Sonic Mania (Switch, PS4, Xbox One, PC...Netflix?)

What I always loved about the Insta-Shield was that its split-second nature made it far more skill-based than most of Sonic's other moves. Without precision in both aim and timing, it's utterly worthless. It's more challenging and more rewarding to master than the spin-dash or the homing attack. But it was also totally optional, which I also thought was a plus.

The drop dash seems less like a new move and more like an expansion on an old move. Sudden speed gain? We've seen that before; this is just another form. But the Insta-Shield move that focused less on movement and more on combat, but used skillfully could make the combat more effective as a speed-gaining or speed-maintaining mechanic. I think that level of depth goes well beyond anything the drop dash can offer.

 

I don't see why the insta-shield had to be removed just to add drop-dash, since we have four face buttons to work with. What's wrong with having one button do the insta-shield and having another button do the drop-dash?

 

...Wait if you spin dash and jump afterwards the Insta-Shield basically allows you to double jump?! :v: How did I not know about that? I've known about the Insta-shield, since I abuse the shit out of the move in S3K. But I never knew it could help you reach higher places. Anyways I wouldn't mind seeing the insta-shield return, since the elemental shields are coming back in Mania.

 

I don't think he's using the insta-shield to double jump in that Ice Cap video: the higher jump is caused by the slope, and as you can see at the beginning of the video, spin dash + jump alone is enough to jump higher than the side of the ice pillars. However, by doing so, Sonic's direction isn't controllable so he merely goes up and down. By insta-shielding mid-jump, you regain control, thus being able to move left or right, but the height is reached in any case.

 

So you're justifying the insta-shield by enforcing awkward dumb restraints which go against the whole point of how that section of the level was designed to be played? Jesus Christ, dude, the insta-shield is a really useful tool in a number of places but you're just being the worst kind of salesman here.

 

@Neo
It's a nice example people can try straight from power-on. Reading things way too intensely there.

@Chaos Rush
Well I agree with others about avoiding the use of more buttons. It would just feel wrong if an entire extra button is used just to enable 1 very occasional move.

@OcelotBot
Thanks for the video links. />


I'm not too distraught about the insta's removal; it's just a little good thing I liked.

Part of why it fits Sonic so well is the way it made rolling less restricting for him only. Rolling --pretty much the signature mechanic of Sonic games-- made lighter only for the main character himself. If Tails or Knuckles spin-dashed or rolled into a huge jump, they were 100% forced to choose between discarding all their speed, or having no control over their landing. So they had much less freedom when it comes to rolling; every roll is lost flow when you're trying to get back on your feet; lost time at best, missed paths at worst. Meanwhile Sonic could flick control back on at any moment without losing any speed. Spin-dash jumping was Sonic's luxury, thanks to the insta-shield.

 

It would be really nice to have an option for Insta-shield/Drop Dash... or just have it readded and make the Drop Dash be "Down+Jump", so that they can coexist together.

Hey we have apples and bananas, so we don't need steak. =P

 

I never really saw the use of the insta-shield. It's a move that grants you a few frames of invincibility, but having a fraction of a second to use it right requires a lot of practice. Something that kind of goes against classic Sonic's easy-to-learn controls.

Plus, it's a platformer. Not a fighting game. Unless you're a speedrunner I don't get why it would be needed. Not saying that it can't be used for fun things, but still.

 

The HA in Sonic 4 was indeed all shades of s***. From its in-your-face prompting to the control itself to the deluded level design based on it. I wouldn't mind a HA in a 2D classic Sonic at all, if done right. Sonic Classic Heroes did it fine imo.

But simply not having it at all is infinitely safer. Classic Sonics don't need homing to be good, so why drag up the one move that has so much stink attached.

 

I've never played Sonic Advance 2, so I can't comment on that specifically, you may be right.

Is the drop dash going to be a Sonic exclusive, anyone know? I hope so, to add some variety to the other playable characters. Having not known about the insta-shield, I always thought Sonic was underpowered in comparison to Tails and Knuckles, since they could fly and glide :specialed:

 

I'm guessing that was a contributing factor to why the drop dash exists now. But I always saw Sonic as the most powerful character because of the control stuff written above.

It's super likely it will be Sonic-only, simply due to the input it requires.

 

Considering the way it's activated I'm pretty sure yes

 

After watching the gameplay video the green hill zone boss reminded me of the boss in sonic 1 megahack ultra edition. The drop dash repaces elemenal shields for a good reason. I also have a strange fieling this will also become a mobile game.

 

There's been no confirmation whether the Drop Dash is Sonic exclusive, but I think it will be.

If it isn't exclusive to Sonic then I think StealthTax would need to map the drop dash to a different button from the jump button for Knuckles & Tails. This is because K & T will of course automatically start gliding and flying when pressing jump twice (which is what you have to do to activate the drop dash with Sonic) so it would have to be mapped to a different button.

 

Ooooh, thank you.

 

All this is just proving to me why the insta-sheild isn't a great move in the first place - it only works effectively in very specific areas and at a high level of play. Most players won't get much use out if it. The drop dash looks like it's going to be more versatile and useful to everyone.

 

On the homing attack, I think it's totally unnecessary in 2D Sonic games. I didn't mind the one in Sonic Advance 2, but it wasn't really needed or overpowered. The homing attack in Sonic 4 and Generations was awful though imo.

 

I'd argue that it is all the more reason to keep the Insta-shield, Mastering platformers has always been part of the parcel for me and using hard to time moves or even using the Insta-shield as a set up to get extra hits on a boss is satisfying.

It isn't necessary in casual play and I understand why most people just skim over the Insta as a silly move that doesn't do much, but someone who has played the game all their life uses it well and both play styles vary an awful lot because of it.

It's like a frame perfect breaker move in a fighter or an unbreakable combo, totally useless to a novice but extremely viable to someone who has mastered the technique through practice.

 

This. In fact, I didn't even know Sonic Advance 2 had a homing attack at all until after I beat the game.