Yeah it wouldn't be surprising if Sega was super careful about a game's music after S3&K. Might be an additional issue for Pocket Adventure on top of its existing apparent legal issues where it can't even be mentioned in the Encyclo-speed-ia (presumably to do with SNK) with its usage of the MJ Knuckles theme. It's technically just a remix of simple drum beat that no one can copyright, but I doubt Sega's going to take that chance, especially after Origins explicitly doesn't have it. And historically it seems like Sega would just wait to entirely remake a Sonic game from scratch if its music were to be replaced rather than trying to scrub it out of a ROM, considering they've never tried just editing the music of S3&K's ROM so far and SCD just used the American PC version for Gems Collection in all territories(?) so they didn't have to resolve the Casey Rankin lyrics of its Japanese theme, later RSDK-ing it so they could remove them from the Japanese soundtrack. And no one's been clamouring for RSDK versions of the 8-Bit games like they did S3&K for them to make "combined" versions that bring in the benefits of both GG/MS versions, which would presumably be built up over several years, with the subtle extra polish of the more recent, most up to date GG releases which probably favours them in Sega's eyes. Also might be an issue for Sega to rerelease a TecToy version of their game in MS Sonic Blast? I'm not sure what the legalities are in that if any, or if Sega would WANT to acknowledge Tectoy's release of their game which they'd have to, particularly an apparently even shoddier one. I could be way off the mark here, just curious about that specific title, especially after troubles when SNK mainly handled a portable Sonic game. Also yeah, was Master System emulation in a good spot at Sega prior to Plus? I could totally see them playing it safe for bonus emulated games rather than trying to finally figure out emulation for 32X or trackball arcade, just to throw in a single obscure title to the mix. And if you were to include the other Genesis spin-offs they could probably decently emulate, it'd beg the question why Chaotix wasn't also included, especially after this collection already bundled its music as DLC alongside 3D Blast and Spinball. Meanwhile, the 12 GG games are an easy, pre-complete package used in prior releases to add on another complete collection of games to Origins without compromise in one weird title needing more to be done for it like Chaotix or SegaSonic (which I had a dream last night that they additionally added, but lol). Though they were "bonus" games in Gems Collection, they now officially serve to quadruple the number of Origins' titles to a marketable 16 (technically 17 with Blue Sphere), the platformers fitting alongside their mainline Genesis counterparts, conveniently serving as a way to still purchase the games whilst the eShop ended up dying, and setting up Fang's appearance in Superstars. Also offering alterations of the epileptic parts and region switching as the closest things to RSDK-style additions to these games. Which makes it confounding to hear of its emulation problems, considering they've been doing emulators for GG in the 2000s collections, eShop and GG Mini and this most recent one gets to have issues of chugging and input lag apparently, considering it's the only legal way to purchase all these games now. I just want to play these games alongside their Mega Drive siblings in one convenient location in peace, it bums me out to hear that 75% of the collection might be dismissible, and a third of the Plus DLC that could've been spent on further refining the main games themselves, as a concern of that idea prior. Does the Hedgehog Engine just play that badly with other engines inside of it? I remember Generations' emulation of S1 was kinda weird in its music. I'd ask what the specific problems are with each title, if anyone has a list. I think the jump button in particular feels way more laggy than other inputs across multiple games, and I'd guess that and other stuff wasn't part of the original titles.
Original GG mix sounds like it was made of Spyro rather than Sonic. :P Really I think it's not just the MS games, but the fact it's JUST GG ones included as a whole. Like Origins' menu references 3D Blast and Spinball, why aren't THOSE games added as extras, especially since they CERTAINLY have Megadrive emulation handy. Heck they could dig deeper and rerelease Sonic Eraser for the first time, sure it's not amazing but it would definitely turn heads just by the obscurity of it all. Chaotix and SEGASonic, I get it, 32X and arcade emulation have not peaked yet, but there is still plenty within Sonic's early roster besides the Game Gear to make this compilation feel more thorough. The best conclusion I could make is that they maybe wanna save material for a potential second compilation, but even then I think the remaining 16 bit games would have fit better in Origins thematically which has most of those retro 8 bit and 16 bit era games.
Quick correction: The Japanese version of Gems Collection has the original Hataya/Ogata score, and the Casey Rankin penned lyrics injected into the 1996 PC port (which was Nilsen et al. in all regions). It's a shame they didn't think to make it swappable for all regions at this point, as it may have alleviated the lyrics copyright headache later. But who can say?
its not too common, though i heard Ogata had a habit of it, not enough to call him a hack or anything, but the occasional slip up. if it makes you feel any better, stolen demo songs from synths are quite common, even pokemon has stolen demo songs before
All regional releases of Sonic Gems Collection have both Sonic CD soundtracks. Which one is used depends on your console's region. The Game Gear is a Master System with a smaller screen and an expanded colour pallette. If you can emulate the Game Gear, you can emulate the Master System.
Music workstations are made for (get this) making music, so I don't think those typically have any restrictions on how you use their pre-made material - it'd be a nightmare to get licenses for every instrument sound or music sample once you're all done and happy with a song, so the "license" to that simply comes along with the purchase of whatever you're using. Maybe it'd be a little embarrassing for nearly the whole thing to sound exactly like the original demos, but I don't think their Master System cover version of it is stepping on anyone's toes, because Korg sells music making tools, not music. A common comparison made when people play Sonic 06 is that Town Mission 4 sounds like Flash Man Stage from Mega Man 2, which in turn some people compare to the main chorus of Metallica's Seek and Destroy. Mega Man 1 also has Elec Man's theme which sounds pretty much exactly like the intro to some Journey song, Even Nintendo isn't immune to stuff like this. There's a whole video on stuff Koji Kondo pulled from. If you wanna be particular, most Sonic music, but more specifically Sonic 06 and Unleashed tracks are HEAVILY based on sample packs, which falls in line with what I said about Korg except they more explicitly sell you parts of music. It's how you get Shadow the Hedgehog's options theme sounding like some Need for Speed DS game. for 06, so much of Kingdom Valley is based on raw samples that it can be reconstructed and the most you're missing is the brass and string sounds. Like this: Edit: I also wanna add in that Sonic 06 also has Tropical Jungle: The Ruins AND the intro to Crisis City which both use rising strings similar to the choir synth in Super Mario 64's Koopa Road. TL:DR? most video game music you like isn't completely original. But it's still pretty damn good music.
I think there’s nothing wrong with music being built around sample packs, it all comes down to how the composer implements and works around the samples. Akira Yakaoka’s Silent Hill work heavily uses sample packs and they’re implemented so well that his creative imprint is v much left on it. Same with Hideki Naganuma’s Jet Set Radio & Sonic Rush work. I really don’t think that sample packs really have a place in a conversation about “stolen music” in video games when tons of video games from all generations use sample packs to great effect. of course I understand that there’s always the argument that sometimes sample packs aren’t well implemented into a song but like, I think 06 & Unleashed’s use of sample packs is fine.
My apologies for jumping to conclusions then, I just get kinda emotional about sample pack conversations lol
I thought it was only on PS2, but I remember someone importing the Japanese GameCube version of Sonic Gems Collection, and still having the North American soundtrack. Also, I have a question I can't find the answer for and this thread is huge: is the Drop Dash implemented correctly in this version of Sonic CD? I know it isn't in the two first games and is is in Sonic 3 & Knuckles.
For Gems Collection and the Sonic CD soundtrack it was like this: Gamecube version JPN: Plays JPN/EUR soundtrack Gamecube version USA: Plays USA soundtrack Gamecube version EUR: Plays USA soundtrack For PS2 versions, it played both soundtracks, but you needed a PS2 that let you changed language settings to Japanese in the system menu, in order to change the soundtracks. European PS2 did not have this option. So the European PS2 would only play the USA soundtrack (even though the JPN/EUR track was on the disc). Likewise, if you imported the Japanese version and tried to play it on a modded EUR/US PS2 it would only play the USA track.
I imported the Japanese GameCube version of Sonic Gems Collection in 2005 and played it on my European GameCube, and it only has the Japanese soundtrack.
Sonic CD has the same cheesable "disguised Spin Dash" Sonic Team implementation of the Drop Dash that S1/S2 have, only difference being SCD's never had roll lock to confound it whilst S1/S2 did before that was patched out with Plus.
What is this conspiracy posting about one stolen song shaking up an entire library of games. Stop that. They probably used game gear because 1. They have in 99% of their rereleases so far. 2. Some of the game gear games don’t even have master system ports, so what, you would take half that look odd and bizarre with lots of bugs and the other half that look like they’ve crunched them in a magnifying glass? Of course I would’ve liked both, but why would they expend resources emulating both machines, this game is clearly low on Segas priority. It’s easier and more uniform to just drop the game gear roms in and call it a day.
Because, like I said above, they're basically the same hardware. There's a reason why every Master System emulator in existence also emulates the Game Gear.
I'm OK with no MS versions. Honestly only Sonic 2 really needs it, for everything else GG is fine. Maybe not the best version of every game, but they went for consistency and not confusing average players. I'm also OK with excluding 3D Blast and Gens Spinball for the same reason. And it means they haven't been de-listed elsewhere, which for 3D Blast is preferable because in the Classics Collection you can mod it to Director's Cut. What's less excusable is the quality of the GG emulation. FFS fix the audio and lag, and add filter options/blur fix to the whole game!
I didn't notice until recently that the gg version of sonic 1 has some level layout changes, nothing huge but some of the checkpoint monitors are moved around. Anyway, sega adding game gear games was likely just an "how can we make the dlc worth $10" question in a meeting.
Adventure too, actually. The entire drumline for the Mystic Ruins theme is taken from one, which is likely why the Mystic Ruins past theme, which is just that drumline, was not released on the OST. Sample providers generally frown on just selling their shit unmodified. Sand Hill also uses a sample at the beginning that I've heard even a few years ago in tracks released on Beatport.
