Sonic Classic 2

I admit I like the idea of saws and blades and industry acting as obstacles in the Wood Zone, like Eggman's forces trying to take down this lovely landscape (the top of the background showing all the trees sawed up from the top arguably also serves as such). Another reference to that whole 'nature vs technology' thing in the early games. I don't think any other recreation of the zone has tried that, which is surprising.

I also appreciate you didn't just do rows and rows of those teeny little blocks as the majority of the pathway like some others do.

 

Ponds? A water level then?

Ah maybe like digger or bulldozer type machinery as platforms and obstacles and such you mean? Maybe also some 'wood cutter' badniks akin the MHZ mini boss (I once had this idea of a 'lumberjack' badnik that clung to trees and similarly cut and lobbed chips of wood at you, something like that could likely be modified from the Coconuts badnik actually).

Whatever is planned, what we've seen so far is great considering it's just an extra for the project.

 

Looking great Hez, I like what you did with the background and I'm looking forward to seeing what other graphical tweaks you make. Another Hidden Palace rendition would be nice, it would feel weird having the rest of the missing levels there and not that one, but it's your game after all.

 

I suppose if you did add Hidden Palace you could try just replicating the level like for the other final ones. I don't know if you'd want to go through the trouble replicating all the new features for an extra, but I could see it adding a boost in appeal to your project making the remake's new level accessible to non mobile gamers.

 

Really like the Saw gimmicks you implemented. Plus your work with the background and the top of it... nicely done. Keep it up!

 

Yeah, but everyone loves secrets, don't they? :v:

I guess a "complete" Wood Zone could be too much work. But that's a shame, because I think the level has potential, but all we see are people completing the level using the unfinished art, which leaves the look sterile/bland. And if there is someone who has the talent and dedication necessary to create a full version of the level, certainly is you. (Just a little more color already makes the level easier on the eyes.) But, anyway, taking into account the "saw gimmick" that you have implemented, I'm sure the level will be fun enough - it was a great idea!

True, but if you will put all the other levels, without Hidden Palace it would seems like something is missing. But, well, it's not a big deal I guess.

 

As long as some extra parallax layers are added on top of that flat tree canopy, then I think it'll look a lot better. You already have a bit of depth tease with the sky there, which is awesome.

 

Well, yeah, the top of the level is amazing with the blue sky and the sun. The problem is the "sameness" of the pattern below; every level in Sonic 2 is colorful and vibrant, with animated background or even several levels of parallax. I think that Wood Zone is the only one in which everything is brownish with pastel tones: the closest one would be Wing Fortress, but it has that blue sky for contrast.

Then again, that's me beign a little nitpicky. I know the level will be a lot of fun just looking at the video. I will play the hell out of it, as I have done in Sonic Classic. :v:

 

Oh, that background was just a example, since I'm not that good at drawing - but I do understand where you are coming from.

When you get a material that isn't complete and you try to finish it, you need to extrapolate from what exists in the game. It's a problem that I've seen in a certain content restoration project of Fallout 2: the quests and NPCs were all broken, which created the need for Killap (the modder in question) to write pages and pages of dialogue. But then, to what extent this can be considered a "restoration"? If you need to change something to present a "full version", can we really say that its essence remains? That's a good question. Certainly, different people will have different answers for it, all equally valid. Personally, I saw many romhacks and even fangames using the Wood Zone in its incomplete state, that's why I believe that a more "refined" version of the level is something desirable. Especially if it is something coming from someone whose talent is well known.

But, let's see... If I really knew how to draw well, I wouldn't change the essence of the background, but I would add more details to it. For example, I would let the purple trees stay in the background, but leaving the green foliage on a plane behind. Possibly, I would create some "holes" in the green foliage so you could see parts of the blue sky. With this background in 3 layers (maybe even more, I dunno how it would look in motion), I believe that this would bring more life to the scenery. (And also, as I did in the pic I linked, I would use leaves with other colors, since green and brown were too prevalent.)

Examples:

Spoiler

Trees:
or, with added detail:

Base background:


With Sky:



Reference / original:


Complete? The trees should move in different speeds, of course. Maybe some orange leaves here and there, dunno, I just did this in 5 minutes.

Mockup comparison:

Spoiler

vs. and original

Or maybe I could try to go the "Wood Zone Beta" way, the background seems more complete there. But that's what *I* would do, or try to, at least. If you decide to work more on the level, I believe you may find ways to work with it that would leave you satisfied. Taking by the gimmick that you created, you have enough sense to maintain consistency in the level trope.

Either way, I really like you work, whatever you choose to do. You are one of the few people that still make me visit this site from time to time, to look at the forum, although I don't always comment here.

 

Seems like a pretty decent attempt at remaking that level, though Sonic Retro Remix probably has my favorite version of that stage. Overall, it has a lot of potential and I'm curious to see how you re-envision it. The difficulty of attempting to add new stages to Sonic 2 is trying to maintain its consistency in quality. It's difficult to make a great Sonic stage, but it's even more difficult to make a great Sonic stage that's supposed to feel like it came from a specific Sonic game.

 

Wood zone is certainly very incomplete in its Beta stage. A lot of graphics in the foreground / background are actually placeholders waiting to be filled. In the background, you can see the dark-green flowers shadows everywhere, as they were cut out. The bright blue color in the palette suggests a sky or something. Also, the level seems too flat to fit Sonic 2.

I like the top of the background you have done Hez. Here is an example of what I think Wood zone may look like if more complete (looks like a mix of Hez and Chaud examples in a way):

Spoiler

 

I really like the version on Sonic Retro Remix. Gameplay-wise it's almost perfect, and I really like what Thorn/DNXDelta did with the foreground, the grass and the earth pattern. But the art from the rest of the level (specially the background) still feel incomplete. Since the level is super fun to play, it ends up not being so important, but it still doesn't make me feel like a true "full" version of the level.

(For some reason, I always believed that the "lift" of Hill Top Zone, made of vines, has always been a gimmick designed to be in the Wood Zone which ended up being transported and adapted to another level. But it is likely to be just me.)

That's beautiful! I belive it may change "a little too much" for the taste of some people, but quite liked the vines used to increase the level of detail of the scenery. And the purple trees as well as part of the pattern used in the background remains, which is good. In the end, each person will have his own personal interpretation of how the level would/could be if it had really been finalized.

 

Well, there's that blue background in the beta screenshot (without the purple trees, and it seems to be in a layer further than the green leaves):


But it's a matter of paradigm. You want to keep the fidelity level according to what the level is, or "in accordance with what is known of the level". I'm assuming that the final version of the level would be very different, based on the fact that the quality of level art (at least in my opinion) is far below the rest of the game: no parallax, little variety in the scenery, lack of color, etc. Based on this, and based on the quality control used throughout the rest of the game, I assume that the level would still suffer changes (possibly drastic ones, in some ways) before being finalized, and it's this hypothetical version of the level that I try to find. In other words, it's a difference in the vision of what the full level would be. One based on what it is, and other based on "what it might have come to be".

You seem to be in the first group, Hez, while I and Hachelle-Bee are in the second. Between the two, surely yours is the most consistent from the point of view of fidelity; trying to guess what the level would be (or even assume that it would suffer changes) requires an abstraction that distances it from what it is, after all, no one can know for sure. Since it's like that... Rock on! I know your version of it will be good.

 

Man, we can't escape this wherever we go lol

 

Sonic is clearly white and gold.

 

These are old news, but I'm clearing out a lot of old sprites and I don't think I ever sent you these(I wasn't even sure you were still using the suits until I saw InfinityAlex's post on SonicUnited);



Espio, Amy and Sharps(lol)

Probably of no use to you, but I don't want them going to waste after I made Tails and Knuckles. Actually made a few others(Vector, Charmy, Mighty), but they aren't fantastic. :U