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Sonic Classic Heroes

Discussion in 'Engineering & Reverse Engineering' started by flamewing, Nov 2, 2010.

  1. Looks really good!
    Nice touch with having Amy land the Tornado and then pick the trio up later.
    The only thing that'd make it even better would be if she would actually drop the three off in Emerald Hill, or lands the plane there like Tails did in Sylvania Castle in S4EpII.
    But could also be a bit overkill, I'm not sure myself on that one.

    Eitherway, keep up the great work!
     
  2. SpaceyBat

    SpaceyBat

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    That is, like, seriously the best way I could have imagined someone linking Sonic 1 to Sonic 2. Wonderful job!

    ...if Sonic 2 and 3&Knuckles were linked together, and thus all three games were playable in sequence, I think I would die happy.
     
  3. Ajavalo

    Ajavalo

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    Very nice transition, definitely much better than the previous one! :)

    By the way, another little change you should do is putting a score tally for Scrap Brain act 3 after S1's final boss and get rid of the rather stupid "Final Zone" card. I think CollinC10 did just that for his hack, am I right?
     
  4. flamewing

    flamewing

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    The title card shows 'Scrap Brain Zone 3' in Final Zone; and the score tally was coded, but a branch was incorrectly set so it was being skipped. I had just fixed it myself when I saw your post.
     
  5. BlueAuraEX

    BlueAuraEX

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    I think I agree with what was said earlier: Have Amy drop them down from the sky in a brisk, fluid motion into Emerald Hill Zone. It doesn't have to be a long, drawn out scene at all like in Sonic 4: Ep.II. Basically, you could do it like you did in "this" cutscene, but make it to where she flies through the air, they jump off and land RIGHT at the beginning of the stage. It's just a small, subtle change, but something just tells me it'd fit perfectly with this hack.
     
  6. dsrb

    dsrb

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    The characters looking confused at the Emeralds disappearing is a good idea, but I'm not sure if it's ideal to have this interspersed by their victory poses, and more so it's pretty unclear why they disappear at all: is it implied that Robotnik has used the Death Egg to do that, or is it just meant to be something convenient like the instability of Chaos energy? :P

    Definitely moving in the right direction though. And hey, it has that music, so it can never lose!
     
  7. flamewing

    flamewing

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    Considering that you keep the emeralds between the two parts (having a pool of 7 chaos and 7 sol emeralds to collect), I would say that the confused look is just surprise at all the stuff that just happened.

    And looking around, there is enough VRAM available in EHZ that the cutscene may just work.
     
  8. Marcus101RR

    Marcus101RR

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    I have to admit the amazing hacking creations you guys make is beyond anything. This is quite something to be honest. You created basically a custom cutscene that adds the animation and story line to what is Sonic The Hedgehog 2. I like this alot, and I hope you will do the exact same thing with Sonic 3 and Knuckles combination when you start working on that. I cannot wait to start playing this new version on the Sega Genesis and on the Emulator seeing which one will fail first.

    Keep up the good work too. Would you mind explaining how the Emeralds will work though? Seeing how you have to collect 13 Emeralds is a bit crazy...
     
  9. flamewing

    flamewing

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    There are 14 emeralds: the ones from S1 special stages are referred to as "chaos emeralds" in the results screen, and they are the ones that you need 7 of for the emeralds cutscene in the transition. Likewise, the ones from the S2 special stages are called "sol emeralds" in the results screen. I know people will bitch and moan about this, but that is how it is going to be :v:.

    Note that at present, only Team Sonic is functional. That said: for Team Sonic, Team Mini and (maybe) Team Glitch, having either set of 7 emeralds complete allows super transformation, while having all 14 emeralds allows hyper transformation. Neither Team Super nor Team Hyper can collect emeralds, and they will die if you run out of rings in a level. For all other teams, you need all 14 emeralds to transform.

    While super, invincibility monitors become S monitors. For Team Super, and for all teams that can become Hyper, the S monitor turns you hyper for 20 seconds and change (and gives 20 rings). On all other cases, the S monitor gives speed shoes.

    I may or may not have Team Super and Team Hyper require finishing the game with enough emeralds to unlock.
     
  10. jasonchrist

    jasonchrist

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    Obviously I think what you're doing is great, in fact so great I never play vanilla Sonic 2 anymore.

    BUT I think the cutscene thing needs a rethink. Now (and feel free to tell me to fuck right off here) I think you're missing a glorious opportunity to show the first launching of the Death Egg, joining 1 and 2 together creates obvious parallels to Sonic 3K, so Scrap Brain could serve as a great Launch Base of sorts - plus watching it crawl horizontally across the Green Hill skies looks kind of... weird. Also if Amy is picking the trio up in The Tornado then why isn't she (at least attempting) to take them all the way? Maybe if she were to be shot down over Emerald Hill? A further parallel to 3k could be made by taking your Green Hill midpoint cutscene and putting it right at the end after the Sonic 2 ending and using that as a teaser for 3K - seeing Angel Island back to it's normal green goodness after 14 grueling zones made you realize how far you've come and what a bloody big game you've just conquered - seeing Green Hill at the end of this game I believe would have the same effect.
     
  11. BlueAuraEX

    BlueAuraEX

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    Flamewing, I wouldn't worry too much about people bitching about the Sol Emeralds bit: It actually helps make this story a bit more sensible. I mean, the Sol Emeralds are basically another set of Chaos Emeralds from another dimension, right? So it fits. It's just another reservoir of Chaotic energy, which was exactly what the Super Emeralds were, so it all makes sense. I also am "adoring" these new transformation ideas of yours. Pure genius, and I mean that!

    As for what Jasonchrist said, I kinda agree with him on a few points. I think it would make the game feel more brisk if we had some more detailing and plot-forwarding moments concerning the Death Egg. You're planning on doing Sonic 3&K Heroes much like this hack, right? Well, if you're gonna do it all like this, I suggest just going along with your very own canon. Make your own version of the epic trilogy! It'd make these hacks MUCH more appealing to the hacker crowd, and who knows: They could be hailed as the greatest, most thought out hacks here at Retro! (least, "I" think so anyways)

    EDIT: Also, I really like the title you chose for this. I really do. Granted, the original Sonic Heroes wasn't the best game ever, but it'd be kinda cool if it just sorta "tied in" with these two games of yours, ya know? Sonic Classic Heroes, Sonic Classic Heroes 2, Sonic Heroes, etc. Just thought I'd point that out~ As food for thought.
     
  12. dsrb

    dsrb

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    I haven't seen anyone bitching.
    Questions are different and useful and should not be cast in this dismissive light. Besides, I haven't seen many of those before now, either!

    Using this exact logic, why weren't the Super Emeralds themselves used? Is it to do with their link to the Master Emerald/Hidden Place, from a story-oriented perspective? In which case, cool.

    I, too, am interested to see if you have any opinions about the cutscene-related suggestions. As well as more exposition regarding the Death Egg, Jason's idea of returning to Green Hill might be kinda cool: I can almost imagine a splash screen with “SOME DAYS LATER . . .” and then Sonic and Tails taking off in the Tornado from GHZ over the sea, destination AIZ currently unknown, perhaps after having heard a rumour about the Death Egg being on some island. </brainfart>
     
  13. flamewing

    flamewing

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    The problem being that the background of Scrap Brain is not supportive of this. Maybe in SBZ1... but none of the other levels allow anything like this -- they are too much indoor-sy. I suppose I could make the Death Egg launch in the background, with the screen shaking and the palette becoming darker,, while the Wing Fortress flies by to pick up Eggman. It would imply that he outsmarted Sonic and Team, having his true plans in motion elsewhere while he distracted them.

    FYI, I had thought of having a transition in Metropolis with Eggman flying into the Wing Fortress and Amy coming to pick the players up, but faces the same problem as Scrap Brain -- it simply doesn't fit the level.

    Other cutscenes I thought of:

    EHZ->CPZ: after the score tally, some sort of chemical spill is seen in the background lake. The screen pans right to reveal the Chemical Plant in the background, polluting everything, with Eggman flying in to it.

    HTZ->MCZ: Similar to Sandopolis->Lava Reef.

    MCZ->OOZ: after the score tally, the screen rumbles and a jet of oil throws the players out of MCZ and into OOZ. You know, Eggman was looking for oil in MCZ.

    Refueling? Because they saw Eggman getting off the Flying Battery and unleashing a badnik army? To keep the game going? You are overthinking this :v:

    But I suppose I could have the Tornado down on the ground in EHZ with puffs of smoke, similar to WFZ start, with the players also already on the ground, indicating that it needs repair -- maybe from traveling too long a distance, maybe from being hit. I still need to see if I can put Amy and the Tornado in EHZ, palette-wise.

    It is an idea; but then, the entire point of it being a transition cutscene is lost.

    I am not, I am anticipating it and saying that their complaints will go to /dev/null :v:

    It is because of the Master Emerald/Hidden Palace connection, yeah. Plus something else, which I won't mention now.

    There is something else planned for after the Death Egg level in my hack, but I won't talk about it yet. A couple of people know what I am planning, and they think it will be epic if I pull it off.

    But anyway: I had been thinking of extending the S2 ending cutscene a bit, similarly to the S3&K one -- after being picked up by the Tornado, you fly down on it until sea level, more or less, and pass in front of an island. I also thought of having the Death Egg crashing in the background and hitting Angel Island on the way, as a segue into S3&K (but with no rest for the players). The latter would conflict slightly with my post-DEZ plans, though.
     
  14. dsrb

    dsrb

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    Everything you just said sounds great! I'm really looking forward to all the new cutscenes. It'll be like Sonic 2: S3 Edition, except not incomplete and with hundreds more features! :D Also excited for all the surprise stuff. Hurry up ;)
     
  15. flamewing

    flamewing

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    These new cutscenes won't be there for a while, though: I would prefer to do them once I have good ideas for all of them, or the game feels incomplete.
     
  16. RetroKoH

    RetroKoH

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    God damn... if this hack does too much better, my fangame in progress might become obsolete.
    I can't wait to see this in action flamewing! Got my support!
     
  17. BlueAuraEX

    BlueAuraEX

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    Hmmm~ Chaos Emeralds...Sol Emeralds...Super Emeralds....Add'em all up, ya get a whopping 21 emeralds...I sense a great..."Awesomeness" in the force.
     
  18. Chilly Willy

    Chilly Willy

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    That's not enough! Substitute rings with emeralds! :v:
     
  19. BlueAuraEX

    BlueAuraEX

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    Listen, I'm all for breaking reality, but we gotta be reasonable here: If "every" single little ring was a Chaos Emerald....Good god, I don't even think it'd just stop there. It'd break reality, fantasy, all in-between...Granted, that'd be effing awesome, but ya just can't do it captain!! Ya don't, have, the power!
     
  20. Jimmy Hedgehog

    Jimmy Hedgehog

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    Getting the motivation to continue old projects
    New plan, substitute the rings with world rings XD

    Anyways I'm really liking the look of how this is coming along! I need to get myself the latest revision as I've not tried this since early stages.