Who said Crossworlds is gonna be priced at $60? TSR launched at $40. There's a chance that Crossworlds will actually be more affordable than MK9.
I changed that text in my post since the analogy wasn't great. But if CrossWorlds isn't 60, then it's a budget title, which means it's unlikely to be a better experience than TSR.
That's a blind assumption to be making. Price is not an indicator of quality. We've seen that swing both ways throughout the years. I don't disagree that Crossy Road would have been better if it were anything but another Kart racer to stand out, but I don't agree that Mario Kart is going to kill this game. Especially when we don't even know the release windows. There's room in the market for both games. What the hell. Sonic ain't no God damn Mustang or Ferrari.
I was trying to compare two sports cars, but okay. A Ferrari or a Honda Civic. LOL I was taking Formula 1 out of the analogy, because you're not gonna drive one of those to the grocery store. The fact that the Sonic Kart Racing experiece can't even be a Mustang if the Mario Kart Racing experience is a Ferrari more than makes my point. SCW is DOA; QED.
Sonic's a Chevy. Anyways making another kart racer seems like another bad idea. I'd love to be wrong.
I'd love to be wrong too because the first 2 Sumo games were surprisingly good mechanically and the SEGA cross over coating gave it its charm. But man, this ain't a SEGA cross over I don't want a fourth kart racer. Sonic has always been the cool alternative with its experiments. A lot of them are duds, but it was always worth checking out. This is just another damn kart racer. I got your Sonic Racer right here What was the name of that parody Sonic racing game that was basically this?
Yeah I’m not opposed to a fun kart racer but the sega crossover characters and interpretations of different games in a kart racing setting was so cool, especially with a lot of the deep cuts they went with in ASRT (Burning Rangers, Skies of Arcadia, HoTD) that losing those in TSR just made things feel a lot more hollow and lacking character. It was also in a lot of ways, one of the only ways to see modern interpretations of a lot of different Sega characters that had been abandoned. And weird but great picks like Football Manager and General Winter. I’m not opposed to just having it be a Sonic kart racing game but TSR really didn’t do enough to really make the new stages feel like they made up for the entirely missing Sega portion. Also I just really did not vibe with the team mechanic, but I doubt that’s returning.
The problem with the kart racing gimmick is that every time it comes up, someone asks why Sonic is in a car. We've heard the discussion enough times that it's become boring to relitigate it - "he's allowed to have fun" / "it wouldn't be fair to everyone else" / "he likes fast things", bla bla bla. For the record, those reasons are good enough for me, but it doesn't change the fact that people's general reaction to Sonic in a car is confusion. Extreme sports doesn't have this problem. "Why is Sonic on a skateboard?" Because skateboarding is cool and Sonic's brand is cool. This at least takes the concept of mascot racer and dresses it up in a way that suits the Sonic brand. The kart racing gimmick just looks like copying Mario for the sake of it, and doesn't suit Sonic well at all imo. Hell, I'm a Sonic fan myself and have played (charitably, kind of) two of these games - the demos for S&SASR and S&SASRT back when they were new. They felt like Mario Kart but a little worse, but the SEGA stuff was fun and a nice selling point in and of itself. Who is out there thinking "man, I wish I could play Mario Kart but actually it's Sonic instead"?
Kids. Kids love Sonic and friends, they don't know what Golden Axe, Burning Rangers or Space Channel 5 are. They're more likely to recognize a third string Sonic character from Sonic Dash or Roblox than they are Joe Musashi. All three Sumo Digital Sonic racing games have had toys based on them that continue to be sold even years between installments. I could walk into a toy store tomorrow and buy a remote control Team Sonic Racing car.
I'm not arguing in favor of bringing the SEGA cast back for a kart racer. I'm saying kart racing doesn't suit Sonic and they already used a better and more unique concept for a racing spinoff twenty years ago. Can't say I really have my finger on the pulse of what kids are into these days, but at least as far as I was concerned back then I don't think I ever played Double Dash and thought "wow, I wish this was Sonic actually" - but I do remember seeing a Sonic Riders trailer and thinking "wow, flying skateboards!! Sonic is so much cooler than Mario" and begging my mom for it.
That feeling when ASRT actually got me to get invested in Shinobi. But anyway, I'm still blindly clinging to the hope Crossworlds involves other SEGA properties. Especially with the push SEGA claimed to be making with reviving old properties. Yes. It's cope. Until they say it isn't, I can hope.
Is Shadow Generations a budget title? Is it a worse experience than Sonic Frontiers, which launched at $60? I've put hundreds of hours into SASRT and it doesn't feel anything like mario kart to me, aside from the fact that there are items. It doesn't feel like a kart racing game at all. It feels like a sega racer, like it has more in common with Virtua Racing, Outrun 2 and Daytona USA than any mario kart game. It's way more drift heavy than any mario kart game, with the drifting mechanic being much more than just the normal "hold the drift long enough until you gain a speed boost" ala every other kart racer since mario kart 64. You can play SASRT without ever using the item boxes and it still is a killer, top tier racing game. It feels like Sumo Digital was trying to make an AM2 racing clone, with items included. Which tracks since those people have been trying to clone Outrun since the days they were called Gremlin Graphics and were making Lotus Turbo Challenge. SASRT feels like a tribute to AM2, not Mario Kart. I would say no other "kart" racing game feels anywhere near as good as SASRT. SASRT feels like a legitimate racing game. Me? Probably lots of Latin America and Europe, too? You know not everyone grew up with Nintendo, right? I don't hold any attachment to Mario Kart, the references and characters in those games do nothing for me. I grew up with Sega, since the Master System days. SASRT was *exactly* what I'd been asking for since I first read about Sonic Drift in the overseas reports of EGM in the 90's.
Was about to say pretty much this entire post. 200cc is the only time Mario Kart gets close to feeling like SASRT.
More than just about any other non-sim racing game I've ever played, outside of the AM2 classics I cited, SASRT feels like it has more weight and momentum. I know Mario Kart has weight classes and it affects acceleration and the ability to bully opponents, but SASRT uses weight in the physics. I see a lot of people get tripped up on the boat sections when those are when weight and momentum are most important. The boat sections of SASRT are my favorite sections because they're dynamic race tracks, every wave is a different way you can gain speed if you know how to throw your weight around on them. That's why Burning Depths is one of my single favorite levels in the game. The entire levels is basically drifting on water, using your weight and momentum to swing around things. Actually, I take it back, in that regards SASRT feels like it almost has more in common with wipeout conceptually than mario kart.
Kart racing doesn't suit Sonic, but an alternative concept requires a strong design foundation and Sonic R never had that. Sonic Riders did but it wasn't very casual friendly. It was a game where the better player was probably always going to win which put it at odds with the market. I liked Sonic Riders a lot, but my little brother hated it because there was not a chance in hell he was passing me if I gave it my all. So just coming out with the Mario Kart formula is the easiest option, but it also kind of sets you up for failure since the best casual kart racer in the world is right there. I still remember TSR coming out next to CTR and getting crushed. Imagine how they'll do compared to the real thing. I think that they could probably do better with some kind of middle ground between Sonic Riders and Mario Kart, keeping the cool factor and the athleticism but allowing a little more forgiving gameplay and chaos to seep in. Something less Mario Kart Minus and more Wipeout.
I can't really comment on how the games feel to play as I haven't touched them in years, but I'll take your word for it. With that said, yes, I realize plenty of people didn't grow up with Nintendo - I was one of those people. Bro, with all due respect, we're old as fuck as far as the mascot kart racer market is concerned. Pengi is absolutely correct, kids today don't know who these SEGA characters are, but they do like Sonic. My question is, how many kids today like Sonic more than Mario and would pick the Sonic Kart over Mario Kart? If the sales of TSR are any indication, not many. I'm right there with you but we need to recognize that we are part of a tiny, shrinking minority of old people who love Sonic and don't care at all about Mario. Which leads back to my main point: who is this even for? The kids today who would be in the market for a kart racer on their Switch (2) would be more inclined to get Mario Kart, which everyone else in the world will be getting. The Sonic fans are, for the most part, also Mario fans - you and I don't have to get it but you can't really argue that isn't the case. But speaking as a Sonic fan, I can say I personally have zero interest in Mario Kart But Actually It's Sonic - I'd rather just play Mario Kart, which my friends and family will also be playing. Am I incorrect in understanding that TSR was not really a success? If it actually was then I can understand them just doing it again but otherwise I'm dumbfounded by the decision.
Hoping that the little quip by the Japanese Sega Twitter "from the elite racing team" means that it's made Japan internally. Which in turn would mean the Initial D staff getting it's hand on the Sonic IP. That by itself would make it more fresh even if it's just the Sonic IP by itself.
It's HUGE hopium I will admit, but man it would make all the sense in the world to have different internal Sega of Japan departments make Sonic spin-offs. You know, Sonic the Fighters, but more often. Sonic Rumble is similar...its not Sonic Team.
