Sonic Superstars: A New 2D Sonic Game (Fall 2023)

Hez already summed up exactly why this is the case. You're also disregarding all the new work because some already available and ready to use assets are being used. None of that work matters I guess.

 

Absolutely - technology is always evolving, and if your company is using bespoke tools, you may not be able to get by with just what you learned at university.

Also in the case of artists, I would put money on many of them still coming from "traditional" art courses. i.e. real paint on real canvases. The ability to learn new skills and adapt to changing environments is the secret to success.

 

Every job you learn on the job. College barely prepared me for a damn thing lol

 

When everyone is an imposter, no one is

 

The most you'll actually take away from any educational or training courses is maybe how to navigate the software you're going to be using.

Then you actually work on the software and find out half the stuff you learned is useless, the other half is outdated, and then a whole new chunk no one even brought up. That's not even bringing up the oddball stuff that comes up during collaborations where things are completely out of the normal methods, some bat shit MacGyver solutions and just general project management

Spoiler

"What the FUCK did my co-worker send me?"

 

Am I the only one who thinks the purple hazy backdrop in this zone is a little too much? I looked at it for only like 30 seconds on my phone and when I turned away I was already seeing green on the walls (minor exaggeration).

It’s different, I’ll give them that. But maybe this is a case where the pixel aesthetic is better because it can’t quite achieve the same level of strain-inducing vibrancy. (Sonic Mania’s Oil Ocean Zone Act 2 with all the smog comes to mind).

Or maybe I’m just a dumbass, I don’t know. I’ve never had this kind of reaction to visuals before. I’m not that sensitive even though I’m coming off as so.

 

Developers need to understand that depth of field mostly just fucking sucks.

 

Preach it brother. 9 times out of 10 DOF just makes games look worse and harder to play.

 

I revisited Sonic Hoshi yesterday and, although i was already really happy with Superstars, it has to be said that the true cohabitation of Sonic creations that exists today is the true mainline!!

Whether it is Hoshi, the Star Drop games, Isle of Magnetic Artifacts, Sonic 1 Definitive, CDX, Triple Trouble 16 bit, Sonic Legends, Sonic Sunventure; and, i did read correctly regarding, and see a screenshot of, more than ten different new versions of the three Sonic Advance games with coherent editing potential are coming soon from the fan communities too!! Lapper mentioned something about Sonic Studio this week that is amazing. And this is just barely the lot of them!!

So, Superstars i think to some extent is meant to rest alongside all of the other actual Sonic games that exist now and are carrying on different aspects of what's possible!! It may indeed be no mistake that it's introducing a bunch of new concepts that we haven't been able to put into fangames that could probably happen now!! A Mania mod with emerald powers both the same as and distinct from Superstars, it's not if but when!!

 

I'd like to add too that the higher the detail, the harder it is to read while you're moving fast. It was actually an issue I had with Generations where it had these great backgrounds in the 2D sections but I had some issues being able to parse the level itself in time.

Yeah sure, the game looking pretty in a screenshot is a win I guess, but actually being able to play the game in motion is more important. I'm here to play a game, not to admire level art as a still image ahahahah

 

From what I've seen so far, it looks like the Switch version lacks the depth-of-field effects entirely, so if you don't mind the other graphical trade-offs, that might be the best version to go for if the effect really bothers you a lot. Otherwise, your best hope is that someone will come up with a mod to remove the effect in the PC version.

 

That's likely what it'll ultimately come down to. The levels might look empty now but once we have the game in our hands we might not ever notice it

 

Yeah. We also have a tendency to overanalyze things ahead of release because we don't have the game in our own hands yet. So something that sticks out to us in the pre-release phase might end up being pretty irrelevant in the long run.

 

I'm fine with it but I also can't play Lylat Cruise in Smash Bros. because the background makes me dizzy and disoriented, so it's probably one of those YMMV things that may vary with setups, etc.

 

I'm not personally having any unusual visual reactions to it, I do indeed find it rather unnecessary. From my own personal creator's perspective, it's the kind of thing that seems like a good idea until you actually see it. Or like when you think the overdub on that one verse will make it sound more rich but it turns out to make you sound like you're trying to wash down melted M&M's with a warm Dr. Pepper.

TL;DR less is more. Sorry, happy hour started a little early.

ETA: Like at least dial it back a few more notches, y'know? Just sayin', the way it is now, I wanna reach for my glasses even though I'm already fucking wearing my glasses lol. It's the ferris wheel for me. I find it to be the worst, there. Perhaps I'll feel differently about this later.

 

I kinda find both takes a tiny bit out-of-touch. Not all of us are in our 30s or 40s or even remember the Genesis days, and I can tell you there is still appeal for 2D games. I think more people should be open to the idea that we aren't 2-dimensional, young people today like a variety of different things. Gaming as an industry is also infintessimally larger than it was 2 decades ago, you don't necessarily need to just do "the most popular thing" to sell a game like hot cakes. Sonic isn't really... uh, how do I say this... the most popular thing in the world to begin with.

If you're talking about mass market appeal, sure 3D is the way to go, and it has been since the early 2000's. But games like Mario Wonder will probably inevitably prove that 2D can still sell well, after all... NSMB outsold Mario Galaxy 2 by a pretty insane margin, and Smash Bros is a 2.D fighter that continues to outsell Mario Odyssey. I can't think of any fair Mario comparisons from after the Wii days, but that's because they haven't really made any flagship 2D Marios that weren't "NSMB + gimmick". The "2D sucks" crowd isn't even majority young people, I have an uncle in his 50's who only plays 3d games on PS4/5 and thinks 2D games are cheap and made for babies. I think it's just... ignorant people.

 

Mario sells baby. You don't need to do "the most popular thing" to sell a game, but Mario itself IS a popular thing. You can't really use Smash or NSMB as metrics in favor of 2D's popularity commercially and public reception. The world LOVES Mario.



People just hate old stuff outside of the current world view. If it wasn't from their time, then why should they care? I know a lot of people my age that will refuse to watch old movies before the 80's just because it's "old". Practical effects? Props? Where's the CG?
Obviously there have been some non-Mario 2D games that hit big commercially and critically, but a lot of those games aimed for something special beyond just being a fun video game. Shredder's Revenge was a tribute to the Turtles at their peak. Cuphead is a love letter to rubberhose animation cartoon. Mania was a celebration of the classic games. They sold themselves on something more than just being a new 2D entry.
There has been a resurgance in retro stuff with the younger zoomers though. I love watching those kids on youtube cover old stuff.

 

Unpopular opinion: I was really disappointed when Mania turned out to be pixel art in the reveal trailer…! To me that style only looks good on a CRT - LOVE the way Superstars looks - makes me kinda giddy ^^

 

I just want to say I can't believe I'm this excited for a Sonic game after so many years.

I find it hard to care about new games or the release dates of anything. I was "okay-ish" levels of excited before Frontiers, like "oh that looks good I'm waiting to play it" (kinda about how excited I am for Mario Wonder right now) but right now I'm *counting the days* until Superstars comes out to play it.

Congrats Sega, and thanks Sega, and wishing the best to everyone involved with this and Mania/Origins.

 

The point is, I compared Mario to Mario. The point is to use the same series and compare a 2D game to a 3D game in that same series so the popularity of the series isn't a factor. It's not just "Mario" that sells, Galaxy 2 sold a paltry 7-8 million copies compared to a 2D outing from the same series that was already dated at the time it released. 7-8m might be a lot for a Sonic game, but for a AAA series that isn't anything super special compared to how much NSMB sold.

Also again, please stop stereotyping young people into the "zoomer" bucket. We like a wide variety of things. I don't know how else to explain this other than... if you aren't from my generation, why insist on speaking for us? It's not a big deal but like... 2D gamers are out here.

But again, I personally think it really doesn't matter if Sonic does the "most popular" thing or a "less popular" thing. Until the quality ups and Sonic becomes a household name for quality, it doesn't really matter what they do, the typical "mainstream zoomer" gamer you're picturing who plays only AAA titles and games with next gen graphics typically wouldn't have any interest in Sonic Frontiers, the game that's trying its best to be a major 3D title and appeal to modern audiences.