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Sonic Origins Collection - General Thread

Discussion in 'General Sonic Discussion' started by HEDGESMFG, May 27, 2021.

  1. charcoal

    charcoal

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    It's a Sonic game, and it released on Switch. I'd be very surprised if it didn't sell like hotcakes among kids, especially after Sonic 2.

    A DLC is probably well worth it for SEGA.
     
  2. The Game Collector

    The Game Collector

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    Being Ted Narcotic's bass player; working on Kelly Kristjanson's tape archive; collecting video games
    Actually, this would even be awesome to see implemented in rom hacks of Sonic 1 and Sonic 2. I don't recall anyone doing this with the standalone games. Maybe the newest versions of Sonic Delta has it? (I haven't played it yet) But that's still not individually.
     
  3. nineko

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  4. E-122-Psi

    E-122-Psi

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    • For save system, I'd settle for them reinstating the level menu for CLEAR files like they had in the remakes. I don't get why they disabled it. That leaves out CD, though the PC version had a sort of save system that was similar, they just need to add the ability to select zones afterwards.
    • I do feel like more toggles should be there, like Sonic 2's VS has elemental shields by default, and the whole Sonic 3/Sonic and Knuckles theming inconsistency.
    • More VS options would be neat, especially if they also add new characters meaning they could put in a 4 player mode. I think Sonic 3 would be harder to implement, which is why I'd be all for them fleshing out the Competition Mode like they intended.
    • One idea I feel has potential that I don't think has been suggested before is a variation of Mania's Encore Mode, imagine remixed versions of the classic Sonic games with new layouts. Also means that if by some miracle they DO remake Chaotix they can give it more competent level design.
     
  5. McAleeCh

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    If they do go ahead with the idea for DLC, my main hope is they try to hire either Headcannon or Evening Star - folks who know their way around the Retro Engine already - to develop it, along with allowing them to make bugfixes etc. to the games at the same time.

    My second hope would be that they'd take the Mania Plus route of having some of the upgrades/fixes as a free patch for the base game. This way bugfixes and quality-of-life additions like, say, adding a Sonic 3 style Data Select screen to the other games in the collection could be rolled out to all players.

    My third would be that they use the opportunity to give the game a physical release with the DLC content included on the disc/cart, again like Mania Plus.
     
  6. Swifthom

    Swifthom

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    I know some people are keen on dlc characters (Amy, metal sonic, mighty, Ray, etc) but personally I just can't see that cutting it. At least not alone.

    The original sprite works to make Amy playable would be significant. I just can't see it feelibg authentic.

    And I would feel more value for money with new games. Which, I think, would 100% require Headcannon or taxman to produce.

    UNLESS they just uploaded roms. But then, that would put them out of kilter with the rest of the collection.

    I'd love for spinball, mean bean machine and 3D to round out the Mega drive years but can't see it happening. Those games don't feel quite suitable for the retro engine (actually, we know mean bean could work).

    So... whats lower hanging fruit for future dlc? I can't see any of these turning around in less than a year but would love to see...

    Game gear upgrades on retro engine
    Knuckles chaotix...
    Or skip forwards and upgrade the advance trilogy?
     
  7. Laura

    Laura

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    I'd much prefer new characters or stages than other games to be added. I'd play the other games for maybe an hour then never again. They are all available on Steam too so it's not much new. Knuckles Chaotix would be novel but it's a terrible game.

    If they added new characters or stages it would be something actually fresh which would have more longevity.
     
  8. HEDGESMFG

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    Just give me Knuckles and Super forms as a bonus in CD and emulated Chaotix, damn it. I just did a replay of the latter yesterday and even just an emulated version of the game would be fine for most players given how obscure it is.

    And restore save files to 1-2 and give a better stage select for CD. And keep fixing the damn bugs.

    Beyond that, I actually don't have too many demands.

    Master System/GG Emulation would also be nice, but I'm not counting on it.
     
  9. Mookey

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    Lol, all of these big hopes for DLC that probably doesn't even exist when the base game couldn't even come close to delivering the big hopes it had. Heck, they haven't even fixed all of the major bugs for the base game yet and people are alread putting together DLC wishlists.

    That's just crazy.
     
  10. RetroJordan91

    RetroJordan91

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    How do you know that there aren’t any more bug fixes being worked on behind the scenes? I mean, don’t get me wrong, I could totally be in denial, but why send out these surveys after the release if you’re not going to do anything to support the game further? That’s what doesn’t make sense. It’s not a good marketing tactic if you ask me.

    I have a gut feeling we will hear some stuff after Frontiers comes out (down the line in 2023).. this is the exact same thing that SEGA did with Mania and we ended up with Mania Plus.. a polished up physical release should be a no-brainer.
     
  11. Nik Pi

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  12. _Sidle

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    I wouldn't say "finally", the page is seemingly still in the state it was a month+ ago, being nearly completely ripped, with the exception of the redrawn + upscaled Competition Mode assets that still aren't there.

    I've heard one of those up-rezzed stages somehow goes over tile limit, which amazes me considering how small those levels are to physically traverse. Hoping those tiles and the maps themselves get extracted soon!
     
  13. Mookey

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    I didn't say there weren't, just that there hasn't been any since the first and I'd rather not speculate about stuff that no one knows about.
     
  14. One thing is clear to me: Origins wasn't nearly as well received as Mania, and didn't make nearly as much noise. Mania received a lot of praise and attention, even from unexpected sources, and people talked about it for a good while.

    Origins on the other hand let a lot of people down, with its steep price tag, old-ass ports of 1, 2 and CD with hardly anything new, a rushed port of 3&K with a craptastic soundtrack, and a huge load of bugs to top it off. While it's true that it wasn't exactly execrated, any noise that this game made, good or bad, died off pretty quickly.

    This project was NOT handled well by SEGA, and I don't expect we'll hear much more about it in the future.
     
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  15. TomGyroid

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    I'm torn on introducing even more games into the collection. For a tidy collection of just the mainline Genesis classics, how many spin-off games are needed to make that section feel just as "complete?" Is it just the Mega Drive titles that they deemed significant enough for music pack DLC, minus Mean Bean Machine for basically being another franchise's game and a different version of Sonic? Would it go further than that with Classic Sonic's significant handheld (and technically console) platformer history, or SegaSonic if Mighty and Ray get added as new characters?

    On one hand, just emulating them, while lucrative enough for games like Knuckles Chaotix and SegaSonic, would be inconsistent with the thesis statement of the collection and maybe make people question why emulations of the original games weren't utilised (though I understand why, with S3&K's music rights compromising that and giving the remasters that feature being a unique novelty in and of itself). But on the other hand, poor Headcannon just want to see their version of S3&K be the best that it can be, and imagine Sega rushed their development only to then drop at least one other entire game to remaster from the ground up in their laps. With expectations of improvements and newly added features, maybe depending on whatever title is chosen. Perhaps Sonic Team or otherwise could do it, Stealth and Taxman seem to have every (mainline, at least) Sonic game they ever wanted remastered, but as with the prospect of adding entire new characters, ST can't even put the Drop Dash into the Retro Engine without a now-fixed Tails glitch and graphical weirdness because it's actually an altered Spin Dash.

    And regardless of which method they pick, that's development that could be spent on at least continued bug fixes for the main games. Be it making another remaster or two, or making sure the emulator's on point and potentially works for trickier stuff like the 32X, Saturn or arcade boards. I wouldn't say no to some bonus games, but I don't know if the decent time of Spinball is something I've seen any fan clamour to see in widescreen with long awaited additions, and I'd kinda rather just see more stuff in the games I'll actually play more often like Super Peel-Out across all titles.

    One exception I'd see as worthwhile would be 3D Blast, seeing as the game's own director developed a superior ROM hack that's basically that game's Taxman/Stealth equivalent. I don't know if Jon Burton would know his way around the Retro Engine, but it'd be a shame for Sega not to capitalise on that whilst acknowledging the game significantly in this collection. Could certainly also meld it with the improvements of the Saturn version, like the lauded Special Stages and soundtrack. I mean if Wikipedia's going to egregiously categorise it as a mainline entry, it's currently the only one we're missing from the Genesis. It's also tempting to add Mean Bean Machine as that totally does exist in the Retro Engine through Mania, but that has its aforementioned issues for inclusion as they'd basically be making AoStH part of a canonical game experience, and we're certainly not short on ways to play Puyo Puyo in this day and age.
     
  16. McAleeCh

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    Just had a minor epiphany re: one of the new Sonic 3 & Knuckles cheat codes - for the one which activates proper physics/abilities in Competition Mode (03, 02, 01, 06, 00), knocking off the preceding '0' on each selected track makes it as close as you can get to typing the Competition Mode countdown "3, 2, 1, GO" using only numbers. Feel stupid for not noticing that sooner, haha!
     
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  17. Harper

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    Another patch for Origins might be coming out. According to the data on SteamDB, SEGA's been updating the "develop" and "review" branches for Origins on Steam.
    Screenshot_13.png
     
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  18. RetroJordan91

    RetroJordan91

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    That’s good to know :) here’s hoping all those support tickets I sent to SEGA will have been addressed in this next update :V
     
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  19. Snowbound

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    And we still have no official word on Headcanon’s involvement with the patches. At this point I’m assuming they aren’t. I hope I’m proven wrong.
     
  20. TomGyroid

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    Origins' S3&K was updated to incorporate bugfixes and the cheats, and the all zeros "hard mode" cheat in particular seems to have only ever been added to the game in the most recent patch, as it was absent in the code list CodenameGamma released before that patch. Not sure if the S3 branding and fixed camera codes, at least, were also only implemented in the game data post-patch as well. Maybe that could suggest it's a later Headcannon update version of the game? Because I don't know, it seems like more of a HC thing to continue to add these specific cheats in if Sonic Team can only alter a cheat code to remove content with the other titles. They also couldn't implement the Drop Dash without clearly displaying frames from a Spin Dash animation, so maybe they'd need HC's help if they wanted to add in (albeit simpler) game-changing cheat codes regardless. But who knows, maybe it was all tucked away in the version HC originally handed over or something.

    Side note, a cool detail I've discovered is that enabling hard mode in S3&K actually affects the otherwise-inaccessible Bonus Stages. Selecting the Gumball stage with the level select just gives you no gumballs whatsoever. Considering how the hard mode, S2 Shield and random items codes consistently alter the Bonus Stages to account for their cheat, it makes me wonder why the bananas code doesn't. Maybe it's legitimately intended to be a twist on the gameplay where items are only accessible through the Bonus Stages, that'd be pretty neat.