Sonic Origins Collection Announced for 2022

Discussion in 'General Sonic Discussion' started by HEDGESMFG, May 27, 2021.

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  1. jbr

    jbr

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    That's interesting, although, what form were the sound files in? Did they differ from the music used in the collection itself? If they were just the same MIDIs, then that might just imply they weren't included for the same reason they weren't in the games themselves, whatever that is. But if they were different from the game music, or in an audio format, then that does indeed add to the mystery.
     
  2. Sid Starkiller

    Sid Starkiller

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    Unfortunately I no longer remember for sure. I wanna say .wav, because I remember them sounding exactly like the Genesis hardware, which would imply that they're recordings instead of MIDIs. I might still have the disc lying around somewhere, but I wouldn't know how to get the screensaver running on Windows 10.
     
  3. I always found that strange: they released the complete tracks for Toot Toot Sonic Warrior and Cosmic Eternity with the vocals for the Sonic CD OST release for Sonic’s 20th anniversary, but didn’t bother to update the 2011 remaster itself?? Like wtf??

    I hope that gets fixed in Origins

    So I tried quoting JaxTH’s post but my phone doesn’t want to cooperate with me:

    Sonic 3 and Sonic & Knuckles were on the Ultimate Genesis collection in 2009 for X360 and PS3, but as separate games, not locked on. If you were referring to a separate release on the PlayStation Store like 1,2, and CD, then yes you are correct.

    This was the last home console release of 3&K until Origins.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 1, 2021
  4. HEDGESMFG

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    They were heavily compressed wav files.
     
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  5. JaxTH

    JaxTH

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    Jack shit.
    There is a topic either in the Sega Retro forum or the Reverse Engineering forum if you are curious.

    Patches cost money back then. I know Taxman answered a question like this as well, but Sega probably didn't see a point.
     
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  6. Despatche

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    All I want is for them to fix the timer bug in CD, like they did with the mobile version.

    Assuming 3&K does somehow get Taxmanitized, I have to wonder if M2 will ever get their hands on 3&K, or any other Sonic game. That aside, I always wanted to see a collection with both M2 and Taxman versions together. If we call the original game "vanilla", then M2 works well as "chocolate" and Taxman works well as "strawberry" (or whatever sounds more fancy to you).

    ...Also, I am going to be very upset if they just cop out and try to get the rights to the MJ/BB music. We know the truth, Sega. You don't have to hide from us anymore. Show us what Sonic 3 was really supposed to sound like.
     
  7. Starduster

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    Idk I’d rather have the option to be honest. I prefer PC Carnival Night, can go either way on Ice Cap and prefer Mega Drive Launch Base. If I could switch on the fly that’d be fantastic.
     
  8. Laura

    Laura

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    What? The game was supposed to have the MJ/BB music, that's why it launched with that OST.

    I do like the PC tracks (I actually like the PC Midi tracks too) but I don't think we should say the release soundtrack is somehow not the "real" one.
     
  9. Zycor

    Zycor

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    Well, I did say I wasn't a lawyer. Doesn't the Boss Music JP for Sonic CD pretty blatantly use effectively an unedited version of the song it "samples"? As far as I'm aware that's still on Spotify. I also know DOOM borrowed a bunch from existing music back in 93 and I believe iD at the time basically concluded that they knew how much they could get away with due to them having law experience. I know the AI can't catch every single thing of copyright infringement, there's a lot of hilarious situations that are still in recent memory like Toei I believe copyright struck their own channel off of YouTube briefly, and didn't Warner Brothers do something similar?

    I thought sampling was by and large okay so long as the new product provided a completely different end product to the original, specifically for music, but I'm sure there would still be some legal asterisks. Seems weird because there's a lot of covers of songs on Spotify as well (some of which even use the official no vocals tracks rather than playing their own playing of the BGM), that seems like it would also go against some legal stuff. I know sampling is usually done from purchasing samples. As far as Sonic Rush went, I thought Right There Ride On used a guitar riff that Naganuma had done himself (although I don't know about the actual lyrics themselves, but I've heard a version of the song without the lyrics), perhaps that's also an actual sample? I can't speak for most of the rest of the samples in Sonic Rush as the only ones I'm aware of are the "The kitty cat is going to scratch me, go ahead, scratch me" from an old cartoon and of course the Malcolm X sampling for the final boss music. I know Ethno Circus was it? Uses a pretty commonly sampled rap track and the special stage/New Day/Ending music uses samples that are pretty well used as well. Same with the music in Sonic Adventure/Sonic Adventure 2 for the Chao lobby using the "With the greatest request" and "Layin the wax and spinnin' the sound". I know some of the samples were used from songs that are fairly well known (that Hot Hot Hot song?). There were some videos by a guy on YouTube that had a bunch of the sample origins but it looks like ironically that video was deleted, probably for infringement.

    Although the law is a complicated mess. I keep waiting for some music company to start taking random people saying something as copyright infringement of lyrics from songs arbitrarily. Although I doubt it would hold up in proper court, but that doesn't mean they couldn't abuse the YouTube take down system, no one ever seems to be properly legally punished for knowingly filing bullshit claims (which is illegal as far as I'm aware). I am not sure the legal system even holds up to its original ideals considering it seems that the courts have been effectively gate kept by costs.

    I'm annoyed about Quake not being able to have its music sold with it digitally (it isn't like I don't get it, licensing agreement ended long ago, I'm surprised they weren't forced to change the textures like they had to remove the NIN Easter egg in E4M1 in Ultimate DOOM, but it's still present in some releases). I'm unaware of if any Quake fans have put together any fan made music packs to make up for the lack of NIN music. I'm aware you can technically supply your own music so long as the tracks are properly named.

    As for Sonic 3 & Knuckles, maybe some day (maybe the day of this collection) we'll see SEGA reissue the Sonic 3 songs with their beta/PC versions fully realized? Or they just had their in house team make new music or they finalized the music that was in the beta version by using the demo tapes as a base? I mean if the guy from Traveler Tales who worked on Sonic 3D Blast/Flickies Island and Sonic R still had those tapes for Sonic 3D, it's possible they still have the tapes for Sonic 3. I didn't know the disc didn't have the super compressed wav file versions of the changed music. I still have my copy of the Sonic and Knuckles collection disc.
     
  10. Chibisteven

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    The Sonic Screensaver uses low quality wav files with a sample rate of 11,025 Hz, 8-bits per sample and mono (1 channel).

    These aren't compressed. The wav files are pure uncompressed LPCM. Just a crap rate and bit depth which results in smaller file sizes.
     
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  11. Ashura96

    Ashura96

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    It's been included on those shitty AtGames clone consoles but outside of that I can't recall S&K alone getting released on a real platform.
     
  12. RikohZX

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    Taking after the Sonic CD 2011 choice of American or Japanese would be ideal, yeah. You can even preface it with the exact same terms technically. :V
     
  13. It'd be nice to have soundtrack options for all the games. Like with Sonic 1 and 2 it'd be neat to be able to toggle Masa's demo versions. I wouldn't expect that to happen though.

    If we don't get such options, I really hope CD has the proper music.
     
  14. Starduster

    Starduster

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    I think one very interesting thing this collection could do for CD is bring the original US musicians back in and have them create the past themes that were intended but cut due to technical constraints.
     
  15. It would be nice to have the Sonic Boom album version for the US soundtrack in Sonic CD (I mean in-game), since some songs are a little more extended.
     
  16. TheOcelot

    TheOcelot

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    If Sonic 3D blast gets included in the collection it would be cool if both the Mega-Drive & Saturn soundtracks are included with an option to switch between both in-game.
     
    Last edited: Jun 1, 2021
  17. Gestalt

    Gestalt

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    Getting Brad Buxer & Co. on board was a genius move imo. Sonic 3 for the Sega Mega Drive/Genesis wouldn't have been the same without these tracks. Anyhow, just like the Sega Ages version of Sonic 1 had the Mega Play arcade version of the game available in its options, I'd be happy if there would be an option to choose between the PC port and the Mega Drive version of Sonic 3.
     
  18. SystemsReady

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    this confuses me. lots of games have been pulled altogether for music licensing issues, yet Sonic 3 is still on Steam, albeit as Sonic 3 & Knuckles.
     
  19. RikohZX

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    I think the idea is that the game couldn't be released again any further, it just was either overlooked or allowed to stay up in its previous forms. If there was an explicit licensing issue that was head-hunting we would've seen what happened to the GTA games where they got updates within the past year or two that stripped out functionality and entire swaths of licensed music. Something tells me that for as much of a common knowledge urban legend sorta thing as the rights issues can be, it's a hella lot more complex than any of us figure.
     
  20. Has a reason ever been unearthed as to why only a few tracks were replaced when you play Sonic 3&K as opposed to Sonic 3 alone? Obviously Knuckles’ theme, the mini boss theme, and the credits were changed.

    If they were trying to scrub any trace of MJ’s involvement, wouldn’t they have used that development time after S3A to finish polishing up the prototype/original tracks so they can replace the existing MJ ones when you combine the games together?

    Knowing what we know now, we could have had the true original OST in 1994 instead of 1997 and the music issues wouldn’t have been a thorn in SEGA’s side for so long
     
    Last edited: Jun 2, 2021
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