Sonic Superstars: A New 2D Sonic Game (Fall 2023)

I think the biggest thing holding pixel art back right now is that modern games that have a pixel art aesthetic are almost always marketed as a "retro throwback!" kind of thing. I never really viewed pixel art this way, to me it's just an artstyle choice like any other. During the Nintendo DS era there were a ton of pixel art games that still felt like they looked "modern"

(but maybe this is just me being unable to accept that the DS era was almost 20 years ago)

 

It's a new Sonic game; keep those hopes under control heheh. I wouldn't be getting giddy at the thought of 39 acts based on a second-hand maybe.

We know at least 2 zones only have 1 act; the other so far being Cyber Station.
Back when we discovered Sky Temple was 1 act, Iizuka said this:

So maybe there will be some 3-act zones... but maybe not. Maybe Iizuka said "maybe" while holding the already-known character-specific acts in mind.

We're pretty sure there's 1 extra act per character.
But I can't find anything suggesting there are also generic bonus acts at all.

So my safe expectation is to encounter about 26 acts so far.

I really just want the game to unquestionably out-do S3&K's huge variety. 24 complete acts, several of which with multi-stage bosses, plus a few extra Sonic- or Knuckles- exclusive small boss acts, plus the tonne of content that was Knuckles' exclusive paths through huge chunks of the whole game.

I don't think we'll get that, but that's what I wish for.

 

If the posts are to be believed, it's Sonic, Tails, Knuckles, Amy, maybe Fang and Eggman? Can we rule out the Sonic 1 badniks? It's clearly not everything, but it could be a fair bit.

How people interpet this is up to them, but a decision was seemingly made not to make new assets for the key characters on-screen most of the time.

 

Wait you mean the 3d models for sonic and co. are reused?????
What the hell, sonic team never did this before, I'm crying and shaking rn

(sass aside, while the recycling of models is one of the reason the series aesthetics' are a mess currently on the modern front, it's certainly not a sign that this particular game is low effort: literally every series does it, and it works perfectly fine in superstars' case. It's exactly how the classic cast is supposed to look, why would they waste precious time and manpower to change the models for no reason?)

 

Rafa only claims Knuckles and Amy. By their own admission, Tails is not based on their model. Sonic clearly isn't based on Rafa's either.
You are shifting the entire conversation and are downplaying Arzest's work based on just two models made under contract.
Once again, come on man.

 

Artistic integrity I guess!

I don't have an opinion on this practise - I'm just pointing out that it can't have taken a long time to make the 3D models if they didn't make the 3D models.

 

Aw hell nah, not the artistic integrity™
Sonic 1, 2, CD and Mania all used the same sprites for sonic (albeit modified, which superstars certainly did too) and I don't see anyone on these boards saying these games were low effort affairs or lacked artistic vision
If something works for a particular art direction there's no need to change it, lol.

 

Bonus fruit acts are already confirmed, character-specific acts are already confirmed, 12 zones have already been confirmed. Even if there are only bonus acts for 6/12 of the zones and 3/12 zones have one act each, that's still around 30 acts. And that's assuming there are no three-act zones. 39 is just the uppermost, most unreasonable estimate.

 

You also have to realize in regards to the pixel art debate that it's not really what the industry trains for. Things like the recent Wonder Boy projects or Streets of Rage 4 are artists doing what they do best to a passion, but in terms of the gaming industry overall, pixel art has become a niche talent while most people trained in development and art are being trained on 3D. To hit up pixel art is effectively personal interest and specific courses or unofficial tutorials and support on the internet.

Mania is a passion project, and Headcannon are talented, but it's a very specific investment to hire and pay people that are experienced in pixel artistry, especially in terms of game development. You don't want a Super Street Fighter II Turbo HD Remix of a comic artist overworked to hell and back to do every single frame and background plus new art for a fighting game, and SNK's old sprite art went the way of the dodo because it was prohibitively expensive and the people behind the sprite art talent moved on or retired in many cases.

You want to try to proposition more sprite art Sonic games, hey, maybe you can try to get a position in Sega to push for a spinoff game and all, but you need specific artists for specific art design, and you're gonna find more pixel artists in the indie or low tier development scenes while former sprite companies like Arc System Works and SNK went entirely 3D, albeit the former trying to stylize and shade like 2D. Some people are acting like Iizuka is condemning 2D going forwards, but it's straight up just an investment strategy of sticking to what they can work with as is since Evening Star is off doing their own thing now.

 

Are they?

I had a hunt around but couldn't find something saying there are bonus generic acts on top of character-specific acts. I checked the 2 previews I know of from IGN, and the recent info we've received from the new build, and the older GameInformer article.

In other words, if you say generic bonus acts are confirmed, can you (or someone reading) provide a source?

 

The multiplayer b-roll footage posted a few pages back shows actual footage of Pinball Carnival Zone Act Fruit, including the title card.

...This also makes me realise it feels really strange writing things like "Act Sonic" or "Act Fruit" after decades of having only numbered Acts, haha. XD

 

Ah yeah, at about 3:35 in this:

Hmm. My tendancy is still not to get my hopes raised, but yeah, that indeed doesn't appear to be a character-specific act, and it's not like they'd have just one fruit act... so... yeah I guess that's pretty convincing.

 

In the multiplayer trailer, there was a clip of Bridge Island with all the tokens and balloons in this video, that we don't see in any other playthrough, so a fruit act for every zone seems likely.

 

Ah yeah I see. I wouldn't go so far as to say likely, but possible. At least 4 I guess, but my thinking is there might only a selection of zones used, ala Sonic 2.

I wonder now if these fruit acts we've seen will be accessible from the main campaign, or if they're more like multiplayer mini-games that are part of some other mode.

 

Is it possible you'll access them if the roulette at the end of an act lands on the fruit icon? Because what would that be for otherwise?

 

Yeah could be.

Perhaps they only exist if you have multiple people playing, but then they can appear in the main game. Or maybe they're just as possible for a solo player. The solo Knuckles BIZ playthrough shows him collecting one, but doesn't show what happens next.

The mutiplayer video separates its footage into 2 sections, one being "TEAM UP TO PLAY TOGETHER" and the other being "OR FACE OFF IN BATTLE MODE". What appears to be Bridge Island's "Act Fruit" is in the TEAM UP section.

So yeah, your thought makes sense.

Of note:
* Both have that weird carnival-style gimmick in the centre. It looks like that gimmick is filling up as the liitle score pellets are being spun by the characters.
* Pinball Carnival Act Fruit has a different HUD/icon backgrounds compared to the rest of the co-op game. Weird that score isn't shown when it seems so score-happy.
* They're both auto scrollers.

 

Not to rehash the pixel art debate, but I feel like a lot of the vocal disagreement comes from people who don't actually look outside of their specific sub-group.

Literally just the other day I saw people on Twitter argue whether this game was worth $60 or not "because it was 2D" and while it's easy to just label these people as "dumb or stupid" due to bias, it's easy to forget that many people making those comments have no attachments to 2D or Pixel art whatsoever. Average gamer is a young adult whereas most of us here are in our late 20's/early 30's, probably even approaching our 40's.

3D, big budget games have been the standard for over 20 years now and we're in an age where gaming is much more mainstream than it was in the 80's and 90's. I don't really like it either because I see tons of merit in 2D Pixel games, but I can see how it looks "dated" to someone who's used to 3D graphics.

All of this is to say, yes we are getting older and things are changing. Sucks, but it is what it is. We can either accept this gracefully or fully embrace becoming our parents and just get angry at the kids.

 

Minecraft shows that a game using pixel art* can do well, I just think it's a vicious cycle at work here. As @RikohZX points out, the industry doesn't train for pixel art, so few pixel art games get made. And it is less cost-effective than 3D (this isn't it to say that 3D is lazy or cheap or whatever). What @Sonic5993 describes seems more like general distaste for any kind of 2D game, regardless of aesthetic, though there's certain overlap.

I do get Josh's complaints, even if he's unnecessarily rude about it. I'm fine with how Superstars looks, but Sonic 1-3+CD generally does have more detail, that's just fact. Of course, you could just as easily argue that cramming stages with detail would be wasted effort in a game where you move so fast. In the 90s, gaming magazines were the primary form of advertising, so making games look as good as possible in a still frame made a lot of sense. Not the case today, though you don't want your game to look actively ugly either...

*I know Minecraft technically doesn't use pixel art, but it's extremely close aesthetically

 

I don't think there was ever a point in history where you'd be trained in pixel art during formal education, as you might be with 3D modelling now. It's a skill you learn on the job, or in your own time (just like Naoto Ohshima in the late 1980s!).

 

Does the video game industry still operate under the ethos of "just learn it on the job"? I imagine things are far more standardized and competitive than the late 80s.