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Sonic Superstars: A New 2D Sonic Game (Fall 2023)

Discussion in 'General Sonic Discussion' started by DefinitiveDubs, Jun 8, 2023.

  1. Starduster

    Starduster

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    Fang the Sniper. It appears in this comic, it appeared in Seasons of Chaos. Once upon time (i.e. back in the 90s) there may have been trepidation about keeping the "sniper" moniker given the connotations and the pearl clutchers of the time, but nowadays it's more or less entirely innocuous.

    Speaking of sniping, god am I glad to see him with the pop gun again. I really hope he uses it in the game.
     
  2. I kind of hate that writers feel the need to come up with these contrived “explanations” for localization changes. People aren’t idiots; they know why those differences existed. Don’t act like, “Oh, it was always meant to be like that,” or like, “Yeah, they’re aliases, that’s so fucking clever.”

    I like that the pop gun is here though. Guessing he loses it at some point to explain why it’s not in the game? Though I guess it could still be in the game. I’m just assuming it isn’t.
     
  3. Dark Sonic

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    Well Fang having his names be aliases at least makes sense for his character. He’s a criminal, so fake names make sense. And yes we know why the names changed but that makes for a boring in universe explanation. I don’t think it’s as much thinking the audience is stupid, rather it’s more a nice nod to those of us who grew up knowing them as something else.

    Never heard of Jet the Jerboa though where'd that come from? As for swapping Sniper with Hunter, also makes sense I think, it’s not like Fang really uses a sniper. Hunter still fits his character.
     
  4. Starduster

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    I wonder if Jet might have been a concept name for Fang...
     
  5. big smile

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    In some of the magazine previews for Sonic Triple Trouble, Fang was called Jet so it seems to be a scrapped localised name. I thought it was a cute reference.
     
  6. Sneasy

    Sneasy

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    Them being aliases is actually really clever, since he is a wanted criminal. It make an inconsistency a characterization quirk, not apologizing but rather building on it.

    I'd rather they improve and build than ignore things just because it's easy.
     
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  7. I strongly disagree. It works better than other instances of this because of his criminal background, but it really is just not interesting writing. It brings me out of the story and I just roll my eyes.

    Instead of trying to fit the thousand square pegs of callbacks that is the modern Sonic series into the round holes of the story, so certain fans can pat themselves on the back and tweet about understanding the reference, I’d prefer if they just wrote a compelling narrative.

    The Sonic series has been so reliant on the past and these meta textual elements for over a decade. Even though I love the games, I can’t help but feel Sega looked at Generations’ and Mania’s success and determined that they were well received because of the callbacks, rather than the fact that they were good games.

    Anyway, it’s not that big of a deal to me. I just don’t like it and it takes me out of the story. Frontiers was the same way too. It feels too much like reading users arguing over why their head canon works.
     
    Last edited: Sep 25, 2023
  8. Mr. Cornholio

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    Honestly the biggest issue I see with Fang using his pop gun for a theoretical one-on-one boss fight (without the Marvelous Queen) is that it seems like it might be slightly hard to make his gun attacks easy to telegraph.

    I think it works in Sonic the FIghters since that plays like a traditional fighting game. So, there are only two characters on screen at a time, and the camera is zoomed in. Superstars has to zoom the camera out a bit since it's a platformer and you have to factor in 4 playable characters on screen at once. I think the corks could easily be difficult to make out while fighting him in a 3D enviornment with a lot going on.

    ...Then again, I guess Mania did make it work? I actually forgot Heavy Magician even used the pop gun and I only remember Fake Fang bouncing around. I still think the extra characters/'busier' enviornments is still something to consider though.
     
  9. Palas

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    Do they? I mean, sure. We do. But in the grand scheme of things, Fang was still mostly unknown up until Mania-- and being able to use a callback as a building block for something interesting about his character is indeed clever. It stands on its own for people who might not know him at all, which is like 90% of people who will play Sonic Superstars, and is a nice nod to the remaining 10%. It's really not smug as you claim.
     
  10. Chimpo

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    There are numerous things you can do to telegraph the gun about to fire and make the projectile visible. Getting into a firing pose, sound cues, flashing lights, visual effects as he fire/after he fires, flashing the cork. There isn't a visibility issue from this regardless of scale unless they do absolutely nothing about it. There's a whole genre dedicated to doding tiny bullets they can pull ideas from to help with visibility. I'd actually argue that Mania did a poor job as the only indication you get is a sound cue.
     
    Last edited: Sep 26, 2023
  11. Spamitex

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    Sonic Superstars has been doing amazing in Japan lately.

    - The Sonic Superstars Booth at TGS2023 was overcrowded to the point of increased wait time and admission restrictions. (Source)

    - The Sonic Superstars Booth afterward was fully booked within 30 minutes of opening. (Source)

    - Sonic Superstars won the Japan Game Awards 2023 Future Category* (Source)

    [​IMG]

    (*CESA picks the Future Division winners by tallying votes from people who attended TGS 2023 over the first 3 days and played a variety of games.) - GoNintendo
     
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  12. Chimpo

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    We're so fucking back Sonic bros
     
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  13. Like I said, this instance isn’t particularly egregious but the general trend of referring to past games and meta textual elements is tiring and takes me out of the story. It’s not a reference to the in-game stories, it’s a reference to the fact that his name had been changed in real life.

    So much media nowadays is reliant on this type of writing and it’s frankly a bit lazy and overdone in my opinion. People slip in references in the place of actually coming up with something that’s new or makes sense in context.

    Once again, this is a comment on the broader trend towards this type of writing device as a whole, not this specific instance.

    But on the topic of being “clever,” can you tell me how this enhances the actual story that’s being told? The only benefit I see for people who are aware of these names is the fact that they get to go, “Ha, they did the thing.” Does it provide any deeper understanding of the character or story? To me, a clever reference would have been one that would allow those with prior knowledge of the character to be rewarded in relation to appreciating the story, and also encourage people who aren’t aware to go experience his past appearances and not a Wiki article about the development history.
     
  14. Starduster

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    As well as fleshing out Fang's character, the gag also acknowledges that, for a long time, fans in the west knew him by a different name and opts not to just sweep that under the rug. In a sense, it validates those fans because it gives them a way to say "No, he really was called Nack back then.".

    In terms of how it enhances the story itself directly...well you could argue it doesn't. But it also does nothing to detract from it. Fang having used fake names builds on his identity as a shady mercenary while Eggman forgetting where he's currently at with his name shows how callous he is. Stories are an art, not a science - not everything needs to push the story towards its conclusion and things would be much less joyful if that were the case.
     
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  15. Beamer the Meep

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    Honestly, I figured it was similar to the "Giant Talking Egg" thing with Eggman in the West. In this case, I'd argue it's a bit more justified and elegant solution to the continuity issue between Japan and America.
     
  16. Deep Dive Devin

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    I think it's good to take these things on a case-by-case basis. The Robotnik family has narrative significance in the JP version of the series, and it's still Eggman's family, so taking that leap and saying it's his name in every language makes sense (though I'm not sure I love Sonic being solely responsible for the "Eggman" name, but that's a nitpick). Fang having many aliases including the previous US names isn't strictly necessary, but they twisted it into a fun little character trait that's ultimately harmless (and hey, maybe they can use it in the future to surprise us with a name we haven't seen before).

    It's all about moderation. It can be taken too far, they definitely shouldn't try to reincorporate the Kintobor backstory or anything, but that's because it conflicts with a lot of fundamental narrative and thematic elements.
     
  17. Yes, that’s my point. Its “value” is outside the story and those people already know that it wasn’t the case that Nack was an alias but a localization change. So it’s essentially pointless.


    This is my problem. They are compromising the artistry of the games and narratives by using them as a vehicle to shoehorn references and meta textual commentary/retcons. It’s distracting.


    Wow, I never realized that this was intended to be the setup to the Eggman name in the west. I played it the first time when I was 4 so I guess I just accepted that he was called Eggman now without questioning it.
     
  18. Starduster

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    They really aren't though. This story is not notably changed in any way whatsoever by the gag. Besides, there may be people interested in Superstars who aren't diehard fans but played some of the Game Gear games back in the day and the name change might throw them. Such people do exist and people as deep into the series as we are most cetainly constitute a minority.
     
  19. Aerosol

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    I think there's way too much thought about it, really and truly.

    He's a wanted criminal, he's had multiple aliases. Makes sense to me. Some of them are his localization changes. I really don't understand why that's a problem.
     
  20. The Joebro64

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