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Sonic Superstars: A New 2D Sonic Game (Fall 2023)

Discussion in 'General Sonic Discussion' started by DefinitiveDubs, Jun 8, 2023.

  1. Stranger

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    I quite enjoy the high quality footage without music. I will say though, watching the last entry in the archive, I was surprised by the sudden and odd sound of Sonic grabbing on to the vine. For a moment, it sounded as though he were tugging on someone's uvula and making them gag.
     
  2. foXcollr

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    Really do not care for the "who had the worst life" competition, this topic not being locked yet is genuinely a miracle. Just as confused by the placeholder music doomposting.

    On the subject of sound effects, is it weird to say that I'm maybe a little tired of the classic Sonic sound effects? It's always a safe choice and you definitely can't go wrong with them, but I feel like changing them up just a tiny tiny bit could make them more refreshing. It's difficult to do without angering some part of the fanbase, but I'm sure if they stuck close enough to the source material they could get away with giving them a bit of a makeover. But this is kind of a nitpick and doesn't matter too much, when I watched the trailer I just wondered if they'd do something to HD-ify the sound effects but it seems they're the same.
     
    Last edited: Jun 13, 2023
  3. AdmiralJuicy

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  4. SuperSnoopy

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    Slice of life visual novel, coming soon...?
    FINALLY someone said it, lmao
    But yeah while don't mind most of the sound effects, I never cared much for the classic jump sound in particular. It's not bad, just...kinda dated and irritating to listen to again and again and again.
    It's like if Mario games kept using the crunchy Mario 1 jump sound for every single 2D game afterwards lol, it's be kinda weird right? Instead, they modernised the sound in every subsequent entries, keeping it similar but making it nicer on the ears.
    It's weird Sonic games never did this...

    ...Oh wait, they did! Sonic Lost World and Runners actually had a perfect "updated" version of the sound they used in these games and then never again, and it's a real shame imo. In fact I remember doing a "Sonic Runners Jump Sound" mod for Sonic Mania, which I even uploaded on the mini hack thread...I wonder if anyone ever downloaded it :V
    I definitely should update it for Mania Plus, I'm pretty sure it's not compatible anymore :(

    But er, yeah, update the jump sound effect sonic team, pretty please.
    (Or just use the modern jump sound, it's the objectively superior sound effect teehee)
     
  5. Snowbound

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    Having had time to digest the reveal and all the additional footage I must to say… I’m in. I’m extremely excited. Do I wish we could’ve gotten a Mania 2 in say 2021? Yeah. But this is the best possible alternative (especially since this project went in development after that ship sailed) the literal creator of Sonic is back!

    It appears they’ve pretty much nailed the physics and the level design. My only complaint with the level design is the butterfly section. Other than that, I see the classic sonic flow. I’m particularly impressed by the large quantity of creative level gimmicks. Something I haven’t seen anyone point out is how the horizontal section in the jungle level feels like an evolution of the vertical block section in scrap yard. Except instead of wait-and-go platforming where you can easily get crushed, the vines give you room to fail without dying and allow you to maintain your speed if you successfully climb up.

    I’m also excited by how many scrapped ideas Ohshima has brought back: the Sonic CD Multi-tier special stages, sonic’s victory pose from the S1 proto and the giant tunnel that was included in the Sonic Overture fangame. I’m very curious to see if other scrapped ideas were revived. Speaking of the Overture tunnels, I can’t find the sonic 1 concept art that was based off of. Can anyone here direct me to that picture.

    Back to my impressions: they’re very positive. I want to beat this game with all 4 characters. I want to find all the sonic medals. I want to play co-op with my pals. With the exception of Mania, I’ve had pre-release reservations about every Sonic game since Lost World. Here, my only concern is if denuvo is included (which is not a reflection on Superstar’s dev team as that’s a Sega policy) I’m so happy… to just see this game and be happy
     
  6. JigenD

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    There was not one single instance of acritical "doomposting" in regards to the placeholder music.


    Yeah, Adventure 2 did it first (and then Heroes after that, and 06 too I think). I really loved that novelty about Adventure 2 back then. Ever since I saw the opening of CD in Sonic Jam back in 98 I've been eager for an impressionist modernization of sorts for the Sonic franchise, and updating certain more primitive aspects that stemmed out of hardware limitations (like the jump sound) would have been a part of it. It is not a demand for hyper realism, but rather, upkeeping with the tradition of the classics of striving for cutting edge sound & graphics -- even Sonic 3 attempted to mimic pre-rendered 3d wherever it could.

    Sonic is more about artistic expression of a number of variables, and less about keeping things archaic for the sake of it.
     
    Last edited: Jun 13, 2023
  7. HEDGESMFG

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    I like several of Sonic 4's tracks...

    I still think being traumatized by hearing music in that style again in a classic game is a perfectly valid expression. Watching the thing you loved as a child be patently ignored or butchered for nearly 15 years, repeatedly, and then being told you're wrong for being upset, repeatedly... is actually genuinely emotionally distressing to people, even if it's just about a video game.

    S4EI wasn't just a misfire, it was an insultingly bad one that borderline mocked those who loved the original. If it wasn't explicitly aimed and marketed at the core fans it wouldn't be so bad, but the precise way it was marketed at them was genuinely upsetting for many here.

    Like, seriously, it sucks to love something and be told it's dead and never coming back and you're a fool for ever wanting it, or that you remembered it wrong. And I'm not even close to the game's biggest hater. Just because it's not the equivalent to real world violence, discrimination, or family trauma doesn't give people the right not to feel sad, used, or hurt. Capitalism is a shitty thing at times, and tone deaf corporate marketing can be a key problem in it. For some people, the classic games were an important emotional experience in an otherwise trying part of their lives.

    Let people be a bit hyperbolic, so long as those who do so are not being overly rude. Don't be dicks to the devs. Just criticize the ideas, don't needlessly bash the people. That's the main thing I ask.

    Edit: I'm guessing most of my response is now in response to arguments which are being removed, so I'll leave it at that and ask others to also do so. People have the right to have feelings one way or another, just be civil and respect the uniqueness that is at times flawed human reactions to media we all love.
     
    Last edited: Jun 13, 2023
  8. MykonosFan

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    I have cleaned some of the garbage out of this thread. Some of it I left since the posts managed to add good discussion in addition to mentioning the garbage.

    This is a forum mostly full of adults. I expect us to be able to come here and post maturely in good faith with each other. Those of you doing that, thank you. The derail in this thread was bad from both sides and I expect to not have to spend my time reading anything like that again. Not dwelling on it any longer, I'm just posting here to ask nicely; treat each other with kindness!
     
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  9. Starduster

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    Honestly I think some of them feel like Adventure-esque compositions, and honestly that’s the kind of composition I want from Jun and co with Superstars. While Adventure obviously started the trend of making Sonic soundtracks very guitar focused, they weren’t really much of a departure from the classic music and I feel very confident in calling that OST a true evolution of said music (which makes a lot of sense when you consider how many of Jun’s 3D Blast compositions for reworked for Adventure). If they can capture that kind of energy again and forego needlessly holding themselves to synth, that’s all I can ask for. Give me the next Azure Blue World or Pleasure Castle.
     
  10. Battons

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    While we haven’t seen a whole ton yet I’m intrigued by the level design, it looks like a mix of CD and modern classic sonic. I wonder if the medals will be required for something important or purely collectible. I desperately want them unlock hidden or bonus levels that do crazy thing.
    This to me is looking a bit more like a successor to CD than the others in the main line, I’d be pretty cool with that as I always wanted a CD 2.
     
  11. RikohZX

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    Honestly I'm curious how the classic models might look backported to Generations/Forces/Sonic 4. Especially if the Mickey Mousing effect was maintained for the cheated angle in the animations. We all know once players get their hands on that data, they're gonna get extracted and ported like crazy.
     
  12. Shaddy the guy

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    Did Sonic 4 modding ever really happen? I've seen some banal texture hacks for episode 1 but that's all I can remember.
     
  13. Starduster

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    There was a classic mod for Episode II that changed the models for Sonic, Tails and Metal along with the special stage music, but not much else, if I recall correctly.
     
  14. RikohZX

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    It does make me wish we could revisit Sonic 4 modding, even if mostly for fan arrangements of the soundtrack to be inserted in. But I digress; Sonic 4 wasn't the worst thing ever, it was just really mediocre. This already looks leaps and bounds above it on effort, accuracy and stage gimmicks.

    The relief of no homing attack Bubbles chains is palpable.
     
  15. foXcollr

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    What really takes me out of it is that the "classic style" music we've been getting since Sonic 4 (so 4, Gens, Forces, some of Origins) doesn't really follow suit with the 90's fusion roots that fueled most of the classic quadrilogy. When I imagine a modern realization of the music of Sonic 1-3K, I imagine a full fusion ensemble with live drums, guitar and bass, keys, and synth/EWI/saxophone lead, maybe a horn section. Or electronic fusion that takes full advantage of the lack of hardware limitations we have today... Mania did this with something like Green Hill Act 2. I feel like Sonic 4 tried too hard to impose arbitrary limitations, but didn't necessarily capture the style/genre, and in instances where it DID capture that style it was just hard to enjoy because the instrumentation chosen wasn't at all reminiscent of the synth sounds or live instruments that the classics were trying to emulate. Then Generations went all-in on a super "modern" poppy EDM sound that I really liked but just... was hardly fusion adjacent at all, Spagonia is a straight up EDM dance tune. And then Forces kinda did what Sonic 4 did except some of those songs GO HARD, same issue though.

    I super agree that Azure Blue World is a really solid evolution of that foundational fusion sound, with none of the old hardware limitations. Idk that's just my thoughts on it though, can't put my finger on EVERYTHING different between classic music and "classic style music" but that's what I feel it's missing. Also I just fucking LOVE 90's fusion and if you gave a group like T-Square a chance to do this soundtrack from scratch I think they would kill it. Like absolutely MURDER it, especially if they updated their sound a little bit to make it more appealing to a broader audience.
     
    Last edited: Jun 13, 2023
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  16. RikohZX

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    I think a big part of it is also that on the Genesis genuine hardware, you had a very "full" soundscape. Besides trying to sound like actual music tuned around the soundchip, they put all the tracks to their fullest and really went ham on the songs having drums, noise, bass, creative sounds to simulate certain instruments or tones combined with complimentary tunes and counter-melodies, etc. Then you listen to Sonic 4 and Forces, and they sound super flat? Even Green Hill Zone has more "texture" to it than all these attempts to replicate it. S4 Episode II and Forces fair a bit better in that regard, but they rely a lot on the base melody track to carry most of the tune while filling in random noises and bass in the background, nothing wants to really "run over each other".

    I think that makes the Superstars beta mini-boss theme stick out to me. It's still the synth soundfont we all dread, but it's a little.. "fuller"? Generic in the melody certainly, but actually having layers to it combined with a less shrill synth overall.
     
  17. McAleeCh

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    Just a quick observation - from the off-screen footage we've seen, I love that there's an attempt at maintaining a certain visual continuity with Mania here in some elements of the presentation, with the menus and results screens following a similar motif of yellow backgrounds and white text with stark black bars behind it. Really makes it feel like they're seeing this as the continuation of the revival that Mania started back in 2017. = )

    Come to think of it, the medals you can collect in some of the Special Stages are also a carryover from Mania, aren't they? How could I forget the endless attempts to get all-golds in the Blue Sphere stages? Haha. XD

    Wonder if any of the ideas behind this game evolved from the discussions for a follow-up to Mania that they had with Whitehead/Thomley? A proper return for Fang seems like exactly the kind of thing they would have done after having already had him pop up via Heavy Magician's illusions in the previous game.
     
    Last edited: Jun 13, 2023
  18. synchronizer

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    Why does everyone keep saying that the bush slows Sonic down? Isn't it the frog enemy in the background?
     
  19. Stranger

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    The frog grabs you, yes, but the bushes have their own effect in unfurling you if you're balled up and slowing you down. Take a look at the gameplay footage in sections where the frog isn't there and Sonic passes through bushes. It'll be more evident in those situations.
     
  20. LordOfSquad

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    Consider me excited as hell for this now after stewing over it for a few days. Ohshima being back in the big chair gives me a good feeling and having my fears of modernity quelled is great.

    Only thing I'm nervous about now is the music... I really wish SEGA would just hire a dependable outside musician, Senoue is too much of a wild card. Something like this would be ideal for me: