don't click here

Sonic the Hedgehog Cinematic Universe Thread (& Knuckles)

Discussion in 'General Sonic Discussion' started by Dark Sonic, May 28, 2020.

  1. Linkabel


    In what world was the OVA unknown during Heroes release? It had been for sale in the West since 1999 in both VHS/DVD format and even got a new DVD version in 2004.

    It was basically international law that every Sonic fan site at the time had screenshots or a section about it.
  2. JaxTH


    Pudding Deity Oldbie
    Los Angeles
    Jack shit.
    I was talking about people watching it. Sonic CD was also known but barely anyone had played it (like Chaotix).

    In a Pre-YouTube world there were barely any downloads of the Japanese version (The only community site that had it up at the time got a takedown notice) and I only ever found one site that had the English version. Plus people were more preoccupied with Sonic X that was still airing at the time.

    Besides that, most websites had all the same OVA screenshots with only one even having a trailer to download. Basically what I'm saying is that these things had a mythical status back then.
  3. Dek Rollins

    Dek Rollins

    size of a tangerine Member
    So if nobody played Sonic CD and nobody watched the OVA, why would anyone care about Metal Sonic's inclusion in Heroes?
  4. shilz


    getting my daily allowance of vitamin kk
    Because the advertising told them it was something important, or because he was in the comics.
  5. I had known who Metal Sonic was already by the time Heroes came out, but only because I had my brother there to explain who he was. Plus Metal Sonic was in the Gamecube version of SA2 as another playable character. I probably didn't have as much hype for him as the folks who initially played CD, but I understood enough to realize him returning was a big deal. But it was kind of overlooked by Shadow returning and Metal Sonic just....being very much unlike what people knew him as.

    This is the main reason I feel like they're just gonna use Shadow over Metal Sonic, because whether we like it or not, the former is just more well known to people and has an entire story and personality they can explore.

    They COULD just expand on Metal Sonic, but the main thing his fans love about him is that....he's just an evil robot Sonic. Its simple, but that's the appeal and moving beyond that, you run the risk of ruining that Heroes did. You could get away with just making him some muscle for Eggman, but there's still the characterization issue.

    So Shadow kind of solves both problems; you get a new baddie for Sonic to fight, and you have someone with a personality they can actually tell a story with.
  6. Josh


    If they do use Shadow for movie #3, it's gonna be interesting to see how they keep him from coming across as a broad retread of Knuckles. Especially since movie 2 seems poised to re-popularize Knuckles as Sonic's sometimes-friendly rival who can stand toe-to-toe with him.
  7. Sonic is like a Shonen series; they cycle through new rivals every week. The new rival is better than old one, until they're surpassed, and repeat.

    And given that Knuckles will certainly become a good guy before the end of the movie, don't expect him to go into movie 3 with the same type of focus he gets here.
  8. qwertysonic


    creating the biggest sonic collection
    Because of Sonic 2 and 3K. In most (non-megafan) kids' view they are the same character with just modifications or upgrades. I mean how is the difference between Metal Sonic from CD and Mecha Sonic from 3K greater than Metal Sonic from CD and Metal Overlord from Heroes?
  9. TheInvisibleSun


    Buffalo, NY, USA
    The Water
    It's the same reason why Sonic CD is so popular (and occasionally disingenuously heralded as the best game in the franchise by some outlets); it, along with Metal Sonic, had this mythical quality about them, and for a long time were only experienced by many via media items like screenshots and music, and in cameos like in SA1 (personally speaking, I never even knew anyone with a 32X nor Sega CD, and I only saw the OVA at a video store, but never rented it).
    For this reason, I'm a bit surprised at the sentiment by some that Metal Sonic and Mecha Sonic are 'interchangeable'. Even before Adventure, it was clear to me that those robots were very different, so finally getting the chance to play an accessible game featuring the elusive, mythical Metal Sonic was rather exciting, and a legitimate selling point.
  10. Antheraea


    Bug Hunter Member
    Metal Sonic (and Silver/Sonic 2 Mecha Sonic) also had cameos in SA1, in Eggman's Mystic Ruins base. In Gamma's campaign in particular you stood a good chance of noticing them due to him starting out in the same room they're in.

    Metal Sonic also was a playable unlock in SA1DX.
  11. Knucklez


    I love 2B 'n' ass. Member
    Movie 3 would definitely introduce either Shadow or Metal (or even both) as antagonists.

    Shadow would still end up like Knuckles though, a rival fighting alongside Sonic in the end, essentially making him a retread of Knuckles unless they did something creative to make him stand out to not quite be in the same predicament.

    Metal would be purely antagonistic.

    If both were introduced, I could probably see them fighting Sonic seperately until running into one another. At which point, a conflict would arise out of their meeting, Shadow would come to his senses and agree to tag-team with Sonic against Metal in order to stop him.

    *hmmmmm* *brainstorming*
  12. Jay T.

    Jay T.

    It takes an idiot to do cool things... Member
    I have been wondering how they can introduce Shadow into the movies. I do think Metal (or Mecha) Sonic should be next, especially if Robotnik utilizes data on Sonic's quill again. That being said, if Shadow does appear, I thought of a few possible scenarios.

    1. Robotnik creates Shadow using data from Sonic's quill and the Emeralds. This one is probably unlikely since Robotnik's things is well, robots, unless he goes the Shadow Android route.
    2. Shadow is in Sonic's World, sealed up because of how dangerous he is. Robotnik finds him and lets him loose.
    3. The government creates Shadow as a secret weapon, and backfires. Think Mewtwo.
    4. They adapt elements of Sonic Adventure 2 such as Gerald, Maria, and the Space Colony ARK. Not too sure about this one, but it's definitely possible.
  13. shilz


    getting my daily allowance of vitamin kk
    I don't get why people are saying Shadow is a retread of Knuckles. Shadow's the one pulling all the strings in SA2. Eggman's the Knuckles of his story. And then the apparent solution to this would be to make him a clone... which would be stealing Metal Sonic's thunder directly instead of Knuckles' thunder by superficial comparison.

    Not trying to be antagonistic to you, my issue isn't specifically with you, but I do think this is really the only option. Maybe it doesn't have to be exact but I do think you can hit the same beats without doing the events 1-1.
    Last edited: Dec 29, 2021
  14. I actually brainstormed a scenario similar to number 3 actually. We already established that GUN is in this world, so they create Shadow as a countermeasure to Sonic just in case he ever went rogue. Robotnik catches wind of Shadow's creation though, and as per SA2, he breaks in and steals Shadow for his own use. Robotnik wakes Shadow up and sees him as his master, cue conflict. Maybe Sonic, feeling some kinship with Shadow, will convince him to switch sides and saying he doesn't have to be what Robotnik tells him to be or something.

    Also, about the point that Shadow would feel like a retread of Knuckles; the difference is in the details. In the main series, consider how Sonic reacts to both Knuckles and Shadow respectively. Sonic has never really taken Knuckles that seriously, even in Sonic 3. He was more of a hinderance than a legitimate threat, as that was still Robotnik in the end. By contrast, Shadow legitimately got under Sonic's skin multiple times thought out SA2, and even after Shadow switches sides, the two of them generally enjoy their bouts together.

    That said, they seem to be committing to making Knuckles into an actual serious threat, especially if they potentially lean on the whole Echidna angle. So the alternative is as I mentioned, just have Sonic wanting to help Shadow. Shadow being a direct clone here would more or less make them brothers in this continuity, and you can do a lot with that. What I'm saying is, this isn't as binary as people think it is.

    While that is true, I did mention that Metal Sonic's character is a bit too simple to make a compelling character arc with him. Knuckles and Shadow have somewhat complex motivations that make them prime material to write fleshed out character arcs with, while Metal Sonic fits more as a silent enforcer to enhance Robotnik's presence. He's not the type of character who really works as the central focus of a story arc like Knuckles and Shadow do.

    you COULD give him a character arc, but that means potentially muddling his motivations, and from what I understand, the whole appeal of Metal Sonic is that just he's a just killer robot that wants to beat Sonic. "Expanding" on him potentially ruins that.
  15. nesboy43


    What? Sonic CD was definitely known. Many people including myself played it on PC in the mid 90s.

    The game was widely known and was not obscure like Knuckles Chaotix.
  16. I mean, I'll also agree as to Sonic CD not being too hard to find for pc. Also keeping in mind there were a lot in circulation. My local Toys R Us used to sell individual copies of Sonic 3K Collection, Sonic CD, and Sonic R in high numbers and were sitting on a huge backroom inventory of them. That's where I got mine in the late 90s. Also KB Toys seemed to have a few copies always too. So not sure if that was just a New York State thing or not.

    I remember old EZBoard threads directing people to find them there. Then 2002 they re-released 3K and Sonic CD together. I also think there was and Adventures/Heroes PC set several years later. So prior to Steam and the remasters there were opportunities for people with PCs to play.

    As for the OVA, I bought a copy on VHS when it came out, then the dvd and still have them. As for a copy circulating on the internet, it may have been pulled from normal sites but it did start spreading on IRC at one point shortly after release. Kazaa had it after that around 2002. Then any torrent sites starting with Pirate Bay and most anime ones after starting with Boxtorrents had it.

    The only games that were less known thinking about it were Chaotix and StF. They took longer to emulate and the Sonic Community has always been entrenched in the emulation scene.
  17. Endgame


    Formerly The Growler Member
    Realistically here, I think many of you may be thinking a little too 'Sega-like' here in your ideas for this and future Sonic movie ideas - when we have the 'other' main protagonists like Tom and his family; remember how we felt when we found out 'Sonic 1' was set in "Green Hills" and not Green Hill Zone - and the thought of it being a live-action flick? Granted, it looks like we'll be seeing other possible Zones in this 'Sonic 2', but I'm a little more doubtful we will see them feature in a much longer length of time than we got for the first film.

    I imagine the events will unfold around Sonic's friendship with the human characters in whatever storyline that would fit the Sonic universe; such as along the lines of maybe Tom gets captured by Robotnik, and Sonic & Tails has to beat his new rival in order to rescue them (not suggesting that would be the storyline, but basing it on the first film, I can't imagine there won't be much of the 'human factor' considering there are 3 CGI characters running around in this film). I could be entirely wrong, mind you, but it's one of these sneaking suspicions I've got based on past human/CGI animal mix films.

    I'm still seriously pumped for this film, and looking forward to seeing a more threatening Knuckles than we've seen since... well, Sonic 3 I guess?
  18. Mana


    Good! Great! Awesome! Outstanding! Amazing! Member
    I didn't know who Metal Sonic was when Heroes came out. It was many fans who grew up in the late 90's to early 00's first introduction to the character.

    Are we seriously going to do this revisionist history where CD was a widely played game before the Christian Whitehead remake? It was widely known but most fans had never got to play it because the PC version was hard to find and the Gems collection had a really limited release outside Japan.

    I was 14 when the Whitehead remake came out and none of my other Sonic friends around the same age had played the game besides me because I had the Gems collection. I don't think Jax has said anything incorrect.
  19. You may not have played it, but CD was certainly not some obscure game. I originally played it on a friend's Sega CD as a kid, which I recognise as being a rarer experience due to the add-on not being widely embraced, but the PC version was everywhere just like the S&K Collection.
  20. BlackHole


    You're going to need MORE than help. Member
    I mean, considering Sonic in these movies has a lot of electrical elements to him...

    That may be due to the Japanese manual of Chaotix establishing a similar element: that Robotnik built a new Metal Sonic after his defeat on the Little Planet.
    I don't think there's anything advising Metal Sonic's status in the US manual, but that pretty much says they were two different robots, with a shared CPU system at this point in the continuity.