Discussion in 'General Sonic Discussion' started by MH MD, Apr 9, 2021.
Well you need to collect the Tails tokens so I imagine they're just not placed in those levels.
So... Apparently there are Phantasy Star player icons? Was this known?
The names around Shadow are Nei, Mieu, and Rudy (Chaz).
I've always felt on the outs of this whole fandom "divide" as SA1 and 2 were as much a part of my childhood as the Genesis games were, I didn't care about Heroes, Shadow or 06 at all, enjoyed the second wind of Unleashed, Colors and Generations and am at most ambivalent towards Lost World and Forces.
I think the people who draw hard lines between the fandoms are mostly just those who've internalized Sonic fandom too hard as their identity and need to feel like they're on a "side." I also feel like Sega has embraced this mentality as a cheap way of dismissing any criticism they get for lackluster games. I don't care if the next title is Mania 2, Adventure 3, a boost game or something else, just make it good.
By the time that happens in the Story the only levels left are the final boss and Terminal Velocity Act 2, which is really just quick stepping for 4 seconds then you're caught by the scripted explosion. There aren't really any opportunities for Tails to save you from that point on, especially because I believe Tails only saves you from pits and not all deaths.
Reviews are largely positive across the board. 77/100 on Metacritic, lots of 8/10s and 4/5s.
I honestly find Colors Ultimate getting great reviews compared to Sonic Adventure DX and Sonic Adventure 2 Battle a fascinating case study. The games were well received at launch, few years later got updated rereleases for newer systems that made changes that were controversial among fans... yet Colors is emerging from reviews largely unscathed, whereas the Adventure games got torched. I personally think it goes to show how Colors has aged better in the long run.
There wasn't much to ruin, you just Boost in 3D and stop and hop across blocky platforms in 2D. Very basic compared to the Adventures.
SA2 is probably the more curious case because of how short the turnaround was between SA2 on Dreamcast and SA2B on GameCube. SA2B's Metascore isn't terrible (73) but still pales in comparison to the Dreamcast version's (89), despite having plenty of improvements and none of the negative changes (to what extent they're there) being major enough to ruin the game or anything.
I recall a lot of reviews at the time admitting they were more willing to overlook the Dreamcast version's flaws as it was Sega's swan song and they wanted to celebrate the Dreamcast going out on a high note, but still, a 16-point gap! And as much love as I have for SA2, I do feel it belongs more in the 70s than in the 80s, regardless of which version we're talking about.
Contrast that to SADX being an utterly broken port, fixing absolutely none of the issues with the original and adding in plenty of new problems of its own, the new content feeling extremely underwhelming... yeah, no surprise it got roasted in the reviews. It's a shame because I think an SA1 port that was brought up to 03's standards (we had already seen competent 3D platformers in that generation - Mario Sunshine, Jak & Daxter, Ratchet & Clank, there wasn't much excuse) could have held its own, but the parts of SA1 that were easily forgiven as part of the learning curve in 98-99 made it a laughing stock in 03. The camera and controls needed to be brushed up significantly and I'd even say the cutscenes should have been fully redone and re-voiced.
Yeah, it's notable if you read the text of SADX's reviews from back in 2003, nobody's docking it because they think it's different from the Dreamcast version, they're docking it, if anything, because it's not different enough.
From 1998 to 1999, NextGen spent an entire year harping on about how buggy the Japanese version was, how Sonic could fall through floors, and expressed disappointment that the US release hadn't done enough to shore up this sort of thing. The alternate gameplay styles, Big most especially, were always contentious points. As bad a port as DX was, the discourse was always the discourse. The things people were saying when the game originally launched are the same kinds of debates people get into now.
And yet, it got a lot of 80-something reviews in its own time, with this sentiment like, "It's an incredible spectacle, but it's not quite the killer app Sega was hoping for." So yeah... at launch, it was one of the speediest, most technically/graphically impressive video games ever made, so it was MUCH easier for critics to excuse these things. It was worth putting up with the learning curve and learning your way around its lack of stability. But just a few years later, the shine had worn off, and the substance underneath the spectacle didn't hold together.
As for SA2 to SA2: Battle... for one thing, review sites in those days often had teams dedicated to one particular platform, so SA2 was often reviewed by Sega fans, seeing it as the bittersweet Final Sonic Game on Sega Hardware. As soon as Sonic games started coming out on other platforms, the gloves were off.
But also, Battle came out on the other side of generation-defining titles like GTAIII, Halo, and MGS2. The industry moved fast in those days. Between June 2001 and February 2002, the bar had been raised considerably, so what was impressive for the DC's swansong really *could* have seemed outdated and underwhelming on more powerful hardware, just a few months later.
I love Kenichi Tokoi.
I really want to like this but it just sounds like a net downgrade of the original. It sounds bare in comparison and doesn't swell up as well.
honestly I feel like Sega can be really hit-or-miss when it comes to remixing their more modern original tracks. Sometimes it feels like they can't or aren't willing to at least match the original production, resulting in some pretty cheap-sounding remixes that are lighter on instrumentation and rely more on electronic synth.
...but then sometimes they whip out something like this.
This is kinda neat. TSS played around with Tails Save, and found that park tokens respawn after being saved, so you can sort of grind them that way, and you also don't need to collect a red ring again if Tails saves you after collecting one.
Oh definitely, and there was a point when I was knee deep into it too until I realized there are way more enjoyable gaming franchises besides Sonic. I don't need to define myself by it or the specific version of him I prefer because I have way more outlets for it.
Obviously I cannot control how people feel and react, but yea, Sega leveraging this fandom division for their products has done more harm than good imo. Its fine that fans who prefer Classic over Modern can just focus on stuff like Mania and never engage with the Modern 3D stuff and vice versa, but all that does is segregate and force people to take sides.
Both sides should be encouraging Sega to make better games IN GENERAL than just being focused on "getting what they want. There's absolutely no reason we can't have modern elements in a classic styled game or classic elements in a modern game, but Sega have poisoned the well so badly that Modern fans are vehemently against ANYTHING from Classic "infecting" the Modern branch.
It really is hit or miss. Sometimes music is only as good as its listener. Whatever, life goes on.
audio/visual bugs being "left in" indicates that the porting process probably had some serious ones that they had to take time to iron out before release. It's not "laziness" or "lololol how could they", it's triage. And every single game has it, even the most "polished" ones.
One thing I will say is that, while I'm not super familiar with the fandom dynamics currently, I don't think anything I've seen approaches the same level of toxicity as like, SatAM/Archie fans versus "SegaSonic" fans from the 90s/early 00s. People were absolutely vicious towards each other over which form they preferred their cartoon blue hedgehog in. I was a FUS regular (throwback!) and was always crossing my fingers for a Season 3, but I was always very put off by the shit being flung at the people who still kept up with the games or were excited for Sonic X and such - especially seeing as I was one of them.
Likewise there were always plenty of jabs at SatAM and its admittedly insane fanbase from the "SegaSonic" forums which ultimately turned me off from them, but it's like, damn people. Let's all just recognize that absolutely none of us are the target audience here and enjoy what we enjoy.
So this is what the Sonic movie aura looks like. Honestly not bad, I kinda like it tbh.
Are those bonuses limited to pre-ordering the digital version? I pre-ordered at Gamestop and while it's not a big deal, it would kinda stink to miss them.
Not quite sure but I bet they'll be available at some point one way or the other.
The Sonic movie stuff might be pre-order only. I don't think anything else is.
Tails making a comment when you use a 3D-in-2D from the original game is hilarious. Props to SEGA/Blind Squirrel for going the extra mile to acknowledge speedrunners.
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