Sonic sprite pallete query

Discussion in 'Engineering & Reverse Engineering' started by Rabid, Mar 25, 2008.

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  1. Mar 25, 2008 #1
    Rabid

    Rabid

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    Ok, I asked this question a while back on area 51 before we had the assemblies and it wasn't possible then with our level of understanding so here I go again.

    What im after is to change the pallete of sonic and tails by refering those two sprites to entirely seperate pallete each without effecting everything else that shares sonics pallete in sonic 2.

    The theory being that if possible I could severly increase the graphical quality of those sprites because they would no longer need the shared colours of other sprites such as tails colours in the pallete for sonic and completly redraw their framed to accomodate.

    I really need and answer for this as its one essential ideas for my annual sonic hacking comp entry.

    Thanks!
     
  2. Mar 25, 2008 #2
    Mr. Fox

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    Megadrive allows only for 64 colors on the screen simultaneously. That's 4 palettes.
     
  3. Mar 25, 2008 #3
    PsychoSk8r

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    Theoretically, yes, it is possible, but you would be losing a palette line for your level art, which will add many more limitations, so I personally wouldn't recommend it.
    But, If you're willing to overhaul the level art to fit the new palette system, then go for it, no reason not to try =P
     
  4. Mar 25, 2008 #4
    JoseTB

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    Without completely redrawing most of the level related art in order not to use two lines but one, it's simply not possible.
     
  5. Mar 25, 2008 #5
    Tweaker

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    You could always pull a NES trick and do flickering—changing the palette every frame and displaying Sonic and Tails only on the frame where the relevant palette colors are loaded. It would look horribly ugly, but I guess it would work. =P
     
  6. Mar 25, 2008 #6
    Overlord

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    I was about to say, wouldn't that be utterly AWFUL to look at?
     
  7. Mar 25, 2008 #7
    ICEknight

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    I'm thinking that perhaps he just wants either Sonic or Tails on screen, and not both. So the game would load a different first palette, depending on the character you choose.
     
  8. Mar 26, 2008 #8
    Hitaxas

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    I don't think that's what he means. From what I understand, he wants to be able to have both Sonic and Tails on the screen, but both using different palette lines. If a plain "separate Palette" deal is all they want:

    <!--g1--><div class='geshitop'>Syntax Highlighted Code: ASM</div><div class='geshimain'><!--eg1--><pre class="asm">Level_LoadPal:
    [color= #00bfff;]move[/color].[color= #00bfff;]b[/color] <span style="">(</span>Level<span style="">)</span>.[color= #00bfff;]w[/color],<span style="font-weight:bold;">d0</span>
    [color= #00bfff;]cmpi[/color].[color= #00bfff;]w[/color] [color= #ff0000;]#[/color][color= #ff0000;]1[/color],<span style="">(</span>Player_mode<span style="">)</span>.[color= #00bfff;]w[/color] [color= #adadad; font-style: italic;]; is character sonic?[/color]
    [color= #00bfff;]bne[/color] TailsPalLoad [color= #adadad; font-style: italic;]; If not, load Tails pallet[/color]
    [color= #00bfff;]cmpi[/color].[color= #00bfff;]w[/color] [color= #ff0000;]#[/color][color= #ff0000;]0[/color],<span style="">(</span>Player_mode<span style="">)</span>.[color= #00bfff;]w[/color] [color= #adadad; font-style: italic;]; is character sonic and Tails?[/color]
    [color= #00bfff;]bne[/color] both_pal
    [color= #00bfff;]move[/color].[color= #00bfff;]b[/color] [color= #ff0000;]#[/color][color= #ff0000;]2[/color],<span style="">(</span>player_mode<span style="">)</span>.[color= #00bfff;]w[/color]
    [color= #00bfff;]moveq[/color] [color= #ff0000;]#[/color][color= #ff0000;]3[/color],<span style="font-weight:bold;">d0</span>
    [color= #00bfff;]bsr[/color].[color= #00bfff;]w[/color] PalLoad2 [color= #adadad; font-style: italic;]; load Sonic's pallet line[/color]
    [color= #00bfff;]tst[/color].[color= #00bfff;]b[/color] <span style="">(</span>Water_flag<span style="">)</span>.[color= #00bfff;]w[/color] [color= #adadad; font-style: italic;]; does level have water?[/color]
    [color= #00bfff;]beq[/color].[color= #00bfff;]s[/color] Level_GetBgm [color= #adadad; font-style: italic;]; if not, branch[/color]
    [color= #00bfff;]moveq[/color] [color= #ff0000;]#[/color][color= #ff0000;]$[/color][color= #ff0000;][color= #ff0000;]15[/color][/color],<span style="font-weight:bold;">d0</span> [color= #adadad; font-style: italic;]; palette number $15[/color]
    [color= #00bfff;]cmpi[/color].[color= #00bfff;]b[/color] [color= #ff0000;]#[/color][color= #ff0000;]8[/color],<span style="">(</span>Current_Zone<span style="">)</span>.[color= #00bfff;]w[/color]
    [color= #00bfff;]beq[/color].[color= #00bfff;]s[/color] Level_WaterPal [color= #adadad; font-style: italic;]; branch if level is HPZ[/color]
    [color= #00bfff;]moveq[/color] [color= #ff0000;]#[/color][color= #ff0000;]$[/color][color= #ff0000;][color= #ff0000;]16[/color][/color],<span style="font-weight:bold;">d0</span> [color= #adadad; font-style: italic;]; palette number $16[/color]
    [color= #00bfff;]cmpi[/color].[color= #00bfff;]b[/color] [color= #ff0000;]#[/color][color= #ff0000;]$[/color][color= #ff0000;]D[/color],<span style="">(</span>Current_Zone<span style="">)</span>.[color= #00bfff;]w[/color]
    [color= #00bfff;]beq[/color].[color= #00bfff;]s[/color] Level_WaterPal [color= #adadad; font-style: italic;]; branch if level is CPZ[/color]
    [color= #00bfff;]moveq[/color] [color= #ff0000;]#[/color][color= #ff0000;]$[/color][color= #ff0000;][color= #ff0000;]17[/color][/color],<span style="font-weight:bold;">d0</span> [color= #adadad; font-style: italic;]; palette number $17[/color]
    &nbsp;
    &nbsp;
    TailsPalLoad:
    [color= #00bfff;]moveq[/color] [color= #ff0000;]#[/color][color= #ff0000;]$[/color][color= #ff0000;][color= #ff0000;]28[/color][/color],<span style="font-weight:bold;">d0</span>
    [color= #00bfff;]bsr[/color].[color= #00bfff;]w[/color] PalLoad2 [color= #adadad; font-style: italic;]; load Tails pallet line[/color]
    [color= #00bfff;]tst[/color].[color= #00bfff;]b[/color] <span style="">(</span>Water_flag<span style="">)</span>.[color= #00bfff;]w[/color] [color= #adadad; font-style: italic;]; does level have water?[/color]
    [color= #00bfff;]beq[/color].[color= #00bfff;]s[/color] Level_GetBgm [color= #adadad; font-style: italic;]; if not, branch[/color]
    [color= #00bfff;]moveq[/color] [color= #ff0000;]#[/color][color= #ff0000;]$[/color][color= #ff0000;][color= #ff0000;]15[/color][/color],<span style="font-weight:bold;">d0</span> [color= #adadad; font-style: italic;]; palette number $15[/color]
    [color= #00bfff;]cmpi[/color].[color= #00bfff;]b[/color] [color= #ff0000;]#[/color][color= #ff0000;]8[/color],<span style="">(</span>Current_Zone<span style="">)</span>.[color= #00bfff;]w[/color]
    [color= #00bfff;]beq[/color].[color= #00bfff;]s[/color] Level_WaterPal [color= #adadad; font-style: italic;]; branch if level is HPZ[/color]
    [color= #00bfff;]moveq[/color] [color= #ff0000;]#[/color][color= #ff0000;]$[/color][color= #ff0000;][color= #ff0000;]16[/color][/color],<span style="font-weight:bold;">d0</span> [color= #adadad; font-style: italic;]; palette number $16[/color]
    [color= #00bfff;]cmpi[/color].[color= #00bfff;]b[/color] [color= #ff0000;]#[/color][color= #ff0000;]$[/color][color= #ff0000;]D[/color],<span style="">(</span>Current_Zone<span style="">)</span>.[color= #00bfff;]w[/color]
    [color= #00bfff;]beq[/color].[color= #00bfff;]s[/color] Level_WaterPal [color= #adadad; font-style: italic;]; branch if level is CPZ[/color]
    [color= #00bfff;]moveq[/color] [color= #ff0000;]#[/color][color= #ff0000;]$[/color][color= #ff0000;][color= #ff0000;]17[/color][/color],<span style="font-weight:bold;">d0</span> [color= #adadad; font-style: italic;]; palette number $17[/color]
    &nbsp;
    both_pal:
    [color= #00bfff;]moveq[/color] [color= #ff0000;]#[/color][color= #ff0000;]3[/color],<span style="font-weight:bold;">d0</span>
    [color= #00bfff;]bsr[/color].[color= #00bfff;]w[/color] PalLoad2 [color= #adadad; font-style: italic;]; load Sonic's pallet line[/color]
    [color= #00bfff;]tst[/color].[color= #00bfff;]b[/color] <span style="">(</span>Water_flag<span style="">)</span>.[color= #00bfff;]w[/color] [color= #adadad; font-style: italic;]; does level have water?[/color]
    [color= #00bfff;]beq[/color].[color= #00bfff;]s[/color] Level_GetBgm [color= #adadad; font-style: italic;]; if not, branch[/color]
    [color= #00bfff;]moveq[/color] [color= #ff0000;]#[/color][color= #ff0000;]$[/color][color= #ff0000;][color= #ff0000;]15[/color][/color],<span style="font-weight:bold;">d0</span> [color= #adadad; font-style: italic;]; palette number $15[/color]
    [color= #00bfff;]cmpi[/color].[color= #00bfff;]b[/color] [color= #ff0000;]#[/color][color= #ff0000;]8[/color],<span style="">(</span>Current_Zone<span style="">)</span>.[color= #00bfff;]w[/color]
    [color= #00bfff;]beq[/color].[color= #00bfff;]s[/color] Level_WaterPal [color= #adadad; font-style: italic;]; branch if level is HPZ[/color]
    [color= #00bfff;]moveq[/color] [color= #ff0000;]#[/color][color= #ff0000;]$[/color][color= #ff0000;][color= #ff0000;]16[/color][/color],<span style="font-weight:bold;">d0</span> [color= #adadad; font-style: italic;]; palette number $16[/color]
    [color= #00bfff;]cmpi[/color].[color= #00bfff;]b[/color] [color= #ff0000;]#[/color][color= #ff0000;]$[/color][color= #ff0000;]D[/color],<span style="">(</span>Current_Zone<span style="">)</span>.[color= #00bfff;]w[/color]
    [color= #00bfff;]beq[/color].[color= #00bfff;]s[/color] Level_WaterPal [color= #adadad; font-style: italic;]; branch if level is CPZ[/color]
    [color= #00bfff;]moveq[/color] [color= #ff0000;]#[/color][color= #ff0000;]$[/color][color= #ff0000;][color= #ff0000;]17[/color][/color],<span style="font-weight:bold;">d0</span> [color= #adadad; font-style: italic;]; palette number $17[/color]</pre><!--gc2--><!--TGV2ZWxfTG9hZFBhbDoKCW1vdmUuYgkoTGV2ZWwpLncsZDAKCWNtcGkudwkjMSwoUGxheWVyX21vZGUp
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    Just add the new palette to the end of PalPointers , and your all set.

    Otherwise, flickering is the only logical answer, which would look like shit.
     
  9. Mar 26, 2008 #9
    ICEknight

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    Well... doesn't it show more colors when there's some water on screen? But I guess the water effect just divides the screen and can't apply other colors to specific sprites...
     
  10. Mar 26, 2008 #10
    Bibin

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    It can show 64 simultaniously if you do not count the fact that you can change the palettes at a defined scanline(s). Theoretically, you could have 64*(vertheight) colors, but as this is hard to pull off without being inefficient and inaccurate, resulting in some color wierdness (look at the top of the water in CPZ in Sonic 2 after disabling the watertops; you can see it at the edges. That's the purpose of the top-o-water sprites)

    Now, if you look at the sonic in my signature, you'll see that I merged his tan and reds into a red-orange-tan 5-color gradient, and merged his blues and greys into one long blue line, making what would be greys slightly greyed-blues. Other than the fact that I made his tans too dark, it looks generally good and allows for quite complex shading.
     
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