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Sonic Classic 2

Discussion in 'Fangaming Discussion' started by Hez, Jul 21, 2011.

  1. Volpino

    Volpino

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    The point I was trying to make was that it looks juvenile. There's a difference in not being original, and doing something on the level of a 12 year old. It looks like a joke and I really fail to see why this is needed besides to satisfy some fanboy fantasy bullshit (Of which I have a very low opinion), I cannot respect this in any way. Of all the ways you can give Sonic a gliding power, or a flying power, you give him a fusion with Tails or Knuckles.

    Or maybe I should just ask the question "Why the hell don'[t you just use a fucking jetpack instead of merging Sonic and Tails? What is being accomplished except to shirk drawing extra sprites?" Is it just a reference to the previous game? If so, I'd be pretty pissed off if I played the other game and found out some features were actually given a downgrade, because to my understanding, the last game had the two as fully playable, taking advantage of their abilities whenever you wanted and not just when a monitor was near.
     
  2. DimensionWarped

    DimensionWarped

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    Stuff like that is only fanboy fantasy bullshit if you approach it that way. Any sort of fanboy fantasy bullshit is like that. I for one just found it somewhat funny and amusing that he chose to do it that way instead of just finding a way to slap random powers onto Sonic.

    And whooo, Jetpack Sonic, that's exciting and unique. You say why, I say why not. It makes no difference in any kind of way that actually matters... well, except to people who get all bent out of shape over little things that they perceive as critical for some reason.
     
  3. Volpino

    Volpino

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    I don't think you understand the perspective we're looking at it from. At least a jetpack looks better on Sonic than giving him two tails.

    Your avatar tells me you appreciate an extreme sense of the ridiculous so I can understand you finding it amusing, and if it's just meant to be a sense of humor, it's probably more excusable but when I first saw this on YouTube, my first thought was that some 12 year old kid was trying to make what they considered a "super cool" idea. I honestly cannot look at this and take it seriously as a project, I'm surprised it's as well-received as it is considering I expected people to point out how ludicrous it looks, but maybe I give Sonic fans too much credit.
     
  4. dsrb

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    People might take you more seriously if you didn't express your conceited overreaction in such a juvenile and low-brow way.

    Hold the dumb insults; just provide your opinion and move on.
     
  5. Steven M

    Steven M

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    The idea's dumb on its own but the justification you're using here marks thin ice for the project. On the one hand - "it's a fantasy environment therefore different things can happen to shake up the gameplay" - is acceptable enough and sometimes people need to relax and see how this particular experiment turns out, since it's taken in good faith that the creator either knows what they're doing or can rely on people to help him out.

    On the other hand - "it's a fantasy environment therefore I can do whatever I want NO YOU'RE STUPID" - there's the danger of a very ugly attitude creeping in that is pretty much an enabler for the creator to channel their "creativity" or "inspiration" in the silliest manner possible. It's dangerous because that attitude betrays contempt or a deliberate lack of understanding for the original concept in favor of something shallow and insubstantial on the creator's part; and because an attitude like this is more than amply supported by sycophants who won't constructively support the creator's vision.

    Plus, 'it's unrealistic so anything goes'? Seriously? I guess you can't complain about the physics in DIMPS Sonic anymore then because IT'S A VIDEOGAME YOU GUYS STOP COMPLAINING :v: :v: :v:
     
  6. DimensionWarped

    DimensionWarped

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    No StevenM, that's a ridiculous sentiment for a number of reasons, not the least of which is that you are comparing a relatively minor feature that simply allows certain abilities to be accessed at certain times to the fundamental way the game plays. No one bitches about Knuckles Chaotix having those boxes that change your character for a while despite them making no more or less sense than this and having the exact same kind of impact on what really matters (how the game is played).

    As for this bit about channeling creativity in the silliest manner possible, so what? A little silliness never hurt anything. One of the best completed fangames I personally played in recent memory was Eggman Hates Furries, and it was far more audacious in channeling silliness than this could ever be. This is so blatantly pedestrian compared to that. If any sort of diversion from the 'original concept' (more like the original concept as you see it) of the games is a problem is somehow seen as contempt towards the original games, you are placing way too much constraint on people to ever make a game that is anything different than another Sonic 3 clone.
     
  7. jasonchrist

    jasonchrist

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    Gotta say, I too am not a fan of the powerups for the simple fact that they make Sonic look like a complete and utter spastic, especially in Tails mode. It's like something some sick shithead on deviantart who fantasizes about Sonic and Tails fucking would come up with. As a big fan of Classic 1 I know you're better than that, Hez.

    Why not just make morph monitors? Where Sonic can transform into Knuckles or Tails upon contact. Or pull a Sonic 2 Heroes and have your comrades with you for the life of the power up?
     
  8. DimensionWarped

    DimensionWarped

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    I do agree that the sprites at least could use some work, but I thought that much was implied in the original post when he said that he wasn't even sure he wanted to do a Classic sequel or not.
     
  9. Black Squirrel

    Black Squirrel

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    Tails/Knuckles monitors are fine. Keep them in.

    Just change the music.
     
  10. Covarr

    Covarr

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    Honestly, I'd prefer tails/knuckles monitors that actually swap in tails or knuckles for a limited period of time, rather than a palette swap of Sonic. I know, there's no logical reason for them to show up and disappear just as suddenly, but it'd certainly look better than Red Sonic.
     
  11. Sparks

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    There is so many things wrong with this post. If you're trying to give decent criticism, you really don't need to do it with insults like retarded or comparing it to fan fictions. You sound unprofessional and loose all credibility. I agree the monitors and their result aren't the best idea ever, but there really ways better ways to word your criticism.

    And Classic 1 already had Tails and Knuckles programmed in, so Hez is anything but lazy. :/ Classic 1 was made in Multimedia Fusion 2.0 as well if I recall.
     
  12. DimensionWarped

    DimensionWarped

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    Hez: If placating the masses is important to you, here's my suggestion:

    1. Keep the monitors, and even keep the fact that they are aspects of Tails and Knuckles through use of the icons.
    2. Replace the sprite swaps on Sonic with a couple additional animations that simply make mechanical looking attachments to Sonic that make the abilities sensible. Have him pull out some kind of hang glider when he uses the Knuckles glide ability, give him Knuckles gloves when he uses the climbing ability, and have him get some kind of helicopter attachment when he does Tails flight.

    That way mechanically it would be the same, but there would be one less reason for people to act like this triviality is a grievous offense.
     
  13. Steven M

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    No-one bitched about it because the presentation and execution of the idea didn't seem awkward as hell. You and Vulpino already brought up the idea of Jetpack Sonic (a throwback to the Game Gear Sonic games where they'd try out different things like spring shoes and hang-gliders) and that doesn't seem so bad. Maybe it's not "whoop de doo unique" but then Dragonball/DeviantART bullshit isn't unique either, so why bring that rebuttal up at all?

    It didn't hurt that Eggman Hates Furries was a good game while still being different in execution. I'm not asking for a Sonic 3 clone, I'm asking for a game that, if it wants to shake things up a bit, doesn't rely on "oh well it's a game about a blue hedgehog who collects rings, how dare you argue about the absurdity of Sonitails" to make a point. That screams insecurity.

    Maybe what I'm getting at is the presentation and attitude of the concept. Sonic has a hang-glider or jetpack to fly around? Ok. Sonic has knuckle-gloves to climb walls, burrow through the ground and glide? Alright, I'll buy it, I'd probably question the absence of Knuckles to do the same job but whatever. Sonic hits a monitor and switches out with Knuckles or Tails? Interesting, you could tamper with the idea of a fixed or dynamic time limit. Sonic does the fusion dance with Knuckles or Tails? It doesn't change the gameplay idea but it does look fucking awesome if you're like 12 years old dumb - and on a forum/community well known for arguing about petty visual details you can't bring up the "stop complaining about minor things" card.

    Sonic with 'mechanical enhancements'? Here's an idea - make Metal Sonic Classic.

    EDIT: I'm sorry, I would actually greatly appreciate it if Hez or someone made Metal Sonic Classic.
     
  14. Flare

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    Well today I learnt that the designers of Kirby are dumb fan boy 12 year olds.

    In any case, I'd work on the sprites more for presentation sake - though the video was obviously just a demonstration - and keep somewhat a sense of humour over this power up, though you did say it was optional, and it wasn't like I expected "Hey Shadow I can only stop Eggman if we combine powers! yeah!". It is a fan game, the best chance to do things we would not see in the official series.
     
  15. DimensionWarped

    DimensionWarped

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    Why I brought it up is because it's some random nonsense just like this is, and that isn't a bad thing. You are talking about this as though it's some kind of Dragon Ball Z homage, which... ok, I guess if you approach it from that point of view there are some minor similarities between Sonic donning the rough equivalent of a Tails suit and the fusing thing from Dragon Ball Z... not that similar things weren't done a thousand times before Dragon Ball Z did that.

    But that really just brings me back around to why your notion of why this is wrong is jacked up in the first place. You keep talking about things appealing to kids as if that somehow made them wrong, but this is a series where you play as a cartoon animal. Back in the Genesis era, the series was regular pulling up silly homages to things like Star Wars and Dragon Ball Z, only they weren't mild things that could be construed as a reference by someone who was looking, they were very blatant.
     
  16. Volpino

    Volpino

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    Pretty much everything said here.

    Also Kirby has always been designed in the way, more or less, his entire gameplay is based off this concept. Sonic's is not.

    At least the Wisps in Colors were believable to a degree, fantasy is not an excuse to do whatever dipshit fanboy thing you feel like doing, period, and if you do, you're going to have someone slamming you for it. I am honestly surprised an adult came up with this.

    P.S. gameplay isn't always the biggest be-all-end-all concern for a developer of anything, this attitude, I feel, is mostly just used as an excuse for lack of an imagination.
     
  17. SteelBrush

    SteelBrush

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    Hez, ignore all these condescending assholes and do what you want, it's your game.
     
  18. DimensionWarped

    DimensionWarped

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    Kirby didn't get the ability to use copy abilities until the second Kirby game and he didn't start to take on any physical characteristics of the enemies he absorbed until Kirby Superstar, so no, he wasn't designed in that way.

    And you keep harping on and on about this as if it were done out of some Dragon Ball Z fanboy thing, and there really just isn't there enough to say that. To me this makes about as much sense as slamming Paper Mario Thousand Year Door for letting you put on a badge to dress Mario up in green instead of red.

    P.S. Gameplay and the various things that comprise it are the life blood of a platform game and matter much, much more than everything else. Sonic could become a pirate and Tails could become a ninja in a game, and I wouldn't begrudge that at all as long as it were going into something fun to play.
     
  19. Volpino

    Volpino

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    This is where we differ. I'd turn my nose up to something so retarded.

    No, I'm harping on and on about it as if it were some Sonic fanboy thing combined with some random anime/DBZ shit. (This is coming from someone who loves anime, by the way, but does not like it when people's ridiculous fanboy ideas override any common sense or taste.)

    Also I like how a community that is typically so nitpicky about a palmtree in an HD game wants to defend creative liberties at the same time.
     
  20. Hez

    Hez

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    Well, after sifting through all this shit....I'll say this

    Jesus fucking christ people...

    1. Knuckles/Tails monitors

    Theyre a CONCEPT. Understand CONCEPT. The first level in general isnt even 10 percent done. I am now leaning torwards drawing either knuckles and tails sprites all together, or perhaps a type of suit

    2. W.A.C.

    You are fucking retarded. Do you not understand what goes into making a game? First you call me lazy and act like I can't make knuckles and tails fully playable when this game is BUILT ON FUCKING SONIC CLASSIC 1 which has them playable. Infact, they are still playable in the concept built of Sonic Classic 2. I really don't understand where the hell you are getting your ideas. Also, I have half a sprite sheet for them in SC2 form. I did at one point want to put them in as extra characters after completing the game, or something. Replacing whom ever character you are with Sonic. So yeah, I have no idea how I am lazy? I was more or less trying to me inovative with a twist on game play while still holding together the basic formula and giving the player an option of even using these new features.

    3. Sprites

    I've overhauled them. I said this before. I even showed pictures of the new standing sprite. Ill post a damn video later just so youll shut up.