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Sonic 4: Episode 1 Discussion

Discussion in 'General Sonic Discussion' started by Cinossu, Oct 11, 2010.

  1. Chuck D Head

    Chuck D Head

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    <!--quoteo(post=517243:date=Oct 14 2010, 05:52 AM:name=Blue Blood)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Blue Blood @ Oct 14 2010, 05:52 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=517243">[​IMG]</a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->This is 2010, couldn't they have made him stand up straight and just hold his feet at a different angle?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    Then you would have everyone complaining about the "sprite" not rotating on slopes
     
  2. Yuzu

    Yuzu

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    <!--quoteo(post=517243:date=Oct 14 2010, 10:52 AM:name=Blue Blood)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Blue Blood @ Oct 14 2010, 10:52 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=517243">[​IMG]</a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I know speculation is banned, but did anyone else smile when <span style='color:#000000;background:#000000'>Sonic takes a rocket with Tails' emblem on it up to E.G.G Station</span>?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    Was it only a glitch on my game when Sonic ran into the cutscene BACKWARDS to continue to walk and jump onto the rocket BACKWARDS?

    I wish I recorded it. :(
     
  3. MykonosFan

    MykonosFan

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    <!--quoteo(post=517243:date=Oct 14 2010, 05:52 AM:name=Blue Blood)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Blue Blood @ Oct 14 2010, 05:52 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=517243">[​IMG]</a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I know speculation is banned, but did anyone else smile when <span style='color:#000000;background:#000000'>Sonic takes a rocket with Tails' emblem on it up to E.G.G Station</span>?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    I was surprised to find this goofy grin on my face when that happened. It was pretty cool.
     
  4. JaxTH

    JaxTH

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    GOOD FUCKING LORD I GOT THE 200/200!

    Now to just get all the rings in the ending to get my last avatar award...
     
  5. Funny enough, I was just about to time out when I paused and asked Retro. Thanks for the help, guys.

    Also, Jesus tap-dancing Christ those Special Stages annoy me. Not the idea themselves, just the execution. Moving the stages around Sonic (With a jump function that's entirely unnecessary) is a bitch. I'm up to Emerald 6.
     
  6. Quexinos

    Quexinos

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    Special stages 3 and 4 were the worst, but I had a hell of a time with 5 as well. I just don't think any of them can match my frustration that 4 gave me. .. actually now that I think about it my umteenth time losing at 5 made me hold the Wii-mote so hard (I was thinking of throwing it) that I accidentally hit the A button sending me to Egg station.

    Also I don't see why people are complaining about bottomless pits. There's about as many as there were in any other Sonic game. They're really far and few in between. In fact usually I'd think there WOULD be a bottomless bit and there was a whole new path waiting for me.

    As for online achievements and stuff... I don't think I'm that into the game, but I do have to wonder about this no hits one...

    <!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Platforming was a nightmare, that cannon sequence in CSZ was one of the most frustrating pieces of platforming I in recent memory, and I wasn't too big a fan of those vines in SHZ either, although some of that was also how the vines themselves worked.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    Really? The canons gave you trouble? And the vines?... I think maybe you shouldn't be playing this game if you can't figure those out. Especially since over half the canons tell you the exact direction you should shoot and the rest show you the way via rings.

    Not trying to start shit or anything but I'm surprised those canons would give anyone trouble. The only one that gave me a tiny bit of trouble was the one that had spikes above it, but if you follow the rings, you wouldn't even come close to them.
     
  7. Afti

    Afti

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    Actually, the jump has a use- it somewhat resets your momentum, making it easier to escape spring traps.

    Level design is better than I expected, but the physics really are godawful. You can't gain speed by rolling on a half-pipe! That defeats the entire point of the structure.

    One thing that impresses me is that there's a certain geometry to the levels- certain structures are novel, but others feel right, natural, inevitable. It's a difficult quality to capture, and I'm pleasantly surprised that they managed to do so.
     
  8. Dusk Golem

    Dusk Golem

    Where Fear and Cryptic Puzzles lie... Member
    If there's one thing that Sonic 4 and Colors gives me hope for in Sonic is that they're figuring out good level design again, at the very least. The stages in this game have what I like to call "Layers" to them, many different paths without it becoming confusing and then tons of secrets and even if they do the "One Gimmick Per Level" thing with the exception of Mad Gear Zone Act 3, the stages have nice variety and this is the first 2D Sonic game in ages I can say that allows players to play how they choose, either fast and speeding through or slower and go exploring around.

    Colors looks like it's getting level design down too, so if these two games give me hope in anything it's that they're finally figuring out good level design, something that's been missing from Sonic recently as I've complained about in the past.
     
  9. evilhamwizard

    evilhamwizard

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    <!--quoteo(post=517205:date=Oct 14 2010, 02:45 AM:name=Solaris Paradox)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Solaris Paradox @ Oct 14 2010, 02:45 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=517205">[​IMG]</a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Most of the boss is fairly easy to dodge, however, in my runs, Eggman has a nasty habit of doing that attack where he runs across the screen AND firing laser blasts at me at the same time. If there's a trick to dodging this, I haven't figured it out yet. I should mention that he never actually did that until I consciously attempted the Untouchable trophy. My own shitty luck, I suppose.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    Heh, I knew I had to be a little more detailed when I wrote my post. :P

    I know that there are ways of getting around at least the first 3 bosses (and supposedly there is a pattern for the Mad Gear one, ENLIGHTEN US PLEASE). But what made the 3rd one difficult for me was having a fast enough reaction when the pillars are moving to jump at the right spot and move towards Eggman. There are some patterns that are easy, but then there are some that fall victim to Sonic's initial movement when you jiggle the D-PAD/Joystick or whatever. Another thing that makes it difficult is something that I noticed many times when people were streaming videos of the boss - if you use a homing attack on any of the bosses, you bounce very far back. So if you make your hit while the pillars are still shifting, you can bounce off and get caught in the pillars. It's easily avoidable if you just stick to jumping on everything, but you'd want to use the homing attack because it's a lot more quicker and precise to hit your target. So you'd want to use it against everything. This is a big problem for me during the last boss fight when he shoots his arms out. If you use your homing attack from the direction Eggman is, you'll bounce right toward him and lose all your rings.

    The fourth does have a pattern from what I've noticed but I don't know what it exactly is. But I do know for sure that it starts with one normal Eggman tiny thing, and then has a chance of either throwing a blue quick Eggman thing or another normal one depending where Sonic is away from Eggman - I think anyway.

    But the biggest problem besides the ring physics is the fact that they made Eggman a very solid object. In all the other 2D Sonic games, you can move through Eggman with ease if you were invulnerable from getting hit. But Sonic 4 makes him very solid, so if you lose your rings while Eggman walks during the final boss, you can't easily squeeze around him to retrieve them. This also causes a problem for the second boss (Casino Street), where you have to be really dead on accurate when hitting Eggman to have it count as a hit. Otherwise, you just bounce right off him. I also seem to have a problem similar to this during the fourth battle where you can bounce off of Eggman if you actually hit him while he's prepping for another Egg thingy.

    Then of course we have Eggman taking his sweet ass time to become available for hitting. Not to mention that you can only hit him once or twice (if you're lucky) during the Lost Labyrinth boss, because the game won't allow you to hit him more than once even though you're right there next to him. gijswegheguiohseog

    I can go on and on about why it's difficult, but I think I said enough. But I guess I'll just have to keep trying (50th time is the charm!) until I get lucky...

    ps: I'm very sure the original 2D games made you lose a maximum of 20 rings, not 32...
     
  10. Dusk Golem

    Dusk Golem

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    It took me a while for me to figure it out, but Eggman always has one of a few strategies and you need to remember he only relies on 4 unchanging attacks. The boss has four hits.

    FIRST THING TO NOTE. Eggman during the first hit will only throw one object periodically, but for the other 3 hits he will throw two things and then not throw something for a few seconds, giving you an opening to attack him, and you better take it before he throws another two things.

    On the first hit the boss will either throw a normal bouncy Eggman at you or drop a spike ball. Just hold forward, don't jump dash, just run and if he (most likely) throws a normal bouncy Eggman it will miss you if you're just holding forward then after it goes over you, jump and home attack him for the first hit. If he drops a spike ball merely just jump over it and then jump again and home attack him.

    The second hit is a bit more tricky, he adds one more attack to his arsenal potentially, the speedy blue Eggmans. He's going to throw in any order either a normal bouncy Eggman, a blue speedy Eggman, or occasionally a spike ball. You can jump dash for speed, but the Blue Eggman is the same as normal bouncy Eggman but faster. simply run forward, when he throws either the normal or blue bouncy let go of forward and back-up a little and let the thing bounce in front of you and then over you, and do this for both of the things he throws (unless one is a spike ball, then jump over) and home attack him for the second hit.

    The third hit he adds giant Eggmans into the mix which is where things get tricky. He now has his four moves and you need to hit him twice. He can throw anything but something to remember with giant Eggmans: They always bounce the same way, one lands directly in front of him (there is no reason you should be this close anyways as he throws stuff there and you can jump and home attack him WAY before that) then he hits about a fourth of the way away from the left of the screen, then he hits the very back. IF you are in the middle you are completely safe from him and if you see him coming when you're a fourth of the way from the left of the screen then quickly jump dash ahead to avoid getting hit, and if in the back wait for him to bounce in front of you then quickly jump dash and hold right to evade him.

    EDIT: Also, it's been 32 rings dropped for a while. (not Sonic 1, I was mistaken)
     
  11. Jimmy Hedgehog

    Jimmy Hedgehog

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    Wait, you know how Hyper Sonic was able to breathe in water and had a jump dash? Well considering the Homing Attack, Sonic 4's Super pretty much IS what Hyper Sonic was...except less rainbow and worse physics
     
  12. DigitalDuck

    DigitalDuck

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    <!--quoteo(post=517270:date=Oct 14 2010, 01:14 PM:name=evilhamwizard)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (evilhamwizard @ Oct 14 2010, 01:14 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=517270">[​IMG]</a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->ps: I'm very sure the original 2D games made you lose a maximum of 20 rings, not 32...<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    [​IMG]

    Count them yourself.
     
  13. JaxTH

    JaxTH

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    I must be going mad but I swear I hear faint lyrics in Lost Labyrinth Zone Act 2's music. @[email protected]

    <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VM1HH46LemU" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VM1HH46LemU</a>

    Start listening around 13:57 (I wasn't paying attention to the time at other parts).
     
  14. evilhamwizard

    evilhamwizard

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    <!--quoteo(post=517292:date=Oct 14 2010, 10:38 AM:name=DigitalDuck)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (DigitalDuck @ Oct 14 2010, 10:38 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=517292">[​IMG]</a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=517270:date=Oct 14 2010, 01:14 PM:name=evilhamwizard)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (evilhamwizard @ Oct 14 2010, 01:14 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=517270">[​IMG]</a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->ps: I'm very sure the original 2D games made you lose a maximum of 20 rings, not 32...<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    [​IMG]

    Count them yourself.
    <!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    ...

    Weird.

    But anyway, thanks for the tips Dusk Golem. From a glance, it still seems that everything is still at random, but now that I think more about it I do see ways to take advantage of all four hits. I never get hit before the first strike, but before the second strike I never knew what to expect. But now I see that he adds one more thing to throw at you with each hit. Now the only problem is trying to dodge a normal egg thing and a blue egg thing that come at you at the same time. I keep hesitating to continue moving forward and fall back instead...where I get hit by both. I'm actually amazed you could even dodge the big egg thing.

    But one thing to remember though is that where the egg things land when he throws them at you are always the same depending on the type of egg.
     
  15. Dusk Golem

    Dusk Golem

    Where Fear and Cryptic Puzzles lie... Member
    <!--quoteo(post=517293:date=Oct 14 2010, 07:41 AM:name=JaxTH)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (JaxTH @ Oct 14 2010, 07:41 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=517293">[​IMG]</a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I must be going mad but I swear I hear faint lyrics in Lost Labyrinth Zone Act 2's music. @[email protected]

    <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VM1HH46LemU" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VM1HH46LemU</a>

    Start listening around 13:57 (I wasn't paying attention to the time at other parts).<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    I don't think it's voices as much as the Wind Flute-type instrument. Kinda; like how sometimes the wind can sound like voices and such I think you're hearing an effect of the instrument on whatever SEGA used to compose this.
     
  16. Vinchenz

    Vinchenz

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    <!--quoteo(post=517302:date=Oct 14 2010, 11:17 AM:name=evilhamwizard)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (evilhamwizard @ Oct 14 2010, 11:17 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=517302">[​IMG]</a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=517292:date=Oct 14 2010, 10:38 AM:name=DigitalDuck)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (DigitalDuck @ Oct 14 2010, 10:38 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=517292">[​IMG]</a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=517270:date=Oct 14 2010, 01:14 PM:name=evilhamwizard)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (evilhamwizard @ Oct 14 2010, 01:14 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=517270">[​IMG]</a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->ps: I'm very sure the original 2D games made you lose a maximum of 20 rings, not 32...<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    picture

    Count them yourself.
    <!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    ...

    Weird.
    <!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    If it's any consolation, the 3D games always had you drop 20 rings (sans Unleashed, since you could never pick up your rings in there).
     
  17. LockOnTommy11

    LockOnTommy11

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    Yeah, it's some sort of instrument, it does sound like a wind one. I can hear it on iTunes when I play the soundtrack (iTunes can enhance the audio).
     
  18. Diablohead

    Diablohead

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    <!--quoteo(post=517293:date=Oct 14 2010, 03:41 PM:name=JaxTH)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (JaxTH @ Oct 14 2010, 03:41 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=517293">[​IMG]</a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I must be going mad but I swear I hear faint lyrics in Lost Labyrinth Zone Act 2's music. @[email protected]

    <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VM1HH46LemU" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VM1HH46LemU</a>

    Start listening around 13:57 (I wasn't paying attention to the time at other parts).<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    Don't know what it is but a few times I have been playing that soundtrack with earphones on thinking someone was behind me talking, turning around to see no one.
     
  19. MykonosFan

    MykonosFan

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    /inb4 someone turns the song backwards and gets a satanic message in Japanese

    It gets kind of creepy listening to it home alone though.
     
  20. Megacherv

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    I quite like it. Stuck on the EGG Station last boss (when he goes beserk in the Egg-Robo), but everything else is almost top-notch. Only problems are the physics (although everyone who's played that probably noticed that). I quite like the homing attack, it makes it easier to kill those goddamn Orbinauts; and the Bubbles homing paths give it a good flow (like when there's a good bunch of them in the Mad Gear Zone connected with the gas-launchers) although it doesn't always behave itself.

    My verdict: pretty good, but doesn't bat Sonic 3 & Knuckles as my favourite.