I think the analyzation of FBZ gimmicks is an interesting one, since it does point out how a lot of FBZs gimmicks are counter-intuitive to speed. I think as a kid, the sections that -were-fast and the music was enough to keep me enjoying the zones, but thinking back, those corkscrew elevators were probably right up there with Spring Yards blocks in terms of annoyance. I do live the propeller gimmick and chain ball gimmicks in FBZ, which funny enough were part of it's faster areas. It's also worthy of note that Hydrocity Act 2 is very linear as well, but Hydrocity has less clunky platforming sections (there is the moving blocks and rotating pillars but they feel more spacious than FBZ2s corkscrew elevator things, that's for sure). Overall, it's a much funner high speed level IMO. howeveriwantlaunchbasetobethesonic3repressentative :v:
I disagree with the corkscrew elevators being like the SYZ blocks. The elevators last a couple of seconds at most and once you know the level you can be charging a spindash to come out of them at full speed. In SYZ, it's a few seconds between blocks, and you often have to climb three or four of them; not only that, but they punish your impatience with instant death, and you come out of them slower than you went in.
Yeah, seconded with the corkscrew elevators. It's been ages since I've actually fired up S&K (having mostly played Sonic 2 or Sonic 3 alone these days, haha), so I did that just now and didn't really think anything of them. They move at a fair clip and my first thought was to just charge a spindash while on them. There are like two bits that were kind of dumb, like the corkscrew mesh onto moving platform over nothing (which is a bit obnoxious -- didn't kill me this time, at least) and then the "wait for the ship to bomb a hole in itself" part. Otherwise, it was a pretty fun, smooth stage.
Sandopolis Act 2 is amazing! It was genuinely terrifying when I was a kid, and any Sonic game that can pull that off without being cheesy / haunted house BOO! style shit has to be applauded. The music has genuine menace. That and Lava Reef 2 fire / boss section are probably the only parts in the game where I actually feel a genuine threat.
I don't dislike any Sonic & Knuckles stages, nor do I dislike any Sonic 1 or CD stage. I really dislike Casino Night Zone in Sonic 2, and Marble Garden, Carnival Night, and Launch Base Zones in Sonic 3. Flying Battery Zone isn't my favorite in Sonic & Knuckles, but it's definitely near the top. Lava Reef Zone is probably my favorite stage in Sonic & Knuckles overall. My favorite Sonic stage in any game is definitely Stardust Speedway. It's the best level in the entire series, especially when you fully use Time Travel. Enormous and extremely enjoyable level. Best music and boss, too.
Well, I can safely say then that we have very different Classic Sonic tastes, as I can't really think of any Sonic 2 or 3 level that I really dislike (Sky Chase as it's an autoscroller but still), but oh boy are there levels from 1, CD, and Knuckles that I don't like (Marble, Wacky Workbench, Tidal Tempest, Labyrinth, and idk something about Knuckles is just off to me, can't quite put my finger on it though. I think I just prefer the aesthetics and soundtrack of 3). I'm interested to see what they'll do with a CD level in this game, as CD's levels don't quite fit in with the main Classic series' level design. It's very unforgiving with lots of roadblocks. I like Stardust Speedway, but Quartz Quadrant is beautiful with fantastic music, I'd love to see it expanded upon as it was an incredibly short level... but then again a lot of CD's levels are incredibly short.
Labyrinth Zone is probably my favorite level in Sonic 1. Starlight Zone my second. Scrap Brain Zone my third. Collision Chaos Zone is probably my second favorite in Sonic CD. There is this in CCZ where you bounce from moving bumpers in the air, and I love the feeling of control. Wacky Workbench Zone is similarly rewarding. I like the concept, too - it's an inverted Zone. The lowest route in the level is the hardest, fastest route, and the top of the level is the default, "you fucked up" route. The bottom of WWZ, just above the bouncing floor, is full of super tight platforming. Ever done a run of WWZ where you never touch the floor outside of the couple of required times? It's intense.
I have to admit, for whatever late-game zones they pick whether they be original or classics, I hope they don't pull a Generations route of sort of shoehorning somewhere non-fitting into a difficult finale. Planet Wisp as a mix of Scrap Brain and Death Egg Zone for attempts at difficulty never did quite feel right.
I've never understood why people don't like Marble Zone. It's easily my favorite zone from Sonic 1. The amount of hidden areas make the level really interesting to play. There is that lava ride that you have to just sit and wait for, but it's not a dealbreaker for me. Aside from that I'm the same way. I'm not crazy about most of Sonic 1 or CD, although they have their moments. I'm not a fan of Sandopolis Zone, but other than that all of 2 and 3K I really enjoy.
What hidden areas? Each act has one hidden room with a 1-up monitor, but aside from that you'll find everything unless you're trying to Go Fast. Aside from Act 3's first underground bit and secret shortcut, the whole zone is ENTIRELY linear. Marble and Labyrinth are the antithesis of good Sonic level design. On Sandopolis: Am I the only one who enjoys Act 2 more than Act 1? I like the atmosphere, the lighting gimmick and the ghosts in Act 2, whereas Act 1 feels like an endless trek through repetitive, unchanging scenery. On Flying Battery: Can we all just take a second to appreciate how amazing the new outdoor background looks from the Mania reveal? It's one of the best things we've seen so far in my opinion. U WOT M8
In regards to Sonic 2, I think Casino Night has a really good chance. I would really love to see Mystic Cave but I would be a bit bummed out if there is no Casino stage in Mania honestly. Especially if the music copyright actually is an issue and so they decide not to go with Carnival Night. There are loads of levels in Sonic 3 which would be good picks, such as Hydrocity, Carnival Night and Ice Cap. But if we take the levels which presumably have no music problems, we are left with Angel Island, Hydrocity and Marble Garden. I think Hydrocity has the best chance of those three and I really hope it isn't Marble Garden :p This is assuming there even is a massive legal problem with the music though.
I'm anticipating a Labyrinth Zone revamp with elements from Hydrocity, which will make it actually play like a Sonic level. Heck, Hydrocity was a Labyrinth revamp itself, so better use the original as a base. =P EDIT: Also, it would make sense if the Sonic 3 level was IceCap, so that Sonic can snowboard on the door he breaks open as originally intended. :D
I think Carnival Night is just too much level for them to redo. It's not just massive, it's also pretty cramped in terms of map space. They'd have a hard time adding to act 1 imo. Hydrocity meanwhile has plenty of open space for its interior, and plenty of base room to grow outwards.
Really? After Generations 3DS and Casino Street in Sonic 4? I would be amazed if they risked it, a lot of fans would be pissed. But... but... why would you want Hydrocity with shit music when you could have Hydrocity with great music? I don't understand. Are we under the impression that all the remixed zones will re-use their original layouts? I really hope not, I was assuming that only Green Hill was going to do that, being the "most tame" remaster after all.
Yes and the Flying battery zone trailer confirmed that. The are 'remixing' the zones, not reimagining them. Of course we'll see new gimmicks and additions from other zones appearing on extra sections, but that's about it.
I don't think Casino Night is all that likely, at least not as the sole representation of S2 if we're only getting one stage from the game. It was in Generations already, for one. Plus Studiopolis is a bouncy stage with a bingo gimmick, and Mirage Saloon even has the pinball areas going on. It would be a bit of overkill. I guess that probably rules out Collision Chaos too - Mirage Saloon has both the pinball areas and the glass bumpers. I'd be really surprised if they specifically prioritised popularity and iconic status over variety this time around. But yeah, Mystic Cave would be so awesome. It's still a pretty unique stage to this day, and there's so much that could be explored with the theme.
Agreed that similar tropes will not be reused within the same game (such as Studiopolis/Casino Night, etc). This should be common sense. However, I've yet to hear anyone mention how color palette may influence Zone selection, I don't think too many zones of a similar color palette will be selected, so those of you theorizing on zone selection may want to consider this. For example, Studiopolis is heavy on purple, as is Flying Battery, but so is Ice Cap, Scrap Brain (final), Oil Ocean, Launch Base, Mystic Cave, Hydrocity (Act 2), etc. On a personal note, I would LOVE to see Oil Ocean, which could logically transition to Launch Base. Sonic 4 may have totally fucked that up though... Never been a fan of Mystic Cave myself, but if it could be improved why not. Concerning Flying Battery, I seem to be suffering from cognitive dissonance, because I've always felt a little underwhelmed by it, but then always really enjoy playing it. I think it's the aesthetic of the level I find underwhelming, but the music, flow and concepts are wonderful. To those who dislike the FB music, come on... would Lady Gaga rip off a sub-par song? :specialed:
All the trailer confirmed was that the first ten seconds of Act 1 were the same, and that a few sections of the layout were going to be clearly taken from the original levels. Of the five gameplay clips in the trailer, only the first and fourth were recognisable from the original Flying Battery. For all we know 90% of the level could feel like completely uncharted territory. Studiopolis uses a lot of blue, yellow and purple. Flying Battery uses mostly yellow, blue, grey and purple. Green Hill is mostly blue, green and yellow/brown. Mirage Saloon is mainly yellow and maroon with a blue sky. You could say that blue is over-represented already, but I don't think that's how it works. With how vastly different each zone looks regardless of dominant colour, and how many nuanced colour options they have, I think there would have to be a really excessive amount of one colour for it to stand out. The blue Studiopolis roads are completely different to the Green Hill waterfalls. The metallic Flying Battery surfaces don't remind me at all of the Mirage Saloon sand. Hydrocity's purple would feel completely different to the purple in Studiopolis. IceCap and Mystic Cave are not zones I would typically associate with "purple", either (ice blue and green/black respectively). I don't think diversity of colour is anywhere near as important as diversity of zone 'themes'.
