Sonic Origins Collection Announced for 2022

Discussion in 'General Sonic Discussion' started by HEDGESMFG, May 27, 2021.

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  1. Blastfrog

    Blastfrog

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    If I had to guess, they probably didn't think it worth their time being so busy with everything else, nor did they want to confuse players by changing entire level themes but probably figured that changing special event themes was okay. Note that all of the MJ tracks that S&K shared with S3 were replaced in S&K, they reverted the miniboss theme to the proto version (still in the ROM, easy pointer swap) and replaced the Knux theme. Why they didn't touch up the proto Knux theme, who knows.
     
  2. I think they didn't used Knuckles' prototype theme in Sonic (3) & Knuckles probably because it was "too silly" for S&K context, maybe. But I also think Sonic & Knuckles theme is better than the proto and even S3 alone.
     
  3. RikohZX

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    I still feel like the beta/S&KC songs were probably partly placeholders to some degree. They sound very different from the rest of the music even when given proper sound chip quality, and like a different composer from the rest of the non-MJ music. Maybe holdovers from earlier in development before the project got rebooted in full? Still doesn't explain how the MJ music got slipped in at what would've had to be the borderline last minute.
     
  4. Azookara

    Azookara

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    Feels like an immense disservice to write off the beta music as "placeholder". Especially to Carnival Night; those tracks are amazing.

    I feel like the simplest answer right now is the best. These songs were made first, then MJ came along and said he wanted to do the OST. They started on it and only finished so much before MJ decided against it / those infamous allegations got to Sega, and then both parties cut it off. Someone in the high chair either didn't know what was up and told it to go gold before a decision to reverse anything on the music side (unlikely), OR they were a bit too proud of the work and wanted to slide it in anyway (more likely), and the rest is history.
     
  5. RikohZX

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    I don't hate them by any means, and I prefer the beta Carnival and Launch easily, but it just kinda feels out of place next to the songs in 3 and the style in K. Maybe that's just me though.
     
  6. nesboy43

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    The presentation was a whole lot of nothing after 4 years of a whole lot of nothing.

    I have better things to do then be thankful and worship Sega because they announced announcements. This presentation was too early and unnecessary. If you drink their kool
    aid that's your own fault.
     
  7. AzuraRacon

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    Top-of-my-head guess?
    It came down to Voice samples
    That seems to be the one all three replaced songs have in common

    I wont pretend to know exactly what contracts were involved because obviously no one but sega and the composers do, but it’s not farfetched to think any song with a voice sample in it had some stipulation that they couldnt be reused in different contexts than they were used originally, whether deliberately or due to legal technicality

    And at that point it’s better to replace the offending tracks even in sonic 3’s half for consistency

    CNZ and LBZ would have been safe under those circumstances because they arent being moved out of their original context
     
  8. nesboy43

    nesboy43

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    I honestly don't feel they had to do anything but announce maybe the Hospital DLC and Sonic Colors Ultimate since those actually have something to be shown.

    The 30 minute presentation thing? There wasn't enough content for that format. I think Sega would've had a much stronger showing if they didnt have vague "announcements of announcements" for the new Sonic game, Sonic toys, and Origins Collection.
     
  9. AzuraRacon

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    I will say it feels like sega put disproportionate amount of attention on some things. Like, assuming we are getting the taxman ports of even just Sonic 1/2/CD on console, 1 and 2 being freed from mobile devices and 3 getting out of licensing hell is kind of a big deal. But they let people for the most part just think it was a rom collection and let 3’s ten year absence continue to be an elephant in the room.

    We even had to find out about Sonic 3’s in-progress widescreen conversion through the PR manager’s personal account
     
  10. Vanishing Vision

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    I wonder why there weren't any problems with CD's rerelease then? CD has even more voice samples, and they're all there in the 2011 version, only the opening/ending theme vocals are missing.
     
  11. DigitalDuck

    DigitalDuck

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    And yet it was released again, in both 2011 and 2016.

    Sonic 3 and Sonic & Knuckles have only a couple of music tracks in common. All other tracks are different between the two, most likely to fully sell Sonic & Knuckles as a separate game. When it's not possible to use both in-game (because they're for the same event - e.g. title screen, Knuckles, invincibility, miniboss, credits) the Sonic & Knuckles version is used. It has nothing to do with rights issues.

    Much like all of this really.
     
  12. BlackHole

    BlackHole

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    There was also that thing with Sonic Spinball, where they tried to use Sonic the Hedgehog (Mega Drive)'s theme and couldn't as SEGA didn't own the rights.
     
  13. I remember when the 1103 prototype was revealed, people were saying that MJ’s team came in late in 3’s development, which doesn’t make sense because the allegations became public in August or so; SEGA wouldn’t have even offered him to do music that late, especially with the bad publicity against Michael.

    I think the likely scenario is this: MJ and his people were brought in during the middle of development (May-July 93), they finished recording a soundtrack in 4 weeks and gave their work to SEGA (according to Buxer I believe), the allegations hit in August, SEGA attempts to scrub all of MJ’s work (hence the prototype tracks), but due to crunch time, the November deadline, and the prototype tracks sounding a bit unpolished, they had no choice but to use some of the more complete songs made by MJ’s team; they would bring in Howard Drossin to touch up the MJ songs so they don’t sound too familiar.

    And the rest is history as they say.
     
  14. BlackHole

    BlackHole

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    And then his father comes along after his death and tries to milk the series for more money, since they're using his son's samples.
     
  15. Vanishing Vision

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    Yeah, same reason why the vastly superior Sonic 1/2 act clear jingle has never reappeared, even in nostalgia-focused games like 4, Generations and Mania.
     
  16. Blue Blood

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    I think that at this point the S3 act clear jingle has just become ingrained as a series' signature. It was used in every mainline game before Unleashed (excluding Shadow) and several spin-offs. Generations and Mania, for which SEGA did acquire the rights to use several of Nakamura's other compositions, still used the S3 jingle regardless. And thinking about it now, even '06 opted for the S3 act clear jingle despite remixing Sweet Sweet Sweet. The S3 act clear jingle was almost certainly created as a substitute for the S1 jingle, but it's since become a mainstay in its own right.
     
    Last edited: Jun 2, 2021
  17. Dark Sonic

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    The only time the Sonic 1/2 act clear jingle was ever used outside of those two games was oddly Sonic R (it was used in combination with the getting an emerald jingle on the emerald screen). Something tells me they didn't get permission to use it there but it somehow slipped under the radar
     
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  18. SystemsReady

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    the Sonic 1/2 clear jingle sounds too melancholy, while the Sonic 3 onwards clear jingle sounds triumphant fite me
     
  19. AzuraRacon

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    Sampling in Sonic CD is different than the Sampling in Sonic 3

    As far as I’m aware 3’s samples were recorded specifically for the music in the game, while CD’s were borrowed from other music. Only the new voice clips would be subject to contract stipulations by their composers/the vocalist

    That said; I guess it could also just be the case that MJ’s team composing them alone is why they couldnt be moved onto new scenes, with them not on staff anymore to sign off on the new uses in the back half. Guess I kinda zero’d in on samples as being the common thread while ignoring the much more obvious thing
     
  20. Dek Rollins

    Dek Rollins

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    While I'm sure they've continued using the Sonic 3 clear theme for the sake of consistency, the Sonic 1/2 clear theme will never not be superior. The Sonic 3 one sounds like a generic knockoff in comparison.
     
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