Sonic Month 2019: Sonic 3

Discussion in 'General Sonic Discussion' started by drx, Nov 16, 2019.

  1. Naean

    Naean

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    2D. Sonic Level Designs
    Thought so, cheers for clarifying. :)

    If I may correct you, both prototype music tracks of Lava Reef Zone aren't basically identical to final, and have some fairly significant differences. Someone on YouTube (Can't remember specifically who, sorry!) noted that Act 1 in the prototype apparently uses the same bass as Angel Island Zone's music tracks. The section right before Act 1's loop point also sounds a fair bit different, slightly more empty. Act 2 has a notably different synth sound, doesn't come across as high pitched compared to final, although that might just be instrumentation differences messing with my pitch perception.

    I'll agree that the prototype music tracks for Sandopolis Zone and Marble Garden Zone sound very close to final. Hydrocity Zone's prototype music tracks sound pretty similar to final as well, although I noticed Act 2 has some subtle differences in a lot of the foreground melody, sounds a hair quieter/less full.
     
    Last edited: Nov 25, 2019
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  2. SystemsReady

    SystemsReady

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    this is what I get for posting that before running out the door :words: with Act 1 I chalked that up to mixing/ripping differences but now I hear it. With act 2, yea, the lead synth is totally different. I can't tell much for all the other parts of act 2 though - is it using the AIZ bass as well?
     
  3. Naean

    Naean

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    2D. Sonic Level Designs
    No worries. :thumbsup:

    Bass in the prototype Lava Reef Zone Act 2 track sounds quite similar to the final track's bass to me, although there may be very subtle differences, along with some other prototype tracks.
     
  4. Ben2k9

    Ben2k9

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    Just thought id come out of the woodwork to post my gratitude to DRX and the rest, this is absolutely incredible!

    Not sure if its been said or not but this proto proves without a shadow of a doubt that FBZ was intended to slot between CNZ and ICZ, which is cool! it also gives credence as to why the badniks appear in the Western manuals. kind of wierd how late they left it to decide to pull it from sonic 3 though!
     
  5. Chainspike

    Chainspike

    Stealing rings since 1994 Member
    Yes, it uses the same bass instrument (likely a bass guitar imitation) in both acts of Angel Island, as well as Hydrocity Act 2. Another similarity is that the electric guitar sounding instrument in the prototype Angel Island Act 1 sounds a lot like the same instrument that would be used for the Lava Reef Act 1's loop point in the final game.
     
    Last edited: Nov 26, 2019
  6. Dark Sonic

    Dark Sonic

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    Someone took a crack at restoring Lava Reef Act 2. Kinda neat.
     
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  7. Laura

    Laura

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    I can see why the drop dash was scrapped in its Sonic 3 incarnation. It's incredibly glitchy. Sometimes the up input will trigger for seemingly no reason, sometimes it'll get delayed because Sonic isn't on the right surface and then will trigger on a wall or ceiling.

    The Mania rendition is far more elegant, going beyond the fact its button mapped far better.
     
  8. Kimberly

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    While this is true you also have to remember this is a very early prototype that is extremely unpolished. While we only see the 'drop dash' in the state as it is now, it's very possible if the concept wasn't scrapped it would have been much more polished. For example, the first prototype of Sonic 2 that has the Spin dash is much less polished compared to the final game. The difference between the two is that the spin dash wasn't scrapped.
     
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  9. Laura

    Laura

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    I accept that, but I still think the Sonic 2 proto spin-dash is less bugged out than this drop dash.

    Than again, I also think the Sonic 3 drop dash has less utility. I get the impression that it's supposed to be used on sections where it's difficult to use the spindash (like those ramps where you roll around if you try to press down). Especially since you have to stand still to use it comfortably.
     
  10. I agree on it being less utilized. Maybe in AIZ, MGZ and MHZ it could be used to some great effect... maybe.

    There might be a few more, but I never felt that I wish there'd be a better move than the Spin Dash to help me through Sonic 3. Maybe because I never knew it was something I wanted 'till Mania came along. lol (Oh Sonic Mania, you spoil me.)
     
  11. Skyler

    Skyler

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    This is all good. All very, very good.
     
  12. The Other RaFaél

    The Other RaFaél

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    Dude! Story. Of. My. LIFE.

    I gotta say, that's some damn good work, and IMHO it runs pretty smoothly. Also, I think the big hands on Knux are rather fitting, considering his...well...knuckles are —presumably— supposed to be one of the main things that stand out about his appearance; (I believe) it only makes sense for him to have to the bigger hands in order to better accentuate that very aesthetic.

    I dare say it's too bad they didn't stick with the Sonic 2 style and just tweak it so that the "vibe" is still there, while not being completely interchangeable with Sonic 2. What they would end up going with for the final has always worked for me, but when I look at what they initially had for Knuckles here, I see a bit more..."personality" (for want of a better way to put it) than what we ended up getting in the final. Just my opinion.
     
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  13. Hanging Waters

    Hanging Waters

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    Iirc, someone DID say that dropdashing into horizontal spikes at any point in the game will cause the entire thing to crash :V

    I'd like to playthrough S3 with dropdash now and see how much it changes things. It was definitely a welcome addition in the S3 Mania stages.
     
  14. iGamr

    iGamr

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    It just so happens that MainMemory whipped up a ROM hack for that about two years ago. Enjoy.
     
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  15. Endgame

    Endgame

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    Not forgetting to mention [the amazing] Sonic 3 A.I.R. - once you do enough achievements to unlock it, that is ;)

    That game had reignited my love for (and got me hooked back on) S3&K again.
     
    Last edited: Nov 29, 2019
  16. Zycor

    Zycor

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    All this talk about graphics just reminds me how Knuckles' body shifts slightly when he looks up in the final games.
     
  17. Metalwario64

    Metalwario64

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    So, while I was looking at the sprite sheets, I noticed that the animation for Sonic moving while hanging still looks like the Sonic 2 style in the final:
    [​IMG]
    His face looks just like Sonic 2, but he has the brighter highlight on his head and one shoe frame, and his hands seem a bit larger, but his shoes are longer and flatter like in 2... it's kind of a hodgepodge.

    Do these sprites exist in the prototype at all? I saw a sprite sheet that didn't seem to have them.

    Also, some corkscrew rotation sprites weren't changed:
    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Nov 30, 2019
  18. Sid Starkiller

    Sid Starkiller

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    There's no bars to grab in Flying Battery, so I was going to check with the animation viewer...but it doesn't seem to exist yet! Apparently the animation viewer was only added to debug mode in Sonic 3, and was added sometime after this build.
     
  19. Blastfrog

    Blastfrog

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    A quick look in the ROM reveals that the only new frames for Sonic up to this point are his weird cut swinging animation and the surfboard intro. I could be missing something, but the tiles appear to be in the same order as Sonic 2 and everything, even including the blank tiles for interlaced mode, and Tails tiles appear immediately afterward, so I'm inclined to think there's nothing else. The surfboard version of Sonic appears after the proto Knux frames, which are after Tails. Tails appears to have no new frames whatsoever. The final Knux sprites appear much later in the ROM.
     
  20. LukyHRE

    LukyHRE

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    You are correct, Fred talked about this in his blog. It's really useful to read its entries with this proto now around :)