Sonic Forces Thread

Discussion in 'General Sonic Discussion' started by Blue Blood, Jul 23, 2016.

  1. MegaDash

    MegaDash

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    Well, I walked into that one. :v:

    If it's not another Sonic, it'd probably be more interesting. For some reason I'm picturing a green character like Carol Tea. Maybe the new character could be a girl.
     
  2. JaredAFX

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    I know I'm just kinda throwing my little bucket of water into the Pacific Ocean here (how's that for an analogy :v:) but I agree with the statement that there is no official Sonic "timeline;" it's easier just to piece it all in chronological order in your head. Does Sonic 4 take place immediately after Sonic 3? Probably not. Considering it's the Modern design and the targeting reticle is visible on the Homing Attack, it makes sense that it fits chronologically after Unleashed. Now that I think about it, I like thinking that Adventure's Dreamcast models are a nice way to transition from the Classic designs to Modern. Since 06 never happened in the context of the game it makes sense that Rush and Rivals are still canon because they show the origin stories of Blaze and Silver. I don't know, it just all makes sense to me. I will forever be salty that they retconned the moon as just "facing the other way," but considering this is the same extended universe that reverses aging when you go to a planet where "time" passes by more slowly, I suppose I can let the moon slide.

    This new character news is definitely a little disconcerting to me, too. I hope it's just Adventure Sonic or Boom Sonic, but even still, if they're not careful, having three very different playstyles is going to be what kills this game. It's what makes Adventure 1 and 2 chores to get through and probably where all the (ridiculously little) development time of 06 went to. I just hope they're being smart with this one.
     
  3. MegaDash

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    Honestly it'd be weird if their third character turned out to be Dreamcast Sonic. His play style would just be Modern Sonic with better turning and no boost, like a transitional fossil. He'd still have the homing attack and the spindash. The only thing that would really distinguish him are his levels, which wouldn't be without their high-speed segments.

    Maybe we're looking at this all wrong. Maybe the third Sonic is from the canceled SatAM game:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pnsn0_w6K9Q
     
  4. Okamikurainya

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    Didn't Eggman fix the moon in Sonic X to show how swell of a guy he was? :v:

    Actually.... Going by this logic, Sonic Mania could be a prequel to Sonic 2017. :ssh:
     
  5. DigitalDuck

    DigitalDuck

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    More split up than Classic and Modern in Generations? More split up than Sonic, Tails, and Knuckles in Sonic Adventure 2? Hey, it fits the anniversary theme!

    Bear in mind they've brought back Classic Sonic and potentially have a separate set of games in the Classic style, and that there's a significant crowd calling for an Adventure 3, I think 2017 might be the last time SEGA try to appeal to all of the fanbase at once. I think they'll define three Sonics, have them go their separate ways, and then cycle between making Classic games, Adventure games, and Modern games. They can then brand these as three different sub-series, and focus their marketing more effectively.

    The fact that they're three different gameplay styles essentially means that they have three different (albeit overlapping) fanbases, and therefore they need to develop for and market to each fanbase separately. If it's not "Adventure Sonic", it'll be a character meant as a stand-in for Adventure Sonic (perhaps changed because of how similar it would look to either Classic or Modern). But that's unlikely, because everyone wants 'their' franchise to be Sonic, which is why we have Classic Sonic and not Mighty the Armadillo. If Classic Sonic fans got Mighty Mania instead, otherwise identical in every respect, would it have the same reaction? I get the feeling a lot of people would feel like they'd been fobbed off. Multiple Sonics are there to pacify the fanbase, acknowledge that it's been split, and... maybe for once actually do something about it.
     
  6. Stimil Rc.

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    If we get a third Sonic, I really hope it's Lost World Sonic. I still say that, when done right, Lost World 3DS felt like the near perfect hybrid of the Classic and Modern styles and I'd love to see it given another chance and be improved upon.

    I would hate for it to be Dreamcast era Sonic. Say what you will about the modern style, but it's built off of the foundation of Dreamcast era Sonic and we've had plenty of Adventure style Sonic games before Unleashed. I'd rather they attempt to emulate the Adventure style play by just including more 3D platforming sections or disabling the boost in certain sections/extra acts, possibly even reintroducing certain aspects like the Spin Dash or balance on rails.
     
  7. Jimmy Hedgehog

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    They wouldn't put two identically designed Sonics in though, at least Adventure Sonic has a few differences to Classic and Modern, Lost World Sonic flat out is Modern Sonic.
     
  8. ICEknight

    ICEknight

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    Fixed. :v:
     
  9. TheKazeblade

    TheKazeblade

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    I'm not convinced it will be a third playstyle. The term used is "component," which, acknowledging the fact that English is not Iizuka's first language, nonetheless denotes to me just that: a component of the gameplay, not a self-contained style in and of itself. I would be more inclined to believe that it might be more of a Super Paper Mario situation where you'll be able to flip between Classic and Modern on the fly; Sonic Team dipped their toe in that pool during the Time Eater boss battle, but seeing how that fight was complete trash, I can see it being a mechanic they might want to try again and get right.

    People are flipping their lids right now, and that could have been completely avoided if Sonic Team had executed the trailer reveal competently. That wording sounds harsh, but really, the way the teaser was built up compared to what was revealed was so disproportionate, there was no other way it was going to be recieved. Nonetheless, the comments about the "component" and a new character are being way overblown. Colors, Generations and Lost World all introduced new characters. With the exception of Wisps, you can hardly say the character additions informed the gameplay of their respective titles in a major way. They were always going to operate the way they did, as the characters were just there as framing devices.
     
  10. Blue Blood

    Blue Blood

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    Agreed with this. A new component sounds like a new mechanic or feature that's be common to both playstyles. Like say, the Wisps in Colours or the co-op in S4E2. Fundatmentally is the same style of gameplay as the games preceeding it, but with a new addition to keep it fresh. I'm certainly not reading it like a new type of gameplay ala Lost World. And it's definitely not going to be some lame move like Boom Sonic or Adventure Sonic (who's just low-poly Modern Sonic anyway). I'm sure it's a twist or addition to the existing formula.

    But I disagree with this. I still think the reveal trailer was totally fine and can't get my head around people thinking otherwise. It was the last bit of news of the night, where the focus was squarely on Mania. Mania is also being released in about half a year, unlike 2017 which is still a whole year away from today. The trailer was a teaser just to set the mood and to make us ask questions. We know the game exists and on the most superficial level we know what to expect. But with it still so far away and another game coming first, that's all we need for now. All of the build up was really for Mania. The 2017 teaser was an awesome bonus for something that we don't really need news about just yet.
     
  11. DigitalDuck

    DigitalDuck

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    And I disagree with this. Adventure Sonic's gameplay centres around the spindash and homing attack, whereas Modern Sonic (or at least Unleashed Sonic) centres more around boosting and walljumping. Adventure Sonic is typically seen with much shorter spines, taller shoes, and a shit-ton of upgrades attached to him.

    He's different gameplay-wise, and there's plenty of potential to make him look different enough visually too (much like they did with Classic Sonic).
     
  12. iGamr

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    I feel like a few too many people have a hard time understanding that some of us were specifically anticipating information on the next 3D Sonic game. Mania's great, it looks amazing and it's fantastic that it gets to exist, but its mere presence doesn't make anybody wrong for still wanting to see SOMETHING to confirm that Project 2017 is worth looking forward to, and it frustrates me when I see people give the impression that it's somehow ungrateful not to just shut up and only care about Mania.

    If anything, Mania only serves to make Project 2017 look worse by rendering one of the ONLY reveals (Classic Sonic) seemingly redundant.
     
  13. TheKazeblade

    TheKazeblade

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    If you look at it in the context of the media itself, yeah, I would agree. But I'm looking at what it's resulting in amongst the fanbase. Everyone is now jumping at shadows because whatever the trailer was communicating was unclear. It showed enough that we know Sonic Team is doing something different, but it didn't show enough to indicate how that difference will apply to the game itself. So now, every little tidbit of news ERODES confidence rather than inspire it; you need not go further than this thread to prove that.

    From a marketing sense, if a piece of marketing causes more confusion and fear than anticipation for your product, it has failed in its purpose. Because unfortunately in advertising, the resulting mindset of the audience means more than the marketing piece itself. And because they did not factor in Sonic's rocky history with change, and the fan's well-documented fear of not knowing if the next game will be good or not, there is no other way to categorize the reveal as anything other than a straight-up failure.
     
  14. Tichmall

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    J.League PK Party, a "penalty kick" minigame.
    Or Scourge. Technically, that would make a "third" sonic as well. :v:
    But no, no... don't let Sega use Archie Sonic characters in the games, that would be terrible.
     
  15. Blue Blood

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    Gameplay wise, definitely. I'll always prefer the unrefined and buggy gameplay from SA1 to 06 than I will the more competently made gameplay we've seen since Unleashed. If they sort out the kinks and use SA1 as a template for Sonic's gameplay (forgetting the other gameplay styles), then they'll be on to a real winner. But the design it just Modern Sonic. The same thing, drawn slightly differently and rendered differently. The changes have been a series of small refinements over time, as opposed to an actual redesign ala Classic/Modern/Boom.

    Nope, I get that. But the next big 3D Sonic game is so far away. Summer 2016 is too early to reveal something that's not due until Christmas 2017. If the game was being released sooner, then sure. But because we know that it's THAT far away and have something else to tide us over, it's perfectly fine. I'm certainly not telling you that Project 2017 is worth your time or that you're being ungrateful for not being too interested in Mania. It's been a long wait since Lost World (and RoL) so it's natural that people are going to be getting antsy. Personally, I think that SEGA made the right decision by choosing to give us the briefest glimpse of 2017. We just need to wait for now.

    Most people outside the fanbase saw that trailer and reacted to it one way or another. They then turned their focus back to Mania, the game in the spotlight. The masses aren't going wild over a lack of news. It's just the more dedicated fanbase. Everyone else (i.e. most people) happily and wait and see what comes in the future.
     
  16. JaredAFX

    JaredAFX

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    Did he? I was only able to get through that one episode before giving up on the third season (or middle of the second season or whatever it is. The Metarex arc). The only Sonic X episodes that I can bare to watch are the first two because I used to watch them all the time on the GBA Video cart and that baseball one because of how ridiculous it is.
     
  17. TheKazeblade

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    Fans are the only people talking about it at all at this point. Which means it neither sold the hardcore fans on the game, nor did it have any staying power for anyone else. Because as I recall, the response from most people outside of the fanbase responded more or less like "That live stream was awful, Mania looks promising, and we're getting another modern Sonic game trying to be edgy."
    Mania is getting talked about because of the demos and gameplay that has been shown. Project 2017 got completely dismissed, and in IGN's case, got overshadowed by the fact the trailer used a placeholder NX logo.

    TL;DR, I don't see many people happily waiting. They're either fans who are nervously trepidatious, or everyone else who dismissed it out the gate and forgot it was a thing. So yeah, I still hold that the marketing approach is a failure.

    If you're able to find any positive coverage of Project 2017 that wasn't dismissive or making fun of it being edgy, feel free to send it my way. But the vibe I get at this point is that people are on the fence at best, or ignoring it completely. Which a better approach in their message Sonic Team could have avoided.
     
  18. MegaDash

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    I think the point is the vocal minority doesn't represent the silent majority, which is what any company would aim for. Take the lack of info this early on as being reflected by the lack of conversation on the topic. There's simply nothing much to talk about other than it appears to be Generations 2, despite Iizuka claiming otherwise.
     
  19. Blue Blood

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    By "happily wait and see", I basically meant "they're relatively indifferent and not kicking up a fuss because there's little to go on and plenty of other things to occupy themselves with for the next year".

    I think the fans need to cool it. Simple as that.
     
  20. TheKazeblade

    TheKazeblade

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    But again, public opinion wasn't even all that positive to begin with outside of the fanbase when it was fresh.

    So we have a game, out of the gate was met with a resounding "meh" by general (aka not Sonic fans) audiences and just as swiftly forgotten. Last I checked, marketing was meant to make a GOOD impression of a product. But hey, I only work in advertising as a professional career, so what do I know.