Sonic Colours out for Wii/DS

Discussion in 'General Sonic Discussion' started by TimmiT, May 26, 2010.

  1. Blue Blood

    Blue Blood

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    <!--quoteo(post=533176:date=Nov 24 2010, 08:27 PM:name=corneliab)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (corneliab @ Nov 24 2010, 08:27 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=533176">[​IMG]</a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=533163:date=Nov 24 2010, 11:58 AM:name=NomadTW)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (NomadTW @ Nov 24 2010, 11:58 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=533163">[​IMG]</a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Also no curves, no curves nowhere.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    Pretty much every zone in the game says hello.
    <!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    Well, not really. Take the platforming areas, be they 2D or 3D, and they're almost completely flat or full of rectangles. TR1 even manages to the slopes into squares. And who else if sick of speed-boosters preceding EVERY loop?
     
  2. NomadTW

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    <!--quoteo(post=533186:date=Nov 24 2010, 04:06 PM:name=Blue Blood)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Blue Blood @ Nov 24 2010, 04:06 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=533186">[​IMG]</a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=533176:date=Nov 24 2010, 08:27 PM:name=corneliab)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (corneliab @ Nov 24 2010, 08:27 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=533176">[​IMG]</a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=533163:date=Nov 24 2010, 11:58 AM:name=NomadTW)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (NomadTW @ Nov 24 2010, 11:58 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=533163">[​IMG]</a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Also no curves, no curves nowhere.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    Pretty much every zone in the game says hello.
    <!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    Well, not really. Take the platforming areas, be they 2D or 3D, and they're almost completely flat or full of rectangles. TR1 even manages to the slopes into squares. And who else if sick of speed-boosters preceding EVERY loop?
    <!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    That kinda goes back to my momentum based platforming thing in the 2D sections. I mean, on top of that, you already have a built in speed booster, with the boost move. So it's like...why? Are they that unconfident in their physics engine, or what?

    Actually, I guess it goes back to the 'made for kids' thing, now that I think about it. Because loops are FAR too complicated for the eight year olds to comprehend, right? :specialed:

    Eh, perhaps a little from column A, lil' from B.
     
  3. Dark Sonic

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    They should just get rid of speed boosters and put the Spindash back in this game as a main attack. It'd work perfectly. X is crouch so just use X + A and just get rid of sliding and replace it with rolling. This game would have done well with the Spindash, as sometimes you run out of boost and a quick charge would be useful.
     
  4. NomadTW

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    Eeeexactly. Seems like a no brainer to me, really. Here's hoping with the lack of wisps, they're forced to utilize his older moves, and perhaps bring back shields that sorta function like some of the wisps?

    Oh man, that'd be awesome as hell.
     
  5. Blue Blood

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    Unconfident in their physic engine? Not sure that's the right word. A lot of things in Colours are scripted. Go to Aquarium Park, head underwater and jump/swim out of it very slowly. As soon as he reaches the top, Sonic will rocket about 20 feet into the air. There's also an awful lot of scripted paths that you might not realise unless you let go of the controller. The reason for a lot of the speed boosters is stupid design. There're tiny paths with a huge upwards-slope or loop in the way before Sonic gets a chance to build up his speed up. What's the point? He can handle them just fine if he's going fast enough.
     
  6. glem3

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    <!--quoteo(post=533196:date=Nov 24 2010, 04:54 PM:name=Blue Blood)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Blue Blood @ Nov 24 2010, 04:54 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=533196">[​IMG]</a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Unconfident in their physic engine? Not sure that's the right word. A lot of things in Colours are scripted. Go to Aquarium Park, head underwater and jump/swim out of it very slowly. As soon as he reaches the top, Sonic will rocket about 20 feet into the air. There's also an awful lot of scripted paths that you might not realise unless you let go of the controller. The reason for a lot of the speed boosters is stupid design. There're tiny paths with a huge upwards-slope or loop in the way before Sonic gets a chance to build up his speed up. What's the point? He can handle them just fine if he's going fast enough.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    You're right, and I mentioned this before. A TON of stuff in sonic colors is scripted, and worst of all, after these sections, they'll often place an invisible wall so you can't go back.

    Some examples are:

    - Every loop in the gameland stages are scripted, you can't jump over the speed booster even

    - Every 2D to 3D transition in gameland, where you run around a curved area or ground loop thing is scripted (you can't go back through it)

    - The speed booster leading into the thing that chases you in Aquarium act part 4 is scripted, it is impossible to jump over

    - Those teacup things you move around in tropical resort act 2 (to be fair, you can go back around these, but you'll be automatically forced back forward if you do)

    - The hamburgers you go inside of in sweet mountain (Same thing as above)

    - The ice cream spiral in sweet mountain act 3

    - The rail at the end of sweet mountain act 2 (you can't boost)

    - The opening of Starlight carnival act 1, 6, and I think 4 or something like that.

    - The opening of planet wisp act 6

    - The opening of planet wisp act 3 (that's a short one though)

    And that's all I can think of off the top of my head. There are many, many others though, if you just actually TRY pressing buttons during certain parts.
     
  7. Dusk Golem

    Dusk Golem

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    <!--quoteo(post=533210:date=Nov 24 2010, 03:05 PM:name=glem3)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (glem3 @ Nov 24 2010, 03:05 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=533210">[​IMG]</a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=533196:date=Nov 24 2010, 04:54 PM:name=Blue Blood)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Blue Blood @ Nov 24 2010, 04:54 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=533196">[​IMG]</a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Unconfident in their physic engine? Not sure that's the right word. A lot of things in Colours are scripted. Go to Aquarium Park, head underwater and jump/swim out of it very slowly. As soon as he reaches the top, Sonic will rocket about 20 feet into the air. There's also an awful lot of scripted paths that you might not realise unless you let go of the controller. The reason for a lot of the speed boosters is stupid design. There're tiny paths with a huge upwards-slope or loop in the way before Sonic gets a chance to build up his speed up. What's the point? He can handle them just fine if he's going fast enough.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    You're right, and I mentioned this before. A TON of stuff in sonic colors is scripted, and worst of all, after these sections, they'll often place an invisible wall so you can't go back.

    Some examples are:

    - Every loop in the gameland stages are scripted, you can't jump over the speed booster even

    - The rail at the end of sweet mountain act 2 (you can't boost)
    <!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    The game gets less automated as it goes along, but definitely some parts are automated, but to be honest automation didn't bother me much in this game. Those invisible walls did.

    However I remember specifically going back up the rail and jumping over boosters in act 2 of Sweet Mountain and going back around loop-de-loops in the Sonic Simulator and screwing around with at least one of them and being surprised it wasn't too automated.
     
  8. glem3

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    <!--quoteo(post=533243:date=Nov 24 2010, 07:06 PM:name=Dusk Golem)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Dusk Golem @ Nov 24 2010, 07:06 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=533243">[​IMG]</a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->The game gets less automated as it goes along, but definitely some parts are automated, but to be honest automation didn't bother me much in this game. Those invisible walls did.

    However I remember specifically going back up the rail and jumping over boosters in act 2 of Sweet Mountain and going back around loop-de-loops in the Sonic Simulator and screwing around with at least one of them and being surprised it wasn't too automated.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    I never said you couldn't jump back up the rail... I said that you can't boost on it. Not "scripted", just not... normal. Maybe there are some specific loops in the sonic simulator you can go back through, but from my experience they don't allow you do jump over the speed booster.
     
  9. MegaDash

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    Those scripted sequences are meant to be solutions to the question of "Damn, I gotta build all these stages while STILL making Sonic go really really fast AND giving enough freedom to the players ... to hell with that. This shit is too complicated. Time to play programming God and script a bunch of sequences." In the end, it's just another tool or technique. I loved the intro to Starlight Carnival, even if I couldn't do anything. If I tried to, I probably would have fallen off and died ... or perhaps the programmer(s) could have scripted some gravity on the upside-down roads to keep me from falling to my death. This is a hell of a lot of thinking and programming that goes into making a Sonic level with the intents of it being fast, thrilling, and fun. Some compromises have to be made somewhere, but a skilled designer and a clever programmer should be able to find an optimal solution that satisfies both intents. Then again, Colors was made with the mindset of giving people more of what they liked from Unleashed, so of course they're going to have scripted sequences like that. The problem is balancing it all out.

    So far, there are a few things missing from the whole experience. Freedom is one. There are too many sequences where you can only move in a few prescribed directions in 3D and are barred from moving back by invisible walls or unscalable death pits. Challenge is good, but making the player feel like he's on a rollercoaster he can barely influence or use to go where he wants is not the best way to craft a gaming experience. If you're going to do stuff like that, then do it in such a way that we value it when it happens instead of going "Oh, this again? Enough already." It's still really fun, though, and it's arguably the best 3D Sonic game to come out since Adventure, especially for the 2D platforming, the few thrilling 3D sequences, the ability to become Super Sonic and to explore underwater locations while using the repeated water jump, and some of the Wisp powers. Colors lays down some serious experimental groundwork for future 3D and 2D console Sonic games. It does so much to really expand the experience in 3D while still being based on the more favored parts of Unleashed. That's good. But for all its done, it can be so much better. And much of the conceptual work has already been laid down in games like Sonic Adventure and the Genesis games. If they can replicate the same feeling those games gave us of playing as Sonic, and put it into a new game with new moves, new worlds, a third dimension, and new challenges, then that'll be something.
     
  10. glem3

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    <!--quoteo(post=533288:date=Nov 24 2010, 10:30 PM:name=MegaDash)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (MegaDash @ Nov 24 2010, 10:30 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=533288">[​IMG]</a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Those scripted sequences are meant to be solutions to the question of "Damn, I gotta build all these stages while STILL making Sonic go really really fast AND giving enough freedom to the players ... to hell with that. This shit is too complicated. Time to play programming God and script a bunch of sequences." In the end, it's just another tool or technique. I loved the intro to Starlight Carnival, even if I couldn't do anything.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    It doesn't take a genius to figure out how to not script these things, and it doesn't even make SENSE why they'd need to script a loop in gameland. They didn't script loops in other parts of the game or in sonic unleashed, so why now? Sonic unleashed DID have some scripted moments, but much less than sonic colors. In sonic unleashed, when there's a scripted moment (eg. holoska before the second bobsled section) you can almost always, if not always, backtrack through the scripted section, it doesn't actually PUSH you along said section at a set speed, it just sets you along a specific route.

    I guess what I'm saying is, I want to be able to control my speed during scripted sections.

    If I wanna go slow during the intro of starlight carnival, let me. If I want to run through a loop quickly, give me the option. Don't force speed on me, is what I'm asking. Because sometimes I want to go fast and sometimes I don't. The game "telling" me when to go fast makes it not fun. Games are about control. When the game takes that control away from me, I feel cheated. I don't want to do what the game tells me to do. Just like in real life, you don't want to do something when you're told to do it. So the game should allow me to play it how I want.

    Yeah, that's overly dramatic, and of course, most of the time it DOES give me that choice, but sometimes it doesn't and that's what's frustrating. This also relates to the game saying "Oh hai you can use drift now!". There's no reason to only let me use the move when the game says I can.
     
  11. Ch1pper

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    Gonna break in here with a quick question: I hear the Wii version doesn't have a Sound Test this time. Is this true? Baffling if so. :ohdear:
     
  12. bought the DS version monday, finished it today. Nothing really spectacular. basically its rush 4 (rush 3 if you don't count sonic 4 as rush 3). The whisps (or whatever their called) are a cool addition, but still didn't bump up the fun factor for me when it comes to latest sonic handheld titles. In fact the one thing I DID find enjoyable were the special stages (oddly enough). It's basically a rehash of the first sonic rush special stage minus the rings and stupid "numbered tricks" that made it hard (specially the last one... I mean, theres challenging, and then theres STUPIDLY?ANNOYINGLY challenging). The balls/spheres reminded me of Sonic 3, and whenever I see the halfpipes I'm always quickly reminded of Sonic 2, so both those little tidbits brought back a joy of nonstalgia to me. Usually there's at least ONE song from a sonic game that I find memorable, but honestly, I didn't find any in this game with the exception of MAYBE the boss music, but thats about it. Overall, to me its not bad, but it's not good either. And It's clear from the praises this game gets and how beautiful it looks that the Wii version is the far superior one.
     
  13. <!--quoteo(post=533332:date=Nov 25 2010, 02:12 AM:name=Ch1pper)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Ch1pper @ Nov 25 2010, 02:12 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=533332">[​IMG]</a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Gonna break in here with a quick question: I hear the Wii version doesn't have a Sound Test this time. Is this true? Baffling if so. :ohdear:<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    Unfortunately, yes it is true. At least I have the soundtrack on my iPod.
     
  14. Hez

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    I know I'm getting this game for my birthday and I hate knowing this. I don't have any desire to play it.
     
  15. And so begins the nitpicking of this game. For me, too many bottomless pits in some stages, and the reuse of the level geometry killed it. I didn't like some of the humour that was put into it, and the scripted things made me lol. At least with 06 they didn't have scripted loops :V Just very strong ducttape.
     
  16. Dusk Golem

    Dusk Golem

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    <!--quoteo(post=533353:date=Nov 25 2010, 02:04 AM:name=Irixion)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Irixion @ Nov 25 2010, 02:04 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=533353">[​IMG]</a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->And so begins the nitpicking of this game. For me, too many bottomless pits in some stages, and the reuse of the level geometry killed it. I didn't like some of the humour that was put into it, and the scripted things made me lol. At least with 06 they didn't have scripted loops :V Just very strong ducttape.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    And then some people to defend it. This was the 3D sonic game with fewest endless pits, so it's actually an improvement. Reused level geometry did not kill it in my opinion, like Unleashed they created a main 3D space and made different acts through the stages take different paths but each stage separates it enough I feel even if a few levels mainly just remix paths. Some of the humor was cringe-worthy but the script was an overall improvement too. The invisible walls from areas you just came from annoyed me more than the scripted parts, to be honest. I think I'll take a video of the loops since I know for a fact there was a loop in the Sonic simulator I was messing around with that wasn't scripted but the only one I really checked, and 06 loops were broken as fuck. Loops actually killed me in that game and there is no reason Sonic should be able to stand upside down.
     
  17. Ravi Singh

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    Did anyone else have issues with wall jumping? It didn't feel right.
     
  18. Kyuu

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    <!--quoteo(post=533366:date=Nov 25 2010, 03:44 AM:name=Ravi Singh)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Ravi Singh @ Nov 25 2010, 03:44 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=533366">[​IMG]</a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Did anyone else have issues with wall jumping? It didn't feel right.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    I know I did too, I often couldn't stick on walls properly. Most of the time it was just annoying, but god damn it made me hate that one red ring in one of Sweet Mountain's acts.

    But hey, 180/180. Super Sonic <!--coloro:#FF0000--><span style="color:#FF0000"><!--/coloro--><3[/COLOR]
     
  19. Felik

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    I must admit that SS in this game is not as epic as he was in classic games. I found myself enjoying using wisps much more than him for many reasons. But still he looks really cool in this game and 'cause of him I S-ranked Terminal Velocity with ease!
     
  20. Blue Blood

    Blue Blood

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    <!--quoteo(post=533366:date=Nov 25 2010, 11:44 AM:name=Ravi Singh)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Ravi Singh @ Nov 25 2010, 11:44 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=533366">[​IMG]</a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Did anyone else have issues with wall jumping? It didn't feel right.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    It was difficult as to get Sonic to grip onto the walls and you had to keep jumping really fast. It was rather annoying, but I could put up with it.