Sonic Mania (Switch, PS4, Xbox One, PC)

Discussion in 'General Sonic Discussion' started by TimmiT, Jul 23, 2016.

  1. Icewarrior

    Icewarrior

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    Kharen is probably right, that's usually how some infos can leak.
    Though of course, after Stardust Speedway was shown in the last trailer:
    "OH LOOK! THERE'S STARDUST SPEEDWAY, IT MUST BE LEGIT".
     
  2. Lobotomy

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    That level list is hilarious, because it only seems to show as many original levels as have been announced to date. (With the exception of 'Galoonia'?)
     
  3. Two months in advance???
     
  4. You know, listening to the trailer, Hyper Potions' music seriously reminds me of something straight out of either Mega Man ZX game.
     
  5. synchronizer

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    Anyway, all that is left to do is wait for release. :)
     
  6. JcFerggy

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    Not really sure how to word my thoughts here, but I'm been thinking of the Classic levels, and how they remind me of Mario Kart. Both games have a collection of past levels that have been reimagined and included along side a set of newer levels. I know that the games are very different in genre so the comparison isn't exact, but most people really like the returning courses in Mario Kart, while the community reaction to Mania's Classic levels is still luke warm.

    Personally I think this is a great idea, and one I wish is kept with the Mania series going forward. I love the idea of replaying classic levels with a new coat of paint, with tweaked and reworked layouts and new or borrowed gimmicks from similarly trope'd levels.

    I know the game isn't even out yet, but imagine Mania 2 being announced with returning levels from more obscure games like Bridge Zone, Gigalopolis, Sunset Park, or Toxic Caves. This also works two ways, as the mega fans like us know the origin of these level and will be nostalgic for them, while casual fans will just see these as new levels to play.

    I don't know, I guess I'm just optimistic towards the series future. What are everyone else's opinion on the returning levels?
     
  7. Slingerland

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  8. TimmiT

    TimmiT

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    Why is someone even trying to act like this leaked from a preload of the game. Games usually can't be preloaded until like a week or a few days before launch. And that is if they can be preloaded at all.
     
  9. Icewarrior

    Icewarrior

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    IMO, the best chance to leak informations from the game is when the achievements/trophy list for the game will pop up on the internet.
    That can happen days, weeks and sometimes months before the official release.

    Sometimes helped to leak a game's very own existence.
     
  10. Beltway

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    Platforming games =/= racing games. What might make sense for one genre to constantly recycle content for its games may not make the same amount of sense for another.

    Moreover, the Mario Kart series has historically been about having old and new levels in each entry. Sonic (esp. Genesis Sonic)? Not so much; there's a reason why there has been a lot of groans over the excessive use Green Hill remakes / rehashes over the past few years (and prior to that, extensive use of Seaside Hill in spinoffs).
     
  11. Sean Evans

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    He does have a point though. The Mario Kart comparison isn't too off base when you think about it. Mario Kart remakes work so well because they pull from an already extensive and growing pool of levels. But more importantly, they're done properly. Compare how 64/SNES/Vanilla Rainbow Road looked before to how it looks now. What once was a weird sort of nonsense place for characters to race on has been fleshed out into a neon lit station up in space. That kind of stuff is why Mario Kart remakes work well, noticeable improvements and enhancements that go beyond a graphical touch-up. Meanwhile most Green Hill redos are literally just that, Green Hill. The base concept reused and touched up here and there with very little intent to flesh it out. For me at least, that's why Green Hill is getting lame, because they only ever scratch the surface of the concept and never take it further, or they always just re-use it without much thought (Windy Hill/Splash Hill). Mania (from what we can tell) actually is taking the concept a bit further. While I'd like completely original stuff, I have no problem with potential future Mania's expanding the threshold of Sonic's world, as long as it's not half assed.
     
  12. On top of each Mario Kart revisit adding and improving on the original tracks, don't forget that they also make sure to pull a variety of tracks instead of always the same one. Continuing the Green Hill comparison, you know that they'd eventually start getting complaints for resurrecting the same single track every single game.

    It would be a neat idea if every future Sonic game included a handful of secret levels that were fully re-tooled versions of previous levels, on top of the full regiment of new levels to build the base game from. As long as it was a Generations-style spread with no consecutive repeats, maybe a two-game break at the very least between revisits, it would be pretty awesome. Hell, I wouldn't even mind if they were simplified builds. Imagine levels built out of 3D chunks similarly to how the classics were built, with a different texture set to match the level being redone, and a single unique gimmick or two thrown in. They wouldn't even be having to do the whole process for each level. If each game added something like 3 to 5 newly-designed chunks per level to their collection, they'd be building up their toolset while easily throwing together a ton of content for players.
     
  13. DigitalDuck

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    I don't see why a platformer can't recycle content if a racing game can. Part of the idea of recycling in both cases is the ability to experience the levels in new ways - much of what the hacking scene is about. The main Mario series often recycles content too, to the point that New Super Mario Bros. is basically a remake of Super Mario World.

    Mario Kart has only had old levels since the third game; although obviously the first game couldn't make use of older levels, the fact is that it had to start doing so at some point.

    Looking at Sonic 3, we see a heavy reuse of elements, with Hydrocity basically being a Labyrinth remake, Flying Battery being Metropolis + Wing Fortress, what's essentially the Mystic Cave boss reused for Marble Garden, the Wing Fortress boss reused for Flying Battery, the Green Hill, Metropolis, and first Death Egg bosses reused for Sky Sanctuary, and the second Death Egg boss reused for... for Death Egg. Reuse of elements isn't new even for the Classic Sonic games.

    The reason there have been groans over the excessive Green Hill remakes is because it's always Green Hill, Green Hill, Green Hill. There would be fewer complaints if it was Star Light, Mystic Cave, Ice Cap.
     
  14. Beltway

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    I wasn't saying that Sonic wasn't allowed to do level remakes. I was pointing out the background and reception between level remakes in the Mario Kart series and the Sonic series were different. Mario Kart having tracks of remade levels in addition to original levels has been going on for so long that its now a staple of the series. (Yes, they only started appearing in the third installment --Super Circuit--, but that game was released back in...2001? It's been seventeen years, and every game since then have latched onto the idea.) The concept is ingrained to the point that it would be a surprise if Mario Kart 9 (or whatever name it would have) didn't have remade levels.

    Sonic up until recently is a bit different in that it usually had new levels, throwbacks of old levels were usually reserved for spinoffs or relatively rare. The Green Hill checkerboard and Wing Fortress clone bosses in Sky Sanctuary? Literally the only time Sonic & Knuckles did a direct throwback in that vein. GHZ in Sonic Adventure 2? Hidden behind 100% completion, in a game billed as the series' 10th anniversay game. The influx of Green Hill (lookalies) that we have gotten since 2010 is something that in the past isn't expected complained about--and while its true that part of the problem is that is how the levels are reused, the general concept of Sonic games having upfront level throwbacks is still something that's not exactly being widely accepted as the new norm. That was all my point was referring to.

    JCFerggy even admitted himself that the reception toward Mania having throwback levels in the first place is more muted in its enthusiasm compared to when Mario Kart does it. I'm just trying to explain (from how I see it) why that is.
     
  15. HEDGESMFG

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    I think the real reason the reception is so muted towards it (even though the execution itself is generally excellent), is because this may well be the ONLY genesis style new game we ever get, and each retooled level is taking the spot/resources away from a new level we could be getting instead.

    Which is why this one doing so well is extremely important. We don't just need a one off homage, we need Sega to get that this should be an ongoing series, with Mania 2 being entirely new if possible (or at least do something more interesting like retooling game gear stages for a change).

    Generations was exciting because each classic level was fully modernized, Mania is less so than that too.

    Again, I will enjoy every moment of mania just like I enjoyed something like, say Megamix. But I don't want only, for example 4 new zones, to be the last bit of genesis style Sonic I ever get from Sega. I honestly wanted at least 6 new Zones so I get a new equivalent to Sonic 1 or 3 within Mania.
     
  16. Yeah, you know how shitting on Sonic is the popular thing to do? Funny enough, just about every website I've been on has been nothing but hype for Mania. The biggest complaint that I saw from somebody was that since the game is only 108 MB, that it meant that there wouldn't be enough room for fully animated HD cutscenes in the style of the release trailer for transitions between levels.
     
  17. Lapper

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    Still love that the new trailer has more likes and less dislikes than the newest Forces trailer, even with less views.
    I don't think, though, that the overwhelming love for the Mania aesthetic and meaning will actually translate into a huge win for it. I'm sure the vast majority of people who dislike or even hate the idea of Forces will still spend their money on it... just because.

    As for cut-scenes, I'm on the fence as to whether they'll be in there. There's definitely a reason they 'teased' colour images at the end of the trailer, so I feel the animation will definitely come back somewhere in some form. My thought is that if cutscenes are included, they'll be silent (no talking at least) and very short.
     
  18. I'd put my guess on a cutscene at the start and possibly end of the game, and maybe short cutscenes inbetween zones. Then between levels S3/K style transitions, possibly between zones if they're not animated.
    That level of animation quality is slow and expensive to do properly, so I wouldn't expect an abundance of it.
    Or maybe we're off base entirely, and it's just animation for the trailer.
     
  19. Could always be vector cutscenes. Vector graphics are very cheap on space, yo. Scalable, too.

    Of course, I know I'm almost definitely wrong.
     
  20. XCubed

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    How large was the original Sonic CD? I know that it was over 40MB due to WiiWare restrictions, but I can't find the true file size (including music tracks) anywhere. Maybe I'm not looking hard enough, but I can't even find this on our own Retro page: http://info.sonicretro.org/Sonic_the_Hedgehog_CD.

    While the animates scenes are nice, I won't be butt hurt if they are non existant, or limited. I'm still suspicious of that caped Hard Boiled Heavy Scene...it's short, so maybe being scaled down and short, these are possible.