Discussion in 'General Sonic Discussion' started by Blue Blood, Jul 23, 2016.
Part of the ruins/man-made aesthetic, makes sense to me.
I'm gonna be a bit more cynical and say it looks like a less interesting, more automated Casino Night with a ruins aesthetic, with said aesthetic not contributing to the level design in any interesting way. Same issue as the sand in Green Hill, where you'd think some Sandopolis elements would've come into play. It looks pretty, sure, but that's where the impressive qualities end.
Also yeesh, that camera does not need to zoom in that much, and that close to Sonic no less. Zoom out a bit, this isn't a Game Gear title.
Classic Sonic gameplay still looks to be as forgettable as it was in Generations, but the aesthetics look interesting.
I loove the music of this new stage!! I cannot wait to hear the modern version. I also enjoy the trope idea. Keyword idea.
Everything else is an absolute joke after seeing and playing Sonic Mania. This has to be the end of classic Sonic in 3D titles. The level design is an embarrassment.
I think the problem is Sonic should be around that size on-screen, but he's scaled absolutely tiny in comparison to the objects/environment - this bothered me in Generations, too, as well as with modern Sonic in 2D segments of all games since Unleashed (though at least there there was more reason to zoom out a little more due to the high speeds you'd reach when using the boost mechanic). Compare Sonic's size in relation to loops/ramps/rings here with his size in, say, Mania or the Mega Drive games and you'll see what I mean.
In Forces, it looks like they've tried to fix Sonic appearing so small by just zooming in so he's larger on-screen, but this has just caused more issues as since he's still scaled small in relation to the environments you can't see much of the level surrounding you. Really what they need to do to fix the issue is zoom the camera back out but scale Sonic up so he's around the same size when curled up as the tubes he rolls through in some parts of the stage.
Hey there's some of that Colors esq trope mixing I like to see. Good, now do more of this and less of, well, Green Hill + Sand or City + death (granted aesthetically the city looks fine to me).
As far as the design of the level, not bad. Not great, but not bad. I'd prefer this be the minimum when it comes to level design but if this is maybe level 3 for Classic Sonic at least they seem to become progressively more complex. Not very complex, but more so than Green Sand Hill. I will give them credit where credit's due though, at least Sonic seems to gain speed rolling down hill and the bumpers actually appear to work in this game. This is actually an improvement on Generations, which had classic style bumpers in one challenge act in Crisis City and they did fuck all (go to 3:40 in the video below to see what I mean). I think flippers existed in some levels but they were also a tad wonky.
By the way, I still don't see how Classic and Modern team up in this game plot wise at all. You seem to have Sonic and the Avatar teaming up with Knuckles and co doing their own thing fighting Infinite, and then you have Classic Sonic and Tails doing... something? Fighting Eggman? I don't know what they're doing yet.
From what I see so far, the forest background is nothing more than a mask to hide the fact it's Casino Night for the dozenth time. Seriously, nothing I see there is new, it's all things Casino levels in the series have done to death.
The level design IS better though. And the music is pretty okay.
I wish they'd stop using the very limited Sonic 1 drum set to make it sound like a classic track.
The stage honestly just looks bad to me. Not really talking level design wise (though it's not exactly interesting compared to Mania's or even Generations' level design), just visually it looks incredibly bland despite having a pretty interesting theme. Feels like they made a generic forest environment and then slapped on Casino Night assets from Generations on there. Which could look interesting if the lighting was better than it is.
Also, this stuck out to me:
Music is good though.
Yeah the actual trope idea itself is a good idea, it's just not utilized at all. Nothing cool like Bamboo Tree Slots, Monkey Roulette with like, grub balls or something. Like, where's the imagination in this, at all? The background looks more interesting than the level!
This game looks like it's on a massive budget. I think the level design looks better than what we've seen so far, but that's not saying much. Compare this to Studiopolis 2, yeeeeah. The main problem is it looks so uninspired, you can tell the developers are bored out of their minds.
This sounds harsh, but I think it's time SEGA just dropped Sonic Team. They clearly have no idea how to make a good game. Or more reasonably, make them work on something else. Maybe they'd make something good if they could work on a new project.
And I'll actually give another compliment. There were like, 2 times in the IGN video where I was almost certain Sonic was going to fall into a bottomless pit and was shocked to see actual paths and level down there. Granted it's sad that I've defaulted to expected death at this point but I enjoy being proven wrong in this case.
All the parts are from Casino Night Zone except for the Spring Yard floating spike-balls and the single Chemical Plant tube.
They couldn't have had *one* new thing? Even Sonic 4 had the cool card stuff.
I don't know about you guys but the levels look like ugly textures and models with pretty shaders applied on. That's why the Switch version looks like crap.
Yup. Isn't that what they've been up to for a while now?
Mania coming out first is NOT doing this game any favors, especially when Mania consists of a chunk of reused gimmicks to begin with. Comparing Sonic Team's idea of classic to the Mania Team's idea of classic is night and day. Really doesn't look like classic's physics are at all improved either, still looks like they're trying to fit classic gameplay into an engine not initially made for it... Which they are. Still, the level design looks to at least be built around said physics, and I can't ENTIRELY say I'll miss the Genesis pinball attempt with all of those bumpers. But still, looking at Classic go off a ramp just gives that few frames of studder that makes it obvious it is scripted like before. Damn shame.
EDIT: nice auto-correct there Retro, but I wasn't using P I N B A L L P H Y S I C S the way you thought I was. Still, I kek'd.
Really don't like how they handled the whole Casino in a forest trope mashup. I like some of the buildings but I don't feel the chemistry.
So are the only obstacles in this stage are the 2 spike balls in the beginning and that 1 not-egg pawn enemy? Where's the challenge? Classic Sonic casually just ran through a bland stage with free rings everywhere.
I agree, there's nothing new here to change things up.
EDIT: I also like how it's convenient that we always see the non-destroyed half of the Moon. lol
This looks fucking horrendous for all of the reasons stated above. I don't understand how anyone but a paid shill can be attracted to this, it's mind-blowingly bad. Classic Sonic Momentum is worse than ever (Validate that shit at 0:25 where he lands and keeps going, I dare you), boost pads and automation are all over the place on the main path, the secondary paths offer nothing interesting, there are apparently no enemies to overcome, everything shown is cookie cutter garbage, not a single original thought went in to this level. And that music? It's Sonic 4 style garbage.
Sonic Team needs to be fired, all of them.
Maybe I'm just spoiled by Sonic Mania, but the level design looks bad. Huge reliance on boost pads and way over automated. I don't dislike boost pads, but they look like a crux to keep Sonic moving because of the lackluster physics...which somehow look worse than the physics in Sonic Generations. I also find the aesthetics dull and clumsily put together. I'm not buying Sonic Forces because of Denuvo so this reveal doesn't affect whether or not I'm buying the game, but it's disappointing nonetheless. I could see myself purchasing it at some point if they remove that horrible DRM though. Really soured by SEGA's decision to put this DRM into their new games. I didn't put anywhere near as much time into Sonic Mania as I expected all thanks to Denuvo. I'm practically tempted to figure out a way to play Mania without the DRM just so I can play my legally purchased game without this laptop wanting to fry itself to death. Fuck Denuvo.
I was thinking the same. You've got that interesting looking backdrop that is more inviting than the level itself... why not utilize it in some way, have one of the bumpers fling you into a 2D plane in the background, with all those funky buildings. At least that would make it feel more involved.
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