Sonic Generations Hacking (and More!)

Discussion in 'Engineering & Reverse Engineering' started by Andrew75, Jun 23, 2011.

  1. S0LV0

    S0LV0

    Sonic Generations Helpdesk Tech Member
    586
    0
    0
    Spagonia
    Abusing SMPS
    I'm not attacking the guy personally, because I'm well aware that would cross a line. I'm judging the quality of his mod by what I experienced personally. Trust me, I thought better of it before I actually bothered to give it a try. I don't find it to be any more playable than the original game, and that's my opinion; you're welcome to feel differently.

    When the first thing a mod does is ask me to overwrite content in my Sound folder and add extra files to both it and the movie folder before I can even get it working, it's really not a good sign.
     
  2. Ell678

    Ell678

    Am I Annoying You? Member
    2,365
    15
    18
    Barrow, England
    Sonic Incursion
    Apart from some graphical issues, and the rather stupid idea of putting springs and switches within boxes, it doesn't seem that bad to me. The hub worlds are far too big though - they shouldn't be full fledged stages.
     
  3. Twilightzoney

    Twilightzoney

    Tech Member
    353
    0
    16
    Elgin, IL And Hampshire
    Unleashed and Generations Stuff and Custom Works
    Gotta remember Generations isn't like Unleashed with making doors and things unlock by killing enemies. I think the boxes thing is fine, my gripe is his GIA how it looks more then anything. I'm more upset with the appearance of it ex Normals, UV Mapping, GIA, Smooth Groups.

    Either way it is pretty cool that the guy is putting forth the work to do this. I think its pretty neat that he can get them playable to some extent.
     
  4. S0LV0

    S0LV0

    Sonic Generations Helpdesk Tech Member
    586
    0
    0
    Spagonia
    Abusing SMPS
    I won't deny that a lot of his work for this mod is impressive on a technical level, but that's about where it ends for me.
     
  5. JojHeywood

    JojHeywood

    Arbitrary. Member
    Isn't the engine (Generations) and the levels themselves responsible for everything /but/ the technical side? Sounds like your gripe is with Sega, rather than brianu.
     
  6. S0LV0

    S0LV0

    Sonic Generations Helpdesk Tech Member
    586
    0
    0
    Spagonia
    Abusing SMPS
    Um, no. He's clearly put a lot of work into various workarounds for mechanics to resemble 06's original content, and has done a notable job for the most part. Granted, I only really find it impressive on a visual level, but I have to give credit where it's due.
     
  7. synchronizer

    synchronizer

    Member
    1,921
    1
    18
    He hasn't implemented GIA.

    My question is: how much of the mod did he make himself. His credits list is very long.
     
  8. TimmiT

    TimmiT

    ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ Member
    Not like it matters, brianuuu isn't exactly known for taking criticism well.
     
  9. Paraxade

    Paraxade

    Member
    186
    0
    0
    Is this the "complain about brianuuu" thread now?
     
  10. TimmiT

    TimmiT

    ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ Member
    Yes. I expect the mods to change the thread title any minute now.
     
  11. Aerosol

    Aerosol

    FML and FU2 Moderator
    10,514
    45
    28
    Not where I want to be.
    Sonic (?): Coming summer of 2055...?
    I sure hope not, cause I'd kind of like it to stop. I watched that Flame Core video thinking "this is really not that bad; it's actually pretty cool" the entire time. Just cause he bans people for giving him any sort of criticism doesn't mean shitting all over his work elsewhere is ok.
     
  12. Paraxade

    Paraxade

    Member
    186
    0
    0
    Yeah, this basically. I get if you're not a fan of his work, but coming here to complain about it is mean-spirited and not really a productive or useful conversation IMO. I like this thread when it's about cool new mods people have made or a new tool/tool update or a breakthrough on a format being cracked or something like that. If it was just "look at this guy's mod it's so horrible" all the time I'd probably stop reading.
     
  13. S0LV0

    S0LV0

    Sonic Generations Helpdesk Tech Member
    586
    0
    0
    Spagonia
    Abusing SMPS
    Eh, fair enough. I'd keep this kind of criticism on his actual videos, but he blocked my account a long time ago. It's just hard not to be infuriated when not only does this kind of thing seem to garner nothing but praise, but he refuses to accept just about any kind of negative feedback.
     
  14. Felik

    Felik

    Member
    1,705
    0
    16
    From the looks of it this mod is not halfbad. If I wasn't too lazy I'd give it a try.
     
  15. Overlord

    Overlord

    ...did we just switch realities? Moderator
    17,584
    69
    28
    Berkshire, England
    Learning Cymraeg
    I personally fail to see the point of reimplementing a terrible game's broken physics in a title that plays much better, but if he wants to do it, the more power to him. Doesn't mean anyone has to play it.


    (and yes, try to keep things somewhat civil, please)
     
  16. I think he did say that when the full mod is done, the physics of 2006 will be optional anyway. From what I've actually seen so far, it doesn't seem that bad, story of Sonic 2006 and some quirks aside.

    Anybody notice how he got the door to stay closed in the Flame Core video until Sonic killed enemies? I was under the impression that sort of thing couldn't be done in Generations, or at least hadn't been done yet.
     
  17. S0LV0

    S0LV0

    Sonic Generations Helpdesk Tech Member
    586
    0
    0
    Spagonia
    Abusing SMPS
    As far as I know, you can only attach a trigger like that to a single enemy at most. I wouldn't be surprised if the "you have to kill multiple enemies thing" is a bluff, but I can't know for sure.
     
  18. Paraxade

    Paraxade

    Member
    186
    0
    0
    It can't. He likely faked it by putting EventCollisions over the enemies you have to kill. Sorta nice way to get a similar effect, although I imagine it might be error-prone since it's not actually tied to the enemy dying (door opens anyway if you touch the enemy without killing it, or you might end up killing the enemy without touching the trigger).

    I'm still considering doing my own set of 06 ports akin to what I did for Wave Ocean earlier this year, adapting the stages to fit the normal Generations gameplay mechanics. Have some preliminary work done on a few stages (mostly Tropical Jungle, a little Aquatic Base) but not really enough to show off. That's the sort of style I'd rather play these stages in Generations with, personally. Obviously with brianuuu's popularity there's a lot of people who'd rather see something more faithful to the original game though. So hey, if I do end up doing this then we get both and everyone's happy. Seems like a win-win.
     
  19. My general opinion on this is that there's criticism, and then there's constructive criticism.

    Nobody's trying to tell anyone they aren't entitled to their opinion. Briannu is probably tired of being put down; I can kinda understand his attitude to banning, but I think that's pretty overkill. That said, negative begets negative. It just takes one person to let go of their pride and turn that around by apologizing.

    I think my issue with how he's being criticised is that is unspecific for the most part, and therefore unhelpful. Saying "It's bad" or "it's JUST like the original, good job, 0/10" is far less beneficial to a creator than what, say, Parax just did, by analysing his approach to a workaround for door triggers and pointing out, without malice, that there are potential issues to doing it that way. From there it's either a case of saying "eh, it'll do" or "I'm sure there's a better way, let's think about what that is."

    I like his energy, I like his enthusiasm, I like his overall vision.

    I just think it's very difficult to nail the vision you've got in a way that works. For example, I recall that whole highway run mission that introduces the game. There are obvious errors in how it's presented, with the punishment of looping all the way around again. It seems he's trying to mix gameplay with interactive cinematic sequences of sorts; that's his overall goal with the port. In some places I can see that working given the right approach and changes, but in others it might be worth scrapping or changing altogether.

    It's maybe worth looking at the tone you use when criticising someone's work. Especially over text on te Internet. It can easily be taken to be even more insulting than you intended it, and as a result the original points you were making can be masked by bad-vibes. (Recent events with how I responded to this type of thing is a pretty good example of escalation.)

    Whether he's a nice person or not doesn't really matter; the point in my eyes is to deliver a great product for the end-users. The project is pretty popular amongst fans and I can see why, even if it's incredibly rough around the edges and in need of quality assurance. He's done a huge amount of work, and he's very consistent and regular with updates. If he was part of a team, I figure he could work well if he was able to let any pride he may have go.

    It sucks that he's banned some of you previously, but please don't take that as a reason to be angry or malicious against him, and let it spill out here. I just recieved about 20 email notifications, and was like "Uh-oh...what happened now?"

    It sucks that that was my reaction and not "Oh sweet, what's been released or shown off?!"

    Whatever happens with this project, I think it's good to use objectively as an example of how to do things; what works, what doesn't, but more importantly: why.
     
  20. Precisely.