I don't remember the layout, so I can't say for sure it was anything like this one. But Sonic Doom 2 did use Boom as did the map shown in the video, so it's possible there's a direct link.

    I don't have any information about when he's releasing the prototype and its source code. But I'm guessing it'll be soon.
    Last edited: Feb 24, 2024
  14. saxman


    Oldbie Tech Member
    Part 5 is up...

  15. saxman


    Oldbie Tech Member
    Funny thing happened... I was reviewing some ancient e-mails, and came across *another* SRB2 source code backup (September 14, 1999), along with some very old screenshots (November 1, 1999). This pre-dates the February 2000 prototype build/source that SSNTails is planning to make public.

    I shared these files with him yesterday, and I see he's already shared them with the public. So here is the content for those:

    Source code (Sept 14, 1999):

    Screenshots (Nov 1, 1999):

    This September source code has about four files changed from the stock Doom Legacy source on which it's based. He was still in the early stages of learning about how DOOM's code worked. I made just a few modifications (they're not incorporated into this), but in retrospect, they probably didn't make much sense for what SSNTails was trying to accomplish. You'll see him mention as much in the video.

    Stay tuned for the February 2000 build and accompanied source code...
  16. saxman


    Oldbie Tech Member
    I remember this one...

    This was planned for Sonic Doom 2.

    The release for the February 2000 source code and build is set for this Saturday (three days from now).
  17. Chimes


    The One SSG-EG Maniac Member
    Were there any pre-2000 "mods" included with your files? Around 4 years ago I was on the hunt for "the oldest addon made for SRB2" and the closest I could get were templates made for SRB2 Halloween.
  18. saxman


    Oldbie Tech Member
    I believe I had three separate folders which were copies of the same source. One was the latest that SSNTails gave me at the point in time. Another I worked a few tweaks into (I doubt these actually made it into the game). Another I believe I started experimenting with to see if I could create my own fan game called Sonic Warp or Warp Sonic (that name has a history with me that goes back a couple years prior). The Sonic Warp thing didn't get very far, was never released, and would have started after February 2000.

    So I can't say for 100% sure without digging through files (which aren't in front of me right now), but I don't believe there are any mods like what you speak of. But you'll be able to check for yourself in three days. For all I know, SSNTails could be supplying supplemental WAD content to work with this release (but I have no information that says that will be the case, so please don't assume that's the case).
  19. saxman


    Oldbie Tech Member
    Last edited: Mar 9, 2024
  20. saxman


    Oldbie Tech Member
    Here's the next thing coming down the pipe:

    Until late last year, I had no idea there was such a loyal following of fans dying to get this old stuff. Less obvious on Sonic Retro, perhaps. But in actual SRB2 circles, those people seem as obsessed with this as much as we're obsessed with pre-release ROMs.

    Anyway, I wouldn't have noticed the timestamps on the Christmas material had Chimes not asked about mods. It was after his post that I gave the directories another look. So good job on accidentally contributing to this discovery!